I got a final fee today from the loan company, £4700 buys my car so my parents have agreed to give me a loan to pay it off. It means I will still pay the same monthly amount but in three years time the car is mine. It was currently on a hire purchase agreement. The great thing is this way I can pay a bit more each month and own it quicker, all at 0% APR.
At present I had another two years of paying it off, and then I would have needed to find £1700 for a lump sum to keep it. This way it takes three years but there is no lump sum.
My parents will just have to trust me not to do a runner in the car :D
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My Dad lent me money to buy my first car to save me going down the HP route. I will leave you to guess the year as the loan was £200.
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Sounds like a better way than the finance plus loan agreement. But for the age of car the total paid as you know will be high. Shame they didn't have the cash to lend you when you got the Panda.
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One of those things, I could have ran bangers for the past two years which may have cost me far more in repairs and extra insurance premiums than the high interest I have paid. Of course I already paid most the interest now :(.
Not sure what my car is worth in the real world, but the price guides place it as being worth more than the total settlement fee :).
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Aretas you don't say how old the car was, but if it was brand new I would guess early 1950's.
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Not knocking you Rattle - sort of the opposite. You want to keep the car so getting a price and paying it now instead of continuing costly finance payments and then still owing £1700. Result I'd say.
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It was a secondhand Mini 850 bought in the early 60s
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>> I got a final fee today from the loan company, £4700 buys my car so
>> my parents have agreed to give me a loan to pay it off.
Rattle, you're old enough now to cut the apron strings and stop sponging off your parents.
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>> Rattle, you're old enough now to cut the apron strings and stop sponging off your
>> parents.
I find that remark highly offensive. What business is it of yours to remark on Rattle's relationship with his parents?
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>> What business is it of yours to remark on Rattle's relationship with his parents? >>
If people feel it appropriate to disclose their personal and private affairs on t'internet, they expose themselves to comments about those affairs.
Personal and private matters, keep them personal and private and you won't get offensive comments.
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>> £4700 buys my car so my parents have agreed to give me a loan to pay it off. It means I will still pay the same monthly amount but in three years time the car is mine. >>
If you pay off the £4700 now, why do you still have to wait three years for the car to be yours?
If your parents are lending you £4700 interest free (you say all at 0% APR), how much is it costing them in lost income? It looks like man-maths at play here. As the saying goes, there is no such thing as a free lunch.
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>>If you pay off the £4700 now, why do you still have to wait three years for the car to be yours?>>
It would appear to be something to do with the hire purchase agreement - a vehicle is only yours on HP when you have finished the payments.
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I'm a bit surprised a 2 year old Panda in the UK is worth 4,700 quid. I can get a brand new old model Panda here in Germany (not the cheapest car market) for 6,200 Euros - about 5,400 quid. In fact I probably will get one.
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Up to the Rattle family finances, better to keep the interest money in the family than some thieving finance company's.
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>> >>If you pay off the £4700 now, why do you still have to wait three
>> years for the car to be yours?>>
>>
>> It would appear to be something to do with the hire purchase agreement - a
>> vehicle is only yours on HP when you have finished the payments.
>>
You've confused me even more than Rattle did.
rattle said
"£4700 buys my car" and
"my parents have agreed to give me a loan to pay it off." and
"I will still pay the same monthly amount but in three years time the car is mine." and
"At present I had another two years of paying it off," and
"This way it takes three years "
If he is he borrowing £4700 from his parents to pay it off now, what does he mean by having to pay monthly payments at 0% APR over the next three years?
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>>If he is he borrowing £4700 from his parents to pay it off now, what does he mean by having to pay monthly payments at 0% APR over the next three years?<<
I would think that his loan is now interest free, and he is repaying his parents over the next three years.
Give or take.
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>> I would think that his loan is now interest free, and he is repaying his
>> parents over the next three years.
>>
>> Give or take.
>>
Don't get it.
Is he saying that his parents are paying his monthly instalments for him?
Or is he taking a loan of £4700 from them, paying off his finance company (hence the car becomes his immediately), and then paying his parents a monthly sum over 3 years to for the money they have lent him?
Set out for me who is the owner, who is lending what to whom, who is paying what to whom, Keep it simple.
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Rattle is borrowing £4700 from his parents to repay the existing finance agreement. He will then repay his parents about £130pm for 36 months to repay them for the loan and they are not charging him interest.
The only reason Rattle says things like own it quicker is that he considers his parents 'owning' a big chunk of the car whilst he repays them.
Last edited by: rtj70 on Tue 3 Apr 12 at 11:10
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>> The only reason Rattle says things like own it quicker >>
He says it will take three years before he owns it.
What you are saying is that he will legally own it outright now but that in his mind "considers his parents 'owning' a big chunk of the car whilst he repays them."
Until Rattle posts what he really meant, it will reamin just guesswork on our part.
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I have given my parents lots of interest free loans in the past they are just returning the favour, the old Fiesta I bought that and they slowly paid it off over the years.
At the moment I have so many restrictions on the car, I cannot even legally sell it as it is not mine to sell, I would have to sell it back to FIAT at much less than it is worth.
There is also restrictions on how many miles I can do per year, its 6000 PA and then after that you have to pay x amount per mile extra if you want to hand the car back.
My parents are giving me an interest free loan, I will pay £130 a month and that money will go into a high interest (well as high as you can get now) until its paid off.
It gives me a lot more freedom too, as if I decide to get an office 9-5 job I may not even need the car and I could sell it. As for its value I reckon I could get £4k on the private market. The UK pandas are also higher spec that the European base spec ones.
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I think Rats just means the car will be paid for - from his point of view - in another three years. The finance company, of course, will consider it paid for as soon as it gets the £4,700.
As others have noted, paying interest on a depreciating asset is for mugs, so I'd the family money is available it makes sense to use it this way.
As for l'Es's 'apron strings' comment, yes, Rats makes himself fair game by sharing so much personal info here. But such comments make l'Es sound out of touch with the financial world that today's under-35s live in. Rats is far from unusual in depending more than he'd like on his parents.
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I bet a lot (probably be at least half) have in one way of another e.g from inheritance got a lot of money from their parents.
I think the modern generation have always been open about their finances, its a very different world from my grand parents generation when my granddad didn't tell my grandma how much he earned, he just gave her spends. Although she later got a good job of her own :).
And yes the car will legally be mine, legally there will be no finance attached to it, but I will owe my parents that money.
Last edited by: RattleandSmoke on Tue 3 Apr 12 at 11:39
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>>And yes the car will legally be mine, legally there will be no finance attached to it, but I will owe my parents that money.<<
Seems to be a very sensible arrangement.
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It does, and let's not forget that Rattle has been really good to his parents in the past and it must be nice for them to be in the position to return the favour.
Pat
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...and he doesn't give a tinkers cuss about the flak.
Top man.
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That's because he goes on Facebook and curses us all on there...:)
Sorry Rattle, didn't mean it!
Pat
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This reminds me of the mid-1970s when just after graduating I got a job and I needed a car. I suppose my Dad could have lent me the money, but instead he acted as a guarantor for a bank loan.
I bought a 1967 Ford Anglia and borrowed £150 repayable over 12 months. My salary was £2500 pa.
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Not much more than I paid for my first car 'Rattle' back in early 2007, a 1995 Fiesta 1.1 HCS paid £350 for it and used it as I needed access to a car, my dad had fallen of a ladder and was too injured to drive for months so I had to drive it on L plates with him in the car.
Probably not strictly legal thinking about it!
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>> ...and he doesn't give a tinkers cuss about the flak.
Nor me. Car4play members can click on the red circle on my posts to their heart's content!
;-)
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I was brought up to conform to the wisdom of Polonius who said .............
"Neither a borrower nor a lender be.
For a loan often loses both the loan and the friend,
And borrowing dulls the edge of the economy.
This above all, to your own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
You cannot then be false to any man."
From the age of eighteen onwards, if I've wanted something I've had to save up until I've had enough money to pay for it.
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Never had a mortgage then?
Borrowing can make a lot of sense, buying this Panda has saved me a lot of money over bangers even with the 11% APR. And if I didn't have a car I would struggle to make any money.
That said I have never borrowed money to pay for things like HIFI or cameras, that has always been with cash.
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>> Never had a mortgage then?
Borrowing to buy a house which, by and large, will not wear out and will possibly appreciate in value relative to salaries is a different kettle of fish from borrowing for something which is certain to wear out and certain to depreciate in value.
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So you are a borrower then L'es!
:)
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>> So you are a borrower then L'es!
>>
>> :)
>>
I didn't say that. But the subject of mortgages had been raised, so I was just giving my views on the difference between getting a mortgage and borrowing to buy a car. I spent the first few years after leaving home in a succession of digs, followed by rented furnished flats and then I bought my first property which was a two bedroomed maisonette. From then on it was onwards and upwards. Polonius had the right idea.
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>> From then on it was onwards and upwards.<<
tinyurl.com/co4hkwt
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>> Polonius had the right idea<<
He was a tedious old fool, according to Hamlet.
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But a car especially a Fiat Panda is a tool to get a job done. It may depreciate in value faster than a blonde from Big Brother but its a tool which allows me to work so gains me money :).
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We would still be in a feudal economy if we had taken Polonius's advice. Banking is what made the modern world possible
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>> We would still be in a feudal economy if we had taken Polonius's advice. Banking
>> is what made the modern world possible
>>
Banking is what made the modern world's current financial troubles possible. :)
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True but there would be no modern world without it.
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>> From the age of eighteen onwards, if I've wanted something I've had to save up until I've had enough money to pay for it.
Yes, but Gastropod, the Sheikh has explained in some detail that his financial relations with his parents are complex and in the past have been to the advantage of his parents. Evidently they are a close family who trust one another. That does make your sponging accusation look a bit disobliging.
"Neither a borrower nor a lender be... ', my old man often sententiously quoted to me. He was right of course. But he often lent me money too, even when I hadn't asked for it, the old darling.
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>> ...and he doesn't give a tinkers cuss about the flak.
>>
>> Top man.
+1
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>> Top man.
>> +1
Yes, the Sheikh is admirably unflappable when teased, like someone who went to one of the better public schools.
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>> And yes the car will legally be mine, legally there will be no finance attached to it, but I will owe my parents that money. >>
Thanks for clearing that up. it was your mention of owning it in 3 years time that caused my confusion.
>> I bet a lot (probably be at least half) have in one way of another e.g from inheritance got a lot of money from their parents. >>
Whether Rattle gets a loan from his family, or whether they gift it to him, should not be of concern to any of us.
But anyone posting on an open forum must expect to get comments in return - good, bad, offensive or whatever.
I believe that if you bring a child in to this world, it is then your duty to do your utmost - the best you can - for your offspring throughout your life, whatever age or good/bad circumstances (financial or otherwise) that child may be faced with.
Last edited by: John H on Tue 3 Apr 12 at 12:29
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>>There is also restrictions on how many miles I can do per year, its 6000 PA and then after that
>>you have to pay x amount per mile extra if you want to hand the car back.
Wow, you doing 6000 miles p.a. now?
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Probably touching on it, will have probably done around 5500 in the past year from April to April but been doing around 100 miles per week for the past 6 months so still under it but that figure is rising. In reality I have only done 8350 miles so even if I did 7k a year for the next two years it will still be under the 24,000 mile limit but there isn't that much leeway.
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Best trick would be to keep on putting away the amount you'll be paying your parents every month even after the debt is cleared. Keep the car for as long as it remains suitable and reliable and eventually you'll have a good little stash to buy your next car without having to finance it.
The best advice I think I was ever given by my father from when I had my first paper round was to save into a really separate "forget about it" account at least 10% of whatever I earned no matter how much or how little that was or however much it hurt to do so. To this day I've done that and have therefore always had a rainy day fund. Had some nice motors/holidays etc ( even a Westfield, did I ever mention my Westfield? ) over the years from that pot without having to borrow to fund them. Even been able to knock chunks off mortgages from that occassionally. Surprising how it builds up if you set up a standing order type thing and ignore it for long enough.
:-)
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...at least 10% of whatever I earned...
That's the definition of a Scottish Mormon - gives 10% of what he earns to...himself. :)
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>> I believe that if you bring a child in to this world, it is then
>> your duty to do your utmost - the best you can - for your offspring
>> throughout your life, whatever age or good/bad circumstances (financial or otherwise) that child may be
>> faced with.
>>
Mrs B's Auntie has always had the philosophy of helping her son financially every time he gets out of nick. So far she has funded a large proportion of his drug addiction.
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>> Mrs B's Auntie has always had the philosophy of helping her son financially every time
>> he gets out of nick. So far she has funded a large proportion of his
>> drug addiction.
>>
You reap what you sow.
The poor son had no choice in being born.
The mother had the choice in how to bring him up.
Double whammy for the son, being brought in to the world and then failed by poor parenting.
Triple whammy for the world which now has to look after this failure of a human being, and pay for his stay in prison.
Poor little blighter and pity the poor mum. My heart goes out to them.
Not.
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>>The mother had the choice in how to bring him up.
Double whammy for the son, being brought in to the world and then failed by poor parenting<<
I reckon you're out of order there John me old son - I know parents that have brought their children up in exemplary fashion, but they've still gorn 'off the rails', parents can't be 'behind' their children all the time.
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>> parents that have brought their children up in exemplary fashion, but they've still gorn 'off the rails', parents can't be 'behind' their children all the time.
Yes. Indeed too much anxiety and protection from parents can be counter-productive with the child adopting kamikaze attitudes in the attempt to break free.
But even with the best of intentions and the best of behaviour, some individuals manage to be bad apples or something very like them. And there are these bizarre accidents, moments of madness that turn really nasty instead of just passing and being forgotten. A lottery up to a point, the human comedy.
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>> Poor little blighter and pity the poor mum. My heart goes out to them.
>>
>> Not.
>>
>>
John - to a degree I agree with you - I am only acquainted with them via Mrs B so have little regard for them either way, however the sibling is only 18 months older and has been married for some time, nice house, hard worker etc etc so can it all be down to the upbringing?
I always used to blame the parents until I became one.
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>> But such comments make l'Es sound out of touch with the
>> financial world that today's under-35s live in.
If you're trying to suggest that times are harder now than when I was an under-35 then just let me put you straight.
My parents house was a 1900s terraced house, with walls which on reflection had no cavity, and with single glazed windows which froze up on the inside during winter. There was lino on the floors and a single pegged rug in the living room and in each of the bedrooms. The only form of heating was a coal fire in the living room. The only form of entertainment was one wireless set. They never ever had a car. That was my living standard up to the point at which I left home immediately after I finished at university.
Last edited by: L'escargot on Tue 3 Apr 12 at 17:19
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This is all double Dutch to me vey confusing..>:)
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>> >> But such comments make l'Es sound out of touch with the
>> >> financial world that today's under-35s live in.
>>
>> If you're trying to suggest that times are harder now than when I was an
>> under-35 then just let me put you straight.
>>
>> My parents house was a 1900s terraced house, with walls which on reflection had no
>> cavity, and with single glazed windows which froze up on the inside during winter. There
>> was lino on the floors and a single pegged rug in the living room and
>> in each of the bedrooms. The only form of heating was a coal fire in
>> the living room. The only form of entertainment was one wireless set. They never ever
>> had a car. That was my living standard up to the point at which I
>> left home immediately after I finished at university.
we have all been there, your experience is not unusual for anyone over 50.
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Any of the other three Yorkshiremrn care to comment?
}:---)
L'es, you've told us times were hard for your parents. You went to university:
- How were your studies funded?
- What was your debt when you graduated?
- What percentage of people your age went to university?
- What was your earning power relative to others your age?
Today's graduates often find their degrees were expensive to gain but worth very little in a tough jobs market. Those (including me - now 44) who got through university without debt and before the debasement of the currency with ex-Poly degrees have much to be grateful for.
Last edited by: Webmaster on Tue 3 Apr 12 at 18:00
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Nice use of the unordered list. I kind of assumed that tag wouldn't work but clearly it does.
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>> Nice use of the unordered list. I kind of assumed that tag wouldn't work but
>> clearly it does.
...although it's resulted in the 'Reply to this message | Report message' links appearing in a white box within the message text box for me :)
(I've mentioned it to the mods in case they're interested; I'm using Firefox.)
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>> (I've mentioned it to the mods in case they're interested; I'm using Firefox.)
They've sorted it (something was missing).
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Yes, my fault - I was in a hurry and forgot to terminate the list.
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>> You went to university:
>> - How were your studies funded?
Local authority grant.
>> - What was your debt when you graduated?
Nothing. I worked during the Christmas and summer holidays and on occasions I sold some of my belongings to secondhand shops to raise cash. And none of this gap year laziness. I had no car and either used public transport or walked. I received no financial assistance from my parents because they couldn't afford to. Whilst at university I allowed myself one half day of leisure each week. Evenings, Saturdays and Sundays were spent studying so as to repay my moral debt to the local authority that gave me the grant.
>> - What percentage of people your age went to university?
I don't know.
>> - What was your earning power relative to others your age?
Probably higher, but I had to spread my wings and leave home immediately after graduating and take a job 80 miles away to achieve that.
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Ours were always the size of a cut open hessian corn sack.
Pat
Last edited by: pda on Tue 3 Apr 12 at 17:38
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Rugs?
Luxury.
Hard floors in the farmhouse, no central heating, no insulation or draught exclusion, single glazing, toilet bowl froze regularly in winter....
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My grandfather had a outside large bucket toilet,the buckets where collected once a week by horse and cart.Backside cleaned with newspaper ouch.Times where hard.>:) He also chewed tobacco.
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I grow up in 1900's terraced house with no cavity walls, central heating or double glazing. Although we have had heating for my most of my life. Certainly double glazing is something I have only had in my room for the past few years.
Lets not go into that times were harder in my day lark because that is a debate for another thread :D.
Certainly some things are much harder, my dad for example mucked up his A levels, did a two year course at a poly, got a job as a librarian and got automatic promotion to senior librarian within a few years. To become a librarian now you need a masters degree.
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15% mortgage anyone? You youngsters have it easy, no I-thingy is considered to be poverty. :-)
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>> 15% mortgage anyone? You youngsters have it easy, no I-thingy is considered to be poverty.
>> :-)
>>
Makes me poor then :)
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i remember having to pay that 15percent mortgage. it still hurts now remembering how quickly it went to 15percent
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...it still hurts now remembering how quickly it went to 15percent...
Wasn't that fatty Lawson taking on the currency speculators?
He lost.
So did I, not as much, but it was still a large kick in the financial nadgers for me.
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Badger Lamont v George Soros. Soros won.
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Ah, Lamont was it?
Not a period I wish to remember with any clarity.
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>> Ah, Lamont was it?
>>
>> Not a period I wish to remember with any clarity.
I remember that day with the utmost clarity. My mortgage rate went from tough, to very tough, to poverty to evicted in the space of one day, fortunately it went back down to poverty.
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>> I remember that day with the utmost clarity. My mortgage rate went from tough, to
>> very tough, to poverty to evicted in the space of one day, fortunately it went
>> back down to poverty.
Yes, squeezed together every penny for a deposit, downsized the car and bought my first house with the mortgage rate at 10%, convinced it was already so high it could only go down. Wow, was I wrong.
Within a year it was at 15.5% and the monthly interest payments alone took around 75% of my net pay. On top of that, rates, water rates, leccy, petrol, food and the rest. I'd already taken in lodgers to afford the mortgage in the first place and had zero savings as I'd blown everything on the deposit.
I was saved from eviction by changing jobs and getting a secondment abroad which helped me keep up the mortgage payments. Not the last economic crisis in my life but these things help to focus the mind.
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"I remember that day with the utmost clarity. My mortgage rate went from tough, to very tough, to poverty to evicted in the space of one day, fortunately it went back down to poverty."
Same here. By late afternoon that day simple poverty seemed such a great result.
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>> I've made a peg rug.
>>
>> Pat
>>
Is that a "Southern" version of a Proggy Mat?
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Is that a rag rug?
I'm only asking. Rugs are often awful with burns from spitting embers and old food and drink spills in them, whether cowskin, rag rug or priceless Bokhara prayer mat. Best kept away from fireplaces and people's feet if you ask me.
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You got to watch those carpet burns can do some harm if not carefull !
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My parents were very lucky in that they were too scared to take out a variable rate mortgage preferring for the fix rate option.
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Fortunately I had forgotten about those high mortgage rates. My first house, a nice semi in Bradford, cost me £17,950, and it took me 5 years of saving, aged 17/22 to get the deposit. I had to get a lodger to help pay the gas, elec, rates etc but they were very happy days despite all the furniture & carpets being third hand and cast offs.
I wouldn't swap with todays generation trying to get on the housing ladder, although they would not put up with those conditions.
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>> .......... although they
>> would not put up with those conditions.
>>
And that's exactly where they're going wrong.
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Refinancing my car - Aretas
