Last year I was expecting to replace my original battery on the Golf TDi which has lasted 7 years since new. In the very cold mornings it gave me a couple of frights when it just managed to turn the engine over before starting, I was all ready to buy a new one and then the weather changed and the problem went away. So another year has passed and I realise I might not be as lucky this time so I planned to buy the battery and store it ready for when the old one finally gives up.
The new battery will be a sealed calcium one which I guess will come with a partial charge in it, so my question is where is the best place to store it? To keep it good condition should I keep out of the way in the house or would it be OK in my frost free garage?
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No logic in this. Your current battery has lasted 7yrs and not failed yet. So just put the new one on the car and enjoy another 7yrs plus. No benefit to storing the new one in the garage with all the faff of swapping on a freezing cold morning when you're in a rush!
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Indeed. Worth keeping the old battery somewhere warm and occasionally charging (perhaps every 12 months) so that it is a good back-up if you wake up to a flat battery.
A battery that is a bit dodgy at freezing will be good at room temperature.
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Why would you store the new battery instead of using it?
It's more use in the car than deteriorating and useless in a cupboard.
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Buy and fit the new battery.
Dump the old one. As Fen says, no logic in doing anything else.
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I'm unanimous, as Mrs Slocombe liked to say.
Peace of mind is knowing it will start, not knowing you have a spare battery to fit with numb fingers in freezing sleet when you should be on your way.
And how do you know it will conk out at home? Batteries fail very quickly these days. My son's car started on a freezing day last winter, and was dead as a doornail by 6pm when he wanted to go home.
Last edited by: Manatee on Sat 23 Nov 13 at 10:56
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You've been lucky. Treat it as a warning message, saying "Replace your battery immediately!"
Modern batteries fail suddenly, invariably when least convenient.
Old batteries were bigger, better made, with larger plates, cells individually accessible, and they would soldier on for years because they had a big reserve capacity.
Modern ones are compact, with little reserve, and work on the basis of high output and rapid recharge.
A few weeks ago I noticed mine was a little bit more sluggish turning over. Without hesitation I binned it, having been caught out before trying to get a few more months life out of a battery.
If you really must follow your route, then at least keep the new one in the boot ready charged. It won't do much good being cosseted in your garage when you are broken down 20 miles away.
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I change my battery every five years, regardless of how well it's performing.
Pointless waiting until it dies at traffic lights on a very busy junction, as happened to Mrs CS some years ago.
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I change my batteries when they go dud.
A4: 4 years
Yaris d4d - 10 years
Yaris 1.0 petrol - 11 years.. (just changed)..
Oh surprise! Japanese cars have longer lasting batteries ! Well I never...
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I've never had to change a battery. Must be luck of the draw I guess.
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Maybe my wife's Ford Focus was made in Japan then; delivered in Sept 2002, it's still on its original battery. Touches wood ;-)
My Astra diesel is coming upto 7 years on its first battery.
My old Mondeo's first battery lasted 9 years; why throw money away by electively changing them at <5 years?
Last edited by: Haywain on Sat 23 Nov 13 at 12:44
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>> why throw money away by electively changing them at <5 years?
The original battery in my Focus lasted 11 years despite only doing 40,000 miles in that time. And still didn't let me down as I replaced it when it started getting a bit sluggish and the voltage was down.
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"………. and the voltage was down."
My wife's Focus has done just over 102k miles; nowadays, it only does about 7k a year, but is driven regularly on a 30 mile round trip to work. On this car, the battery has also to cope with the heated Quickclear windscreen and heated seats.
Come to think of it ……. maybe now it doesn't quite start with the same gusto and the battery is on its way south. A morning failure wouldn't be a total disaster as my Astra is normally available as a stand-by.
Can I ask for some advice, please?….. Do you just test the battery with a bog-standard multimeter? Do you have to disconnect the terminals? Is it best to test the battery after the car has stood for a period e.g.overnight? What sort of readings should I expect if the battery is dodgy/good?
Many thanks.
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I had a chat with another friend today (I have two) - he reckoned putting the battery on a (in my case) a CanBus compliant Optimate to diagnose any issue, which means disconnecting the battery because of all the other feeds it has.....too much effort and too much scope for error.
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Like a lot of things automotive, use it or lose it.
Cars respond to a regular jolly good thrashing.
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>> Like a lot of things automotive, use it or lose it.
>>
>> Cars respond to a regular jolly good thrashing.
>>
Concur, the best tune up you can get these days. Get it hot, blow all the crap out of its systems and get its juices flowing freely. Most drivers only use a fraction of their engines power. A long uphill motorway slip road is an ideal venue.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Sat 23 Nov 13 at 17:54
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>> A long uphill motorway slip road is an
>> ideal venue.
>>
May I recommend the clockwise exit at junction 9 on the M25? This is the longest motorway slip road in the UK.
"Retreats behind sofa and awaits return fire"
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>> Can I ask for some advice, please?….. Do you just test the battery with a
>> bog-standard multimeter? Do you have to disconnect the terminals? Is it best to test the
>> battery after the car has stood for a period e.g.overnight? What sort of readings should
>> I expect if the battery is dodgy/good?
>>
>> Many thanks.
Multimeter on the terminals while still connected is fine as long as there's no material drain - check there are no courtesy lights on.
Yes it should be "rested", not checked just after switch off. I don't know how long, but I'd guess an hour would be enough. You can always check a bit later and see if it's changed.
From memory, a full charged lead acid battery reads about 12.6V
If you have another vehicle with the same battery type you can compare which will also give you a relative check.
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Manatee has answered your questions but here are the readings I had back in 2010 when I changed my battery.
www.car4play.com/forum/post/index.htm?t=1655&m=30378&v=e
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Remember most modern cars have on board diagnostics - Our Fiesta, using dashboard cheats can give real-time battery information. Ours is charging well and has a good static charge. Just need to find some for the BMW now !
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I found the dashboard diagnostic for mine, it's surprising what depth it goes into. Fuel tank sensors, battery charging, air con plus loads of other stuff.
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I've just found the E90 ones on YouTube and it does cover battery problems....have a look tomorrow.
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Best way to test a battery is with one of these: tinyurl.com/nmqnstd (eBay)
I used to use one when I was 'on the road' ... an arf decent garage should have one.
Voltmeter wont tell you much, apart from the state of charge.
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Thanks for all the replies relating to this question; I'll have a look with the multimeter, bearing in mind that this is unlikely to tell the whole story.
I was unaware of the importance of silver/calcium batteries for Fords and, on checking, I saw this was specified in the original manual. I note that 'Euro car parts' is doing a Bosch S4 silver [063] (guaranteed 4 years) for £40.76 which sounds pretty good to me; I assume that the 'silver' on the label infers that the battery is a silver/calcium type. As Euro car parts have a branch about 200 yards away, maybe I should get one now before the old one fails. Perhaps I should hand it to Mrs H for her Christmas present!
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>> I should get one now before the old one fails. Perhaps I should hand it
>> to Mrs H for her Christmas present!
Buy her a matching set of new spanners to fit it.....
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The R80GS has a proper BMW/VDO voltmeter....it tells me as much as I need to know that the charging system is working fine. I do wish the original owner had opted for a rev counter though.
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>> I do wish the original owner had opted for a rev counter though.
Do bikes have the equivalent of OBD II?
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Yes, but not this one...the only software is the seat.
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"Buy her a matching set of new spanners to fit it….."
She'll have to borrow mine until her birthday …….
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>> I change my battery every five years, regardless of how well it's performing.
>>
>> Pointless waiting until it dies at traffic lights on a very busy junction, as happened
>> to Mrs CS some years ago.
>>
In conversation about batteries with a guy from upstate New York , he was bemused by Brits worrying about batteries.
He said they had no problems and always changed batteries when two years old.
I guess, in his home area, it could easily be life threatening in the winter.
I guess my battery is the original, still working and now six years old.
Decisions, decisions!
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>> I change my battery every five years, regardless of how well it's performing.
Don't ever buy a Hybrid, you will be in a state of permanent apoplexy
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>> Don't ever buy a Hybrid, you will be in a state of permanent apoplexy
>>
Humbug...
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>> I change my battery every five years, regardless of how well it's performing.
>> Pointless waiting until it dies at traffic lights on a very busy junction, as happened
>> to Mrs CS some years ago.
>>
So much for that. My battery died a sudden and inconvenient death this morning at the ripe old age of 2 years and 9 months. Fortunately it was covered by a 3 year guarantee and was exchanged by Halfords without so much as a quibble.
Time to rethink my strategy.
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"Fortunately it was covered by a 3 year guarantee and was exchanged by Halfords without so much as a quibble."
Good job you'd kept your receipt!
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>> >> I change my battery every five years, regardless of how well it's performing.
>> >> Pointless waiting until it dies at traffic lights on a very busy junction, as
>> happened
>> >> to Mrs CS some years ago.
>> >>
>>
>> So much for that. My battery died a sudden and inconvenient death this morning at
>> the ripe old age of 2 years and 9 months. Fortunately it was covered by
>> a 3 year guarantee and was exchanged by Halfords without so much as a quibble.
>>
>> Time to rethink my strategy.
Oh good lord! for someone with BCD (battery compulsive disorder) life must have suddenly got a whole load more worrisome.
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>> Oh good lord! for someone with BCD (battery compulsive disorder) life must have suddenly got a whole load more worrisome.
It's not quite that bad really, but I am thinking of starting a petition for the return of the crank handle, as I had no such problems with the hugely reliable sit-up-and-beg Ford Prefect that I owned several decades ago.
Watch this space...
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>> You've been lucky. Treat it as a warning message, saying "Replace your battery immediately!"
>>
>> Modern batteries fail suddenly, invariably when least convenient.
>> Old batteries were bigger, better made, with larger plates, cells individually accessible, and they would
>> soldier on for years because they had a big reserve capacity.
>> Modern ones are compact, with little reserve, and work on the basis of high output
>> and rapid recharge.
>>
>> A few weeks ago I noticed mine was a little bit more sluggish turning over.
>> Without hesitation I binned it, having been caught out before trying to get a few
>> more months life out of a battery.
>>
>> If you really must follow your route, then at least keep the new one in
>> the boot ready charged. It won't do much good being cosseted in your garage when
>> you are broken down 20 miles away.
>>
By one of those strange quirks of faith, fifteen minutes after my post above, the phone rang and Mrs O'Reliant was on the other end telling me her Corsa wouldn't start. A three mile run out with a set of jump leads and I got her moving, my initial thoughts of "I bet it's the battery" proving correct. A few weeks ago I did mention that her car was turning over a bit sluggishly then forgot about it, as you do.
So there went my Saturday, happily wondering what part of nothing to do next. Spending £56.95 hadn't figured in the plans.
Last edited by: Robin O'Reliant on Sat 23 Nov 13 at 13:19
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How many miles does your Golf cover in the course of a day/week?
My 07 Subaru has the original battery fitted and I've noticed it struggling a few times first thing in the morning.
I trickle-charge the critter at about 1-2 amps on a regular basis and that seems to have given it a new lease of life.
0° at 7am this morning, covered in frost, started up okay though.
I think it's good policy to trickle-charge the battery on a regular basis at this time of the year,
especially if you have heated everything ... and use 'em.
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The 3 Series - now five years old has become a tad sluggish to start on cold mornings...it's booked in. Our IT man in work reckons the battery is on the way out. It doesn't surprise me - a car that did only 20k in the first four years of its life can't have treated the battery well...so may have to bite the bullet.
My luck if i followed the OP's logic would be that the battery would fail just far enough from the house to make it impossible to collect the original.....
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Dog I do about 25 miles per day for work but it can be double that if asked to be a taxi for the kids! I did think about giving it one good charge before I made the change but I think I'll go with the advice of the panel and order the new one tonight and fit it when it arrives.
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I was going to say the same,7 years is a good innings out of your old battery.Fit the new one.
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>> think I'll go with the advice of the panel and order the new one tonight and fit it when it arrives.
Wise man ;-)
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Battery was going down on our C4 Picasso last year (bit sluggish to crank, and occasional handbrake warning after start), so I fitted a new one, moving the old one to the Xantia. It has been fine on the Xantia since, but then that typically gets one start, then 30 mile run twice a day, so is an easy duty cycle! Battery put on the Picasso was a "Starting Bull" !!
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Battery on the Naughty Note failed overnight a couple of years ago. Wondered why the blipper didn't open the car. No problem.....use the key and jump start it. hang on, no keyholes ! Rang the dealers and was told if I slid back the cover on the nearside door handle there would be a keyhole there...great !
Problem...I'd, for once, parked down the drive and the nearside was about 6 inches from a six foot fence. Think again. By good chance, neighbour was home so I went with him to the back garden and we lifted the panel out. Found the keyhole and unlocked the car. Still could only open the door a few inches due to the concrete base panel..Bah !
Electric windows, no joy there. Bonnet pull on offside...Bah again. Devised a pole with a hook on the end and fed it through the door gap to pull the drivers door handle....success.
Opened bonnet...booster on and moved the car away from the fence. Completed civil engineering project on the fence and went to buy a new battery.
Seemples.
Ted
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Just checked my battery voltage = 12.4v
Put it on charge via my smart battery charger and it started charging at 2.2 amps.
Soon reduced to just 1 amp and was deemed fully charged within 15 mins.
Voltage now = 13.8v
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In the synchronicity that is life, stopped of at Halfords to get some new bulbs for the Fiesta. Parked next to an older 306 - as I walked back to the car, the driver asked me if I could help him jump start the Pug. He had leads, he was complaining that Halfords wanted a £100.00 for a new one and that he would try to get a cheaper one as he couldn't afford that. Asked me some basic questions about re-charging it. The date stamp revealed the battery was nearly 10 years old.....it's done quite well.
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A lead acid battery for my Subaru from Halfords is 85 knicker.
An Exide jobbie from www.exidecarbatteries.co.uk/index.php/ is 75 squid.
Cold cranking performance of the Halfords battery is 450 amps and is rated at 60AH
Cold cranking performance of the Exide battery is 580 amps and is rated at 65AH
:}
Last edited by: Dog on Sun 24 Nov 13 at 14:07
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>> A lead acid battery for my Subaru from Halfords is 85 knicker.
>>
>> An Exide jobbie from www.exidecarbatteries.co.uk/index.php/ is 75 squid.
>>
>> Cold cranking performance of the Halfords battery is 450 amps and is rated at 60AH
>>
>> Cold cranking performance of the Exide battery is 580 amps and is rated at 65AH
>>
>> :}
Sounds like you need a trade card, or if not try euro car parts they have a sale on now.
Last edited by: sooty123 on Sun 24 Nov 13 at 14:10
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>> Sounds like you need a trade card, or if not try euro car parts they have a sale on now.
I mentioned on the bargains thread about being given a 25% discount code from Euro Car Parts for giving them a good review on some review site I received an email from.
Well, I tried to use that code (REVIEW25) to buy a battery, but the code was invalid :)
Orf to play with my Anthracite now :(
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Look on car parts 4less same company but have a discount added all the time. Only downside is no pick up available.
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>>Look on car parts 4less
= Bosch S4 @ £65 ;)
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>>Orf to play with my Anthracite now :(
Jobs a good'n: img542.imageshack.us/img542/1243/cdpm.jpg
:}
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"……...stopped of at Halfords"
Yes - I know it's only 12 volts. but I was quite shocked by Halford's prices! (geddit?)
Hence my interest in EuroCarParts.
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They're charging too much
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Battery on my low rent boy racer Astra on the blink methinks, just about started after a week sitting at Southampton Airport :-/ Given it's a pukka Vauxhall battery it's probably the ten year old original so not a bad innings. Looks like about 45 quid from Eurocarparts delivered for an Exide 55AH/520CCA one so not too bad.
That's almost 100 quid I've had to spend on this car in the last 26K miles / 18 months ! ;-)
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>>Battery on my low rent boy racer Astra
Where would you like the comma?
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>> >>Battery on my low rent boy racer Astra
>>
>> Where would you like the comma?
>>
:-) :-)
I'd better be careful with my colon as well. Should've just typed SXi :-)
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Remember when changing batteries things like radio codes, make sure ignition is turned off (could cause engine management light to come on), if it was me i'd carefully connect a slave battery using jumper leads so tha the car never "downpowers"
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>> Remember when changing batteries things like radio codes, make sure ignition is turned off (could
>> cause engine management light to come on), if it was me i'd carefully connect a
>> slave battery using jumper leads so tha the car never "downpowers"
>>
Wish I'd remembered that this morning. SWMBO's latest Zaffy refused to start. Looks like a nearly new battery and spinning over fine, so thought cambelt had gone. Lifted bonnet and fan going despite stone cold engine. Keys back in ignition and notice that ECU light pulses briefly when keys first inserted and ESP light is on.
oh dear.
Decide to 'reboot' ECU by disconnecting battery for a few secs (remembering that this has to be done within 10 secs. of removing ignition keys or alarm goes off!) Voila car starts fine and fan is off.
..now the radio is in 'safe' mode..I have the code but the darned radio won't go into code entry mode :-((. Swap radio for one of my spares and all is well - until it happens again at least :-/
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All this talk of battery longevity and 'replacing as a routine' got me thinking that maybe we were pushing our luck with the aforementioned Mrs H's 11+ yr old Focus battery.
Looking around on the web, EurocarParts were able to supply an appropriate Bosch S4 (4 yr guarantee) for £40.76; this was conveniently 'clicked and collected' from their depot about 400 yds away. I had to e-mail their technical helpline to get confirmation that the battery was 'Calcium' as specified in the Ford handbook - I don't know why Bosch don't mention that on their specifications for the battery.
Anyway, I thought £40.76 was a decent price for a new battery, though looking at the ECParts website today, it seems to have crept up to £42.00.
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When I bought the Alfa during a very cold week last Dec the battery looked like it might be marginal at low temperatures. During the initial service I found it was low on electrolyte with the plate tops exposed in most cells. Topped it up, cleaned the terminals and gave it a long top-up charge.... it's been fine since.
First sign of a sluggish turnover and I will replace though.
On the 156 you have to remove the positive terminal with its multi connector block, the turbo hose and battery strap to get the filler top off. Perhaps understandable why, despite full service history, the garages hadn't bothered.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Wed 27 Nov 13 at 11:52
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>> First sign of a sluggish turnover and I will replace though.
Do you actually get any 'first signs' on modern cars? Older cars - yes, but more recently (in my experience) it's more a case of the battery being full of life one minute, and flat as a pancake the next.
Hence my renewal every five years.
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>> Do you actually get any 'first signs' on modern cars? Older cars - yes, but
>> more recently (in my experience) it's more a case of the battery being full of
>> life one minute, and flat as a pancake the next.
Especially true of diesels. Sensible to replace after 5 years but I just wait for it to fail, and call the AA for a start when it does.
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>> Sensible to replace after 5 years but I just wait for
>> it to fail, and call the AA for a start when it does.
Now, why didn't I think of that...
But, of course, batteries don't always let us down in the most convenient places.
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>> But, of course, batteries don't always let us down in the most convenient places.
True but I'm a gambler by nature and its odds on the battery will fail one morning with the car on the driveway . Worked for me so far.
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>>
>> >> But, of course, batteries don't always let us down in the most convenient places.
>>
>> True but I'm a gambler by nature and its odds on the battery will fail
>> one morning with the car on the driveway . Worked for me so far.
>>
I've only changed one battery and that conked outside my house. I'd say it's the most common place to fail.
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I'm not sure, the battery on mine I thought was gone. It's the original and is 10 years old. It needed a jump start to get it going. Planned in replacing it, never got round to it. Still all fine over a year later.
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>>>Do you actually get any 'first signs' on modern cars?
Not sure if my 2003 car is older or modern by your judgement but the sign of problems last Dec before I found it was low on electrolyte was a sluggish turnover below freezing.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Wed 27 Nov 13 at 13:56
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>> Not sure if my 2003 car is older or modern by your judgement but the
>> sign of problems last Dec before I found it was low on electrolyte was a
>> sluggish turnover below freezing.
A car that I bought around 1980, and ran for a decade and a half, would give ample signs of sluggishness to warn that a replacement battery was due. Cars that I have owned since, have not.
I would consider your 2003 model to be in the second category.
(Anticipates icy blast from the south east)
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I'm still waiting for my delivery of slightly used batteries.
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Oh deer, this did not happen in the old days.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshire-25119194
www.garsons.co.uk/garden-centre/christmas/come-and-visit-santas-real-reindeer/
"These magical creatures are here today and will stay at Garsons until 1pm on 24th December, when Santa will need them back!"
A nice bit of info for the wee ones :-)
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One more quick question, should I take the time to fully charge my new battery before fitting it or is it ok to fit the battery to the car and let the alternator do the work?
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They are usually supplied charged these days.
Can't give you an authoritative technical answer, but the last one I did I just bunged on and it started fine. I think we gave it a run round for 15 minutes to make sure there was plenty left in, but it spun over fast enough.
Last edited by: Manatee on Tue 3 Dec 13 at 13:45
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Eh, somebuddy mentioned sutton auto factors on a fred recently and I see they do an arf decent battery (Yuasa)
I've been a'thinking about replacing my 7 year old Panasonic OE battery all winter and eh, being that we're now into spring I thought I'd do it.
54 squid for a Silver 65ah jobbie - delivered! .. 99 squids in Howlfords!!
Um, Sutton auto factors are in the shire of Nottingham and not in Slurrey like wot I ass-umed
www.suttonautofactors.co.uk/
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A Yuasa in our Golf TDi lasted 3 years. Failed just outside warranty.
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Wozzit a Silver battery vić ... its guaranteed for 5 years anyway, and it or I will be gorn by then ;)
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Battery care - Fenlander
