Remember this?
"Someone hit my car a fortnight ago and today I got It back from the VW repairers looking great with new front wing, headlight assembly, front bumper apron, three new tyres and new N/S alloy wheels and a few hidden things."
Well a few miles driven now and it's obvious that the impact has given rise to some mechanical problems of the rotational sort. From about 35mph upwards I get a lot of road noise or rather a humming, heterodyning noise which is especially noticeable on very smooth roads.
I am worried now that the car's impact with the kerb resulting in flat tyres and badly damaged Alloys has transferred damage to other parts on the 'axles' or bearings etc. The repairers have told me they have checked all alignments etc but there is something wrong somewhere and usually I would suspect bearings but there is very little change in noise swinging the steering from left to right. The car is going back to them on Thursday for investigative work. The two men that took the car out for a drive acknowledge that there is a 'noise' there but am so worried the source may be difficult to find, easily.
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Probably not related but I once had a noise in an Omega that a number of experienced mechanics said was a wheel bearing, though none could identify which one. Also tracking was suspected.
After spending some money on it, someone suggested changing the front tyres. I went to Micheldever tyres as they had a good reputation for sorting out issues raher than just swapping tyres, and they identified a front tyre had gone "oval". Changed it and all was fine.
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My car had done less than 4k miles and was fitted with new Michelin Primacy tyres last year at my expense only a month or so of taking delivery of my new car - they had factory fitted Hankooks. So three new tyres were fitted as part of the repairs, two of them being on two new Alloy wheels both on the nearside.
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I'd suspect the tyres too then. Bet one of them is a bit dodgy. My wife had a car which defied all attempts to get the tracking right and had a tiny but incurable steering wobble at speed. It pulled to the left and always felt like there was a a weight missing on one of the fronts.
Swopping the front tyres with back ones cured it. I guess the slight imperfection in one of the front tyres didn't show up once it was on the back. When my wallet allowed, I changed the back tyres for new ones.
Last edited by: Runfer D'Hills on Sat 12 Aug 17 at 18:13
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I've said over the years particularly when I was much more involved in such things that many folks who balance tyres fail to spot a deviation as the tyre rotates claiming if the machine says OK then it must be.
If I was faced with such an issue I'd usually jack the wheels up and rotate by hand with something like an axle stand placed hard against the tyre to detect out of round or any "squiggle" in the tread pattern.... much easier to judge with a fixed point adj the tread.
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>> My car had done less than 4k miles and was fitted with new Michelin Primacy
>> tyres last year at my expense only a month or so of taking delivery of
>> my new car - they had factory fitted Hankooks.
Was that to prevent accidents?
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Drive shaft? I'm convinced one of ours on the Roomster is making a noise but the dealer chose not to hear it while in the warranty period. I'm just waiting for it to start knocking, but as it does few miles that could be a while, if ever.
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'course it could be that DSG gearbox Manatee...you know how they are...
;-)
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I've washed my hands of it. She likes it.
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>> From about 35mph upwards I get a lot of road noise or rather a humming, heterodyning
>> noise which is especially noticeable on very smooth roads.
If you didn't keep driving it willy-nilly you wouldn't hear the noise. ;)
Last edited by: Bill Payer on Sat 12 Aug 17 at 21:40
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Well, the dealers have had my car in for about two days and can find nothing wrong, mechanically. They have checked bearings and alignment or so I have been told but nada.
They said they compared my car with others on their premises and found everything to be within acceptable limits of general road noise.
So there we are then. I am wondering now whether it is related to those three new Michelins they fitted but don't know why to be honest.
A new car now or another set of new tyres??? Hmmm I wonder
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It's easy to start obsessing about perceived noises. If you have had the car checked out and they can find nothing they are probably right. Try to ignore it. Turn the radio on rather than listening for noises.
Throwing money away on new tyres or another car would be a bit over the top in my opinion
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My old Golf Gti (Mk5 2006 reg) - owned it from 6 months old. It was eventually traced to uneven tyre wear. I'm sure HJ covered it.
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I'd swap the wheels round, particularly o/s to n/s if you can. Cheap and easy for a possible cure
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>>
>> I'd swap the wheels round, particularly o/s to n/s if you can. Cheap and easy
>> for a possible cure
>>
Well, I would imagine that if they had, if fact, spent some time on this car they might have had the wheels off anyway but whether they were put back in the same corners, who knows?
Anyway my wheel changing days are over tbh.
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You could try, as Runfer suggested up thread, swopping the front wheels with the rears. Take the jamjar to a tyre fitting place and cross their palms with silver.
Failing that, either put up with the noise as per CG/N, or if you're a a fussy Oldgit (like me) out the critter.
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>> You could try, as Runfer suggested up thread, swopping the front wheels with the rears.
>> Take the jamjar to a tyre fitting place and cross their palms with silver.
>>
The cheapest option.
>> Failing that, either put up with the noise as per CG/N, or if you're a a fussy Oldgit (like me) out the critter.
>>
My guess would be the tyres,
When I bought my Mondeo many years ago I was pleased it had four new tyres.
They were cheap Fateo's and it was only when I changed them to KHUMOs I found out how noisy the cheap tyres were.
My X type came Pirelli ( designed for the X Type, fantastic, blah blah blah ) and when I changed to KHUMOs i could then complain about the noise around the door mirrors.
Brand or high cost does not IMO mean peaceful motoring.
If you put your old tyre on the front you may have to try it on one side then the other to see if the noise follows the other tyre.
If you identify that it is tyre noise then what are your options?
Bin, sell or store one of the new tyres and replace with a quiet one or buy two new tyres for the front.
Who funds it is another question.
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I don't believe for a minute the dealer will have taken several other cars out for a test drive to compare road noise to yours!
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>> I don't believe for a minute the dealer will have taken several other cars out
>> for a test drive to compare road noise to yours!
>>
Neither do I - I'm not naïve, hopefully, at my age now. These glass and metal palaces, that are the main dealers, give my the creeps when I speak to the outwardly friendly 'knowledgeable' people there. In one and a half days at the premises I doubt whether an hour was spent looking or trying my car, although some mileage was done.
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I would bang on to the dealer saying it's not as it was and it's up to them to sort it. They may even fit another set of wheels/tyres off another car to try it. Unless it's proven to be the newer tyres (in which case I would be reassured) I would be worried about transmission issues.
And BTW, I wouldn't have been happy about three new tyres, I would have said replace with the same or give me four matching.
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>> I would bang on to the dealer saying it's not as it was and it's
>> up to them to sort it. They may even fit another set of wheels/tyres off
>> another car to try it. Unless it's proven to be the newer tyres (in which
>> case I would be reassured) I would be worried about transmission issues.
>>
>> And BTW, I wouldn't have been happy about three new tyres, I would have said
>> replace with the same or give me four matching.
>>
The 'old tyre had only done less than 3.5k miles though and all are of the same make though not the same batch, I suppose. Unless I go outside now with a depth gauge I can't make out which are the new ones.
Who pays for all this work though. No paper work was presented to me last Friday perhaps telling me that this was a continuation of the Insurance claim or whether under warranty. perhaps I should question them about that.
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Aha, I understood previously that the new tyres were a different brand etc and that's why they might be the source of the noise. If they are exactly the same tyres then that would suggest to me that something else is awry ...
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Have you gone to your insurance company as opposed to the dealers to tell them you're not happy with it? In effect, reject the repair?
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>> Have you gone to your insurance company as opposed to the dealers to tell them
>> you're not happy with it? In effect, reject the repair?
>>
Well, I can imagine the Insurance Company's answer in effect saying, we do recommend that you take it to our recommended repair centres. I will bide my time and see whether my sensitisation wears off a bit. The whole last month now, I have been on edge following the accident and being super-aware of my once unblemished new car.
I may take it to a specialist alignment centre. There is one near Oxted in Kent who specialise in racing cars etc and are not tied to flogging new shocks, tyres et.al.
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Last time I went through there ( a couple of weeks ago) Oxted was in Surrey......
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>> Last time I went through there ( a couple of weeks ago) Oxted was in
>> Surrey......
>>
Doh! Slap on hands for me. Of courseðŸ˜
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Where could I get an independent assessment of my car's post accident repairs, with particular reference to tracking, alignment etc but not resorting to those that want to sell you tyres and shocks etc?
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Take it to a specialist alignment centre. There is one near Oxted in Kent who specialise in racing cars etc and are not tied to flogging new shocks, tyres et.al. :-)
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>> Take it to a specialist alignment centre. There is one near Oxted in Kent who
>> specialise in racing cars etc and are not tied to flogging new shocks, tyres et.al.
>> :-)
>>
How strange. You must mean Abbey Motorsport. I have just contacted them by email.
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The heterodyning might simply be the odd tyre, having a slightly greater or smaller number of blocks than the three new ones if they are of a different type.
What is the beat frequency?
Last edited by: Manatee on Tue 22 Aug 17 at 11:34
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We've established that the new tyres are the same as the old.
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Ah, right.
Drive shaft then;)
I have some sympathy with Oldgit. They are rarely the same when they have been mended, even if it is only a bad colour match. You either have to decide you aren't going to dwell on it, or get rid. Difficult though when it's something you notice every time you use it.
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>> We've established that the new tyres are the same as the old.
>>
Maybe
"and all are of the same make though not the same batch"
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>> >> We've established that the new tyres are the same as the old.
>> >>
>> Maybe
>> "and all are of the same make though not the same batch"
>>
They must be the same, Oldgit says - " Unless I go outside now with a depth gauge I can't make out which are the new ones."
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Three are from a new batch, the 'old' one being several months old after a Puncture necessitated a single replacement from Kwik Fit.
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Even more revelations!
Since my accident and replacement of 3 out of the 4 tyres with 'identical' Michelins, l thought despite the fact that I have been aware of the noise reported above, I have also noticed how much better the car rides with respect to dealing with our pathetic road surfaces. My previous Michelins did not seem to cope with potholes so well and I tended to run the pressures at the minimum suggested by VW.
The car was returned to me with higher pressures (better fuel consumption etc) but despite that the car still coped with the roads so much better. I have just examined all four tyres again and now realise that the three new tyres are made in Germany whereas the 'old ' tyre from earlier this year, was made in Spain.
I'm somewhat flabbergasted that these Germanic tyres should ride so much better though perhaps contributing or being the source of the noise about which I have been worried.
Anyway I am thinking of ditching them all for a set of Dunlop Sport Blue response tyres at about £60 each from National Tyres - ordered online. This will tell me whether my tyre differences are perhaps the cause of all my troubles. Anyway it is a relatively cheap price to pay for peace of mind?
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All four of my new Michelin's on the Golf were made in France fitted at KW (recent convert from Conti's), replaced my wife's two fronts on her Polo from the same depot and her Michelin's were made in the UK.
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Oldgit, I think you should just put your money in your pocket and get on with things. Every time I get new tyres, the noise always changes because they need run in, scrubbed etc
Turn the radio up - you are probably now deliberately or unconsciously trying to listen for noises.
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Yes, you are all correct in what you say from your own points of view but we are all different and find it difficult to account for changes in things which we have become accustomed.
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I bought 4 Dunlop Sport Blus a month ago for my Passat and I am pleased with them.
They were £202 all in for the 4 fully fitted at Halfords
As always
Mark
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>> I bought 4 Dunlop Sport Blus a month ago for my Passat and I am
>> pleased with them.
>>
>> They were £202 all in for the 4 fully fitted at Halfords
>>
>> As always
>>
>> Mark
Gosh, that's a good price. Now where's my nearest Halford's Auto centre..............
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Just looking on the invoice
£202.96 for 4 x 195/65/r15 91h
I went in to the Halfords website through Top Cashback and will eventually get another £7 back.
As always
Mark
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>> Just looking on the invoice
>> £202.96 for 4 x 195/65/r15 91h
>> I went in to the Halfords website through Top Cashback and will eventually get another
>> £7 back.
>>
>> As always
>>
>> Mark
I'm a sucker for reviews and Halford's Auto centres did not get good reviews. Anyway the price each for my 205/55 91V tyre is ca £62 if ordered online from say, KwikFit, National Tyres etc.
Last edited by: Oldgit on Thu 24 Aug 17 at 17:09
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> if ordered online from say, KwikFit, National Tyres
I get that. Who would want to use a supplier with reviews as negative as some of Halford's? Surely one would want to use someone with consistently good reviews like KwikFit.
Oh, no wait...........
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Have you looked on here?
www.tyreleader.co.uk/car-tyres-205-55-16-91-V/?m%5B2%5D=on
Lots of other options (over 700 for your size)
They offer fitting at a local centre from £5 per tyre
I may be in a minority but my Halfords experience was OK and I am normally critical if I can be so (such is my nature).
As always
Mark
Last edited by: Mark on Thu 24 Aug 17 at 17:20
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Aren't the Dunlops you mention rather prone to be noisy at motorway speeds. Might be out of the proverbial frying pan....
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Try Asda Tyres online, great prices and fitted by your locsl indy of choice. My locsl indy prefers me to order via Asda as he makes more than if I hought the same tyres from him directly despite Asda makin a margin, shows their buying power.
Goodyear Efficient Grip, £62.50 each ...
Last edited by: Hard Cheese on Thu 24 Aug 17 at 18:39
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>> Aren't the Dunlops you mention rather prone to be noisy at motorway speeds. Might be
>> out of the proverbial frying pan....
>>
Who the heck knows? I tend to over read reviews and form opinions. In the end it's just total confusion. Funnily, before I bought this current Golf I never concerned myself with which tyre was fitted. There's something about this MK7 Golf from the outset that made me tyre aware and came to the conclusion that this MQB platform transmitted more tyre/road noise; something I never read anywhere else.
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I've got a Golf SV and have never noticed it being particularly noisy. In fact quite the reverse. rather quiet and relaxing to drive. Not even surewhat the tyres are though. I'll take a look though.
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Well strangely enough the factory fitted tyres are Dunlop Sport Blu Response. Seem pretty quiet to me so they might be the answer to your problems.
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>> Well strangely enough the factory fitted tyres are Dunlop Sport Blu Response. Seem pretty quiet
>> to me so they might be the answer to your problems.
>>
Many thanks. However manufacturers seem to fit whatever tyres in bulk are available the time. My MK7 came shod with Hankook and others in the showrooms have Continentals and Michelin across their model range etc. etc.
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Yes, my last Golf had Bridgestones. To be honest I think tyres in the same price band from different major manufacturers are all much of a muchness.
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>>>Aren't the Dunlops you mention rather prone to be noisy at motorway speeds
In truth the whole Dunlop range inc the Blue Response are some of the quietest tyres available in all the sizes I've bought them in... both by the spec and my experience. Great wet grip too. Had them by choice on the Alfa, on second set with the BMW, put them on daughters Jazz and now on the newly bought CLK.
In the case of the CLK it had Falkens on the rear which on a coarse motorway surface droned like a jet aircraft going overhead... the Dunlops have transformed it.
But their spec for noise and wet grip does differ between size and speed rating.
They do wear quickly though... little over 10k life on the rear of the BMW.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Thu 24 Aug 17 at 20:07
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>> In the case of the CLK it had Falkens on the rear which on a
>> coarse motorway surface droned like a jet aircraft going overhead..>>
Could that be because they were worn? I've always found Falkens to be good, they are sold as a premium brand in Germany and elsewhere, good value here.
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That's a fair point to make but the tested ratings for the particular Falkens against the Dunlops was about 4db noisier for the Falkens which would be a discernible difference. The Falkens were still above 3mm so not absolutely worn out.
But as you point out great care is needed in taking anecdotal evidence that compares new tyres against old ones when the inference is drawn that it is the make change making all the difference.
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I would ask the dealer to temporarily fit four wheels and tres off a forecourt Golf to see if it is the current tyres that are noisy.
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>> I would ask the dealer to temporarily fit four wheels and tres off a forecourt
>> Golf to see if it is the current tyres that are noisy.
>>
Yes, that is the obvious solution but I am getting to the stage where I am feeing embarrassed about the whole situation. Some people here suggest 'moving on' and not becoming obsessed about these things and of course time is passing. Just how much would a dealer tolerate and who'd be paying for their labour?
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I do not know how much you would be charged to swap wheels twice.
Assuming all other causes are eliminated if you get a full set of new tyres which test re road noise do you trust ?
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>> Yes, that is the obvious solution but I am getting to the stage where I
>> am feeing embarrassed about the whole situation. Some people here suggest 'moving on' and not
>> becoming obsessed about these things and of course time is passing. Just how much would
>> a dealer tolerate and who'd be paying for their labour?
>>
Well both the repair amd the car itself are under warranty ....
Otherwise ask to test drive an identical model ...
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>>I am feeing embarrassed about the whole situation
Well you shouldn't. You car, your money, your peace of mind. It wouldn't bother me as much as it clearly bothers you, but that isn't the point. If it did, I would pursue it.
Little point in driving around in a car which is making you unhappy / concerned / whatever if you have the means or the opportunity to pursue the matter.
Go ask the dealer if they'll swap the wheels. They can only say no. Who cares what they think?
If you're still concerned, get the new tyres. If you can afford to buy new tyres then it'll be worthwhile for peace of mind, I would have thought. Especially if it does make the difference.
If it doesn't make the difference, then think again.
Last edited by: No FM2R on Fri 25 Aug 17 at 10:30
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>>>Well you shouldn't. You car, your money, your peace of mind. It wouldn't bother me as much as it clearly bothers you, but that isn't the point. If it did, I would pursue it.
Yep that's the nub of it. OG is obviously super particular and willing to pay to get things spot on... which is entirely justified and how I am.
Talk of tracking and wheel alignment is 99.9% unlikely to be the issue. It is so likely to be down to something rubbing, a damaged wheel bearing or a tyre issue. If you trust the garage that say the bearings are OK and it is obvious there is nothing rubbing then as you seem willing I would have the tyres changed for Dunlop BlueResponse... that make and no other. From my experience they are as quiet as you are likely to find.
At about £240 a set and with a resale of £100 on Ebay for your old (new) Michelins it would seem worth it to you for a net £140 to prove the tyres as the issue.
Which county are you in OG?
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>>with a resale of £100 on Ebay
Your local tyre fitter will pay more than £25 for new tyres as a trade-in.
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Its put up or shut up time. If you are worried about it, get an independent report. If they find an issue the garage can fix it and pay for the report. If there is no issue found, then there is no issue.
Physiologically speaking the OP was probably so upset about getting a nearly new car damaged that he pre conditioned himself to it not being the same car upon its return, and it has manifested itself into a "noise"
That will be 50 guineas please.
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Yes, it's shut up time but thanks for all the input. Our Psychologist here has me down to a tee, not helped by suffering from Anxiety all my life, floating or otherwise. It does not help now that my partner, usually so dismissive of all things car related, now hears 'that noise' and so sympathises with my plight.
To my mind and to cause least inconvenience a tyre change would settle things once and for all and Tyres on you drive dot com seems an easy way out with a set of, say, Dunlop SP Blue response changed on one's premises seems too easy. Money doesn't come into the equation and I'd keep the 'old' tyre in my garage loft for the time being.
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>> Yes, it's shut up time >>
I disagree, it's a new car and under warranty and the repair itself is warranted, if it's making a noise that was not there before then the dealer/repairer needs to fix it or prove that it's normal.
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>> >> Yes, it's shut up time >>
>>
>> I disagree, it's a new car and under warranty and the repair itself is warranted,
>> if it's making a noise that was not there before then the dealer/repairer needs to
>> fix it or prove that it's normal.
They dont have to prove its "Normal" they need to prove its repaired to spec. And spec probably doesn't mean tyres to the nearest db or frequency response of the old ones. Bet you any money you like that when manufacturers change tyre suppliers during a models life time (and they do) the road noise changes.
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But they're the same tyres, just a different batch ...
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>> But they're the same tyres, just a different batch ...
No they are not, they are different makes, different tread patterns
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>> No they are not, they are different makes, different tread patterns
>>
No, Oldgit says above - " Unless I go outside now with a depth gauge I can't make out which are the new ones."
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Ah I thought you were talking about manufacturers changing tyres during production runs.
As our resident physiologist has suggested, the noise may not actually be significantly different to the noise prior to the traumatic event. If i turn down my radio and want to find an abnormal noise I will find one. One I will swear to god wasn't there before. AT the end of the day it will turn out to be of no significance
Anyway at the end of the day, no maker or repairer is going to keep changing tyres at their own expense when the engineers say there is nothing wrong.
Last edited by: Zero on Fri 25 Aug 17 at 15:46
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>> Anyway at the end of the day, no maker or repairer is going to keep
>> changing tyres at their own expense when the engineers say there is nothing wrong.
>>
Which is why the customer has to stand his ground and make a fuss if he believes all is not well after a repair, it might not be tyres, it might be a bearing, diff, gearbox etc damaged in the accident ...
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>> >> Anyway at the end of the day, no maker or repairer is going to
>> keep
>> >> changing tyres at their own expense when the engineers say there is nothing wrong.
>>
>> Which is why the customer has to stand his ground and make a fuss if
>> he believes all is not well after a repair, it might not be tyres, it
>> might be a bearing, diff, gearbox etc damaged in the accident ...
OK then I stand my ground after already submitting my car for an examination, where bearings were checked and other rotational items, I presume. You must know what these main dealers are like not allowing customers to enter their work premises or discuss anything technical with anyone other than those in suits.
I always feel defeated before I even talk to these guys and in a way can see that some things seem intractable. I have only their word that they have compared my car against others - though I do doubt that.
Their work days are usually full of bookings and cars are generally allocated a moment of anyone's time to do a quick check here and a quick check there and I can imagine that my car, left there for a day and a half might have only received about an hour or so attention, mainly left lying around the car pound.
I have been dealing with Beadles in Sevenoaks where their bodywork shop is sited but they also have another branch about 2 miles from my house and would suspect that they work in harmony with one another and so I could go there for another opinion, though the roads in that area are all 30/40mph limited unlike the Sevenoaks branch.
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>> Which is why the customer has to stand his ground and make a fuss if
>> he believes all is not well after a repair, it might not be tyres, it
>> might be a bearing, diff, gearbox etc damaged in the accident ...
And they keep saying its not. Whats you next step after that has gone round the mill 30 times?
There could be nothing wrong with it you know.
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>>>to cause least inconvenience a tyre change would settle things once and for all and Tyres on you drive dot com seems an easy way out with a set of, say, Dunlop SP Blue response changed on one's premises
For your particular mindset I would totally agree.... saving the last tenner is unimportant if the issue niggles you and sometimes the "professionals" have their own agenda which might not 100% be in your interests.
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>> To my mind and to cause least inconvenience a tyre change would settle things once
>> and for all
Oh dear no, you will have the "winter tyres/all season tyres dilemma.
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Ah sitting in the garden on a beautiful August day. How good it is to think that the great winter tyre annual debate will soon begin,
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>> How good it is to think that the great winter tyre annual debate will soon begin,
>>
Wots winter ?
Worried of Surrey.
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Wots winter?
It's when the TV programs get marginally better.
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>> Wots winter ?
>> Worried of Surrey.
Its a northern thing.
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I have now written to the Dealer Principal of Beadles VW outlining the 'problems' with my car since that accident and subsequent repairs and all my findings since then and so I await the reply when work is resumed on Tuesday. I have indicated I'd like a complete temporary wheel swop to eliminate tyres/wheels and would then be quite prepared to re-shod those wheels if the tyres were the culprit.
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>> I have now written to the Dealer Principal of Beadles VW >>
Perfect!
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The Dealer Principal or Brand Manager phoned me, after my email to him and he talked a long time about the degree of excellence they give generally and that my current gripe can be examined further, if necessary and there is virtually no limit as to what can be replaced on the car to rectify the problem, should the source of it exist or be found.
My only concern of course is that my perception of abnormality may not be theirs. Anyway we have now arranged another appointment for next week whereby my car's 'unusual' road noise with be assessed again by a road test and that I will also drive another Golf of similar heritage to see whether that noise is present in another model.
I do keep on saying to them that despite my 'enhanced awareness' - their words, following a car accident, the noise was not there before and also my partner is also (unusually) aware of this odd 'droning' sound.
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Good luck.
I don't think they can have promised much more, let's just hope it all works out.
Do you think you could be reassured that all is well?
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Yes of course if I no longer can hear 'that' noise. Driving a similar car, though introducing other variables whilst also making me aware of my new surroundings, should at least prove something. It depends on the condition of the other car. They apparently have Carte Blanche to replace whatever, within reason, is necessary to sort problems out. But they've got to find the source - (my brain of course!)
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Its an insurance claim, right? So anything required to repair any damage caused by that accident is covered.
Just as a kind of warning, that does mean both finding a diagnosable issue *and* determining that it occurred as a result of the accident. Not that I am saying this will be an issue, just for you to be wary.
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Well it has VW's 3 year warranty as well!
I just pray (not religious by the way - so hypocrite) that they could find something amiss.
Last edited by: Oldgit on Thu 31 Aug 17 at 17:14
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Ah, I hadn't taken into account the warranty.
It seems strange to wish someone good luck in finding something wrong with their own vehicle, but you know what I mean.
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>> Ah, I hadn't taken into account the warranty.
>>
>> It seems strange to wish someone good luck in finding something wrong with their own
>> vehicle, but you know what I mean.
>>
Indeed I do. Thanks.
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I hope this turns out well OG. In a past life on several occasions where an owner has a similar concerns I've been able to find a simple fault... advise the owner their perception is faulty... or write a report for the dealer of findings causing them to resolve the issue.
In a associated situation in an even earlier life around 1988 I had a new Ford that drove particularly well and once run in I knew every aspect of how it should feel. It suffered a head gasket weep under warranty (which didn't change the way it drove) and after the dealer repair power was way down. Despite me driving them on a test route describing how it was before vs after they flat denied there was any change and said it was in my mind. Annoying but it was a company car so I lived with it.
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>> I hope this turns out well OG. In a past life on several occasions where
>> an owner has a similar concerns I've been able to find a simple fault... advise
>> the owner their perception is faulty... or write a report for the dealer of findings
>> causing them to resolve the issue.
>>
Sorry but I don't quite understand your paragraph here and its content. My perception, based on 12 months ownership prior to being hit and repaired is that post damage and repair there is now an addition to the car's sound stage that both myself and my partner had not heard before.
My partner/Sister is particularly anti-car in that I am usually accused of being over car enthusiastic and always cleaning my beast and doting on it and was therefore surprised that I have now, her support which I find a bit unnerving in a way. If I were a 'normal' car owner, dropping fag ends and sweet papers all over the place, kerbing the wheels, building up weeks of filth and generally treating it as just a means of transport, then I could live with it and anyone else would probably think 'What the hell's he on about'? However, I am not them, unfortunately.
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You are probably not as abnormal as you think Oldgit. Within the range of normal in fact.
I'm convinced my car runs better when it's clean and vacuumed out. Better still when I have properly cleaned the windows too.
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>>>I'm convinced my car runs better when it's clean and vacuumed out. Better still when I have properly cleaned the windows too.
Oh that is a given for most folks.... add in a sunny light traffic day and it's motoring bliss!
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>>> I don't quite understand your paragraph here and its content
OK... In previous employment/work from time to time I'd look at a car which had been to a dealer for this or that obscure issue where the owner was not happy with their findings.
I was always able to...
1) Find a simply resolved issue myself and repair it avoiding further interaction with the dealer.
2) Explain to the owner why their perception of the issue was wrong.
3) Find the issue existed and was clearly one the dealer should resolve so would write a report for the owner to read through over the phone to the dealer or take it in to guide them in the correct direction.
One of the three options... or sometimes a combination... always sorted things for the owner.
So I am not saying you are case 2... just mentioning it as one of the options I've had to deal with.
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If it helps to understand OG here's a real life example of each.
1) Person calls on me who'd bought a brand new car a few weeks earlier and found the bonnet would not release when the lever inside was pulled and was hard to get to latch when dropped back down. They called into the main dealer who sent a tech out to look and his response was it was a bodyshop issue to re-align the bonnet and it needed booking in for a day which was a nuisance to them. I looked to find there was not a hint of oil or grease on the catch.. attended to this and it worked correctly... and carried on to do so for the next 5yrs.
2) Guy calls on me to say he'd had the main dealer look at his car (in warranty) twice for a sticky clutch action. I was able to show him the aftermarket thick rubber mat he had was occasionally sliding out of place and causing the pedal to stick for a moment. He could see this issue and put a proper fitted set in... no more problems.
3) Was asked to look at a post accident issue similar to yours OG when the owner heard a drone type noise now and again but only on certain corners at higher speeds. He thought wheel bearing... dealer said no issue. I found there were some fixings left out of the wheel arch plastic liner which caused it to blow back a little on the front lower edge at main road speeds then when the tyre turned in a corner the two just contacted making the noise. Wrote this up and owner returned to dealer with the info who replace the fixings and were suitably embarrassed their guys hadn't noticed.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Fri 1 Sep 17 at 11:53
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Will you have a look at our Roomster:)
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What's happening to that?
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Oh, what I call a bearing noise that 'pulses' with wheel rotation. I drew the dealer's attention to it at the last service (the last one under the now-expired warranty) and of course nothing found.
I must jack it up sometime and have a look. Most noticeable on a smooth surface.
I have little faith in dealers for this sort of thing. I had a heavy knock on an Orion once. Nothing found. Looked with my brother that evening, broken engine mount.
Last edited by: Manatee on Fri 1 Sep 17 at 12:07
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Ahh the old faithful... is it tyres... a wheel bearing... or a coincidental electronic effect on the dance music track in the CD.
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>> Ahh the old faithful... is it tyres... a wheel bearing... or a coincidental electronic effect
>> on the dance music track in the CD.
I can eliminate one of those. Add rubbing or slightly binding brake (don't think it is, it doesn't vary much when brake touched), drive shaft...and I don't want to think about the Heath Robinson inspired DCT.
Tyres are Dunlop SP Sportmaxx 205/45/R16 with plenty of tread.
It has of course been stuffed into the back of another car at 10mph, which might have a 'bearing'.
I'd just move on, but she likes it. I can see why, it is immensely practical.
My response is not to wash it very often.
Apologies to Oldgit for mewling in his thread.
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All I now say at this stage is that the noise/s are getting worse and it is not tyre related but more a growling/roaring noise related to speed and I'd bet is possibly bearing related.
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In some ways it's a benefit if it's getting louder as it should be easier for them to diagnose.... and gradually increasing noise over time is a real clue for a bearing issue. Plus the accident was a likely cause for brinelling so perhaps you are getting nearer an answer.
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>> In some ways it's a benefit if it's getting louder as it should be easier
>> for them to diagnose.... and gradually increasing noise over time is a real clue for
>> a bearing issue. Plus the accident was a likely cause for brinelling so perhaps you
>> are getting nearer an answer.
>>
Yes, brinelling, thats a good technical term. I will bring that up next week with the experts!
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No good you coming to my office for a refund.
Resident C4P Physiologist.
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>> No good you coming to my office for a refund.
>>
>>
"They all do that squire, nothing to worry about"
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"resident C4P physiologist"
Oh dear, I saw this usage up the thread as well, I think you mean psychologist. Where's a good philologist when you need one?
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>> "resident C4P physiologist"
>>
>> Oh dear, I saw this usage up the thread as well, I think you mean
>> psychologist. Where's a good philologist when you need one?
>>
Whichever we mean, i certainly need some different happy pills - mine are now no longer efficacious. Hmmmm.........
Incidentally, if needed i may request and pay for a VW Field Engineer.
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Depending on the outcome of my next visit to my dealer to try and sort out my car's drone, since my accident, I have been finding the cost to p/x my car for a new Golf MK7.5 of basically the same engine configuration.
I would have to go for the SE Nav plus two extras to give all that was included in my existing car. The price to change (and a factory order) would be ca £7250 but I have opted for the Active Display. Unfortunately VW no longer offer Reflex Silver metallic finish which is a shame and I am not quite sure which similar metallic colour I would choose (I was told Tungsten Silver - Hmmmm).
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>> (I was told Tungsten Silver - Hmmmm).
>>
Is that VW speak for grey? Honda's grey is called "Tinted Silver".
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>> >> (I was told Tungsten Silver - Hmmmm).
>> >>
>>
>> Is that VW speak for grey? Honda's grey is called "Tinted Silver".
>>
Well colours from different manufacturers are very confusing. I think I know what this colour looks like but every previous car I have owned has been 'Silver' as it is so easy to keep clean and if dirty still look acceptable. Tungsten Silver, being 'darker', well I'm not so sure. Rather have Reflex Silver every day.
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I've had quite a lot of silver cars for that very reason. It does keep cleaner, or at least appear to, better than any other colour. But, sometimes I find them just a bit too silver, if you see what I mean?
I've had quite a few black ones too, they look great when clean, but they don't stay clean very long. Quite like red too, that's not bad for looking ok when a bit dirty, but blue and white just look shabby unless they're newly washed. You'd think dark grey would hide dirt, but it doesn't and looks especially manky with salt on. Silver is best for all that, just wish it didn't look so silver.
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Get the wheel bearing changed -if you whacked the wheel hard enough to break it, every chance that it has brinnelled the bearing race, or broken a ball.
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"brinnelled"
What a great word ! Had to google it, but now I'm going to use it. Rolls off the tongue beautifully, bit like "gusset".
As you were...
;-)
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>> What a great word ! Had to google it, but now I'm going to use
>> it. Rolls off the tongue beautifully, bit like "gusset".
>>
I thought it was Russets that just rolls off the tongue.
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I remember having to memorise that and 20-30 such words and their meanings. Haven't heard that word in years.
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One of my neighbours has a brinnelled Whippet
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I think this thread has been the equivalent of man maths for Oldgit to justify getting a new Golf mk7.5 :-) There's nothing wrong with his fixed one.
And to be honest.... why not get a new car and enjoy it.
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>>brinnelled Whippet
A dog with dents in it?
Last edited by: Runfer D'Hills on Fri 15 Sep 17 at 21:54
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>> >>brinnelled Whippet
>>
>> A dog with dents in it?
>>
....that would be a Dandie Dingmont.......
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Brinnelled.....lovely word'
A favourite of mine, which I do introduce into conversation sometimes . Eleemosynary.
Found it in an Arnold Bennett novel....Anna of the Five Towns....I think. ( about the only fiction I will read ! ...Fine writer )
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Just the one "n", in brinelled that is. Been bothering me. Had to look it up. Named after a chap called Brinell apparently.
As you were...
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>>>Haven't heard that word in years.
You obviously weren't paying attention when I used it in this thread 13 days ago... and I knew how to spell it!
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>> >>>Haven't heard that word in years.
>>
>> You obviously weren't paying attention when I used it in this thread 13 days ago...
>> and I knew how to spell it!
>>
I don't read and memorise every post. Anyway no matter, as you were.
Last edited by: sooty123 on Sat 16 Sep 17 at 06:35
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>> Get the wheel bearing changed -if you whacked the wheel hard enough to break it,
>> every chance that it has brinnelled the bearing race, or broken a ball.
>>
Yes we have been through all that. Two nearside wheels were thwacked and the offending car hit my front offside wing where the major obvious damage was, so which one/s do we replace without definitive evidence? Ironically the rear offside one could be the offender.
I got this quote from VW for wheel bearings. The bearing itself isn't /can't be replaced separately. A complete hub assembly is replaced containing the bearing/s
Front : £318.58 inc vat each supplied and fitted.
Rear: £246.69 inc vat each supplied and fitted
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>>The bearing itself isn't /can't be replaced separately
Sadly they make nothing simple these days! - I sometimes think Manufacturers think why should we sell something for £20 when we can make it sell it for £300!
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>>Sadly they make nothing simple these days! - I sometimes think Manufacturers think why should
>> we sell something for £20 when we can make it sell it for £300!
Quite the reverse, they make things much more simply. Cars, in relative terms have never been cheaper or more reliable, one of the reasons because its no longer assembled by hand from millions of little parts by some couldn't care less Herbert in the west midlands, but sub assemblies assembled by robots who make a much better job it than you ever could.
If you want a car you can (and have to) replace lots of silly bearing and grease lots of things, get yourself a Morris Marina.
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>>
>> >>Sadly they make nothing simple these days! - I sometimes think Manufacturers think why should
>> >> we sell something for £20 when we can make it sell it for £300!
>> If you want a car you can (and have to) replace lots of silly bearing
>> and grease lots of things, get yourself a Morris Marina.
>>
Or one of the four Austin Healey Sprites I owned from 1959 to 1972.
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>>get yourself a Morris Marina.
;-) had one! back in the 70's, a 1.8 estate, Maroon one! Had it 6years and strangely it never went wrong! I think Maroon ones were made better than the other colours! ;-)
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In the "old days" you still needed to take the hub off to press or whack out the old bearings... then get the new ones in without causing damage that would cause them to fail early.
These days the hub usually comes off with 3 or 4 bolts and is changed as a complete assy so the labour should be lower.... but at VW prices there is never a "lower".
I've just fitted a new offside front hub assy to my BMW as the bearing was going. Very similar bolt on setup as yours and not too bad a job. Now as the Tremeloes would say...
The part cost online for your Golf (front) ranges from £40 for a bearing too cheap for me to fit... to £100 for OE quality.
If you can hear a wheel bearing noise and the dealer's tech can agree he hears it too then he should have the skill to decide on the most likely to change.
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And it should be free anyway, as it's either covered under the accident repair or it's covered under the warranty (this is a relatively new car as I recall).
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>> And it should be free anyway, as it's either covered under the accident repair or
>> it's covered under the warranty (this is a relatively new car as I recall).
Indeed it should. If there is anything wrong with that is, as yet unproven I think.
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>>If you can hear a wheel bearing noise and the dealer's tech can agree he hears it too then he should have the skill to decide on the most likely to change. >>
Totally!
>> And it should be free anyway, as it's either covered under the accident repair
>> or it's covered under the warranty (this is a relatively new car as I recall).
>>
>> Indeed it should. If there is anything wrong with that is, as yet unproven I
>> think.
>>
Why not get a quote and if reasonable ask them to change it on the basis that they (warranty) pays if it fixes it and you'll pay the parts costs if it doesn't.
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>> >>If you can hear a wheel bearing noise and the dealer's tech can agree he
>> hears it too then he should have the skill to decide on the most likely
>> to change.
>>
>> Why not get a quote and if reasonable ask them to change it on the
>> basis that they (warranty) pays if it fixes it and you'll pay the parts costs
>> if it doesn't.
>>
I've had a quote from Beadles Bromley. It's as follows:-
Front : £318.58 inc vat each supplied and fitted.
Rear: £246.69 inc vat each supplied and fitted.
No longer a simple bearing only as whole hub assembly is included as a unit.
Last edited by: Oldgit on Wed 20 Sep 17 at 19:15
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I think we frequent the same VW dealers!
My local is the Otford branch (or should we say Sevenoaks?)
You never know we may pass each other when I'm next down there (I recently came very very close to buying a year old GTi to replace my 2006 TDi, I just couldn't find the extra 5K I needed)…. one day I'll have it although I may be tempted to stay with diesel.
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>> I think we frequent the same VW dealers!
>>
>> My local is the Otford branch (or should we say Sevenoaks?)
>>
>> You never know we may pass each other when I'm next down there (I recently
>> came very very close to buying a year old GTi to replace my 2006 TDi,
>> I just couldn't find the extra 5K I needed)…. one day I'll have it although
>> I may be tempted to stay with diesel.
>>
Yes both Otford and Bromley the latter being much closer to me but with almost zero customer parking!
My car is going into the Otford branch for further tests on Oct 2nd for the whole week. Based on the outcome, I may place an order for the updated Golf for which there is a 10 wait for a factory order. Id rather not have that expense, though.
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Just had a replacement wheel bearing on the Volvo S60. Complete hub assembly, as you say. Mine was £341 and odd pence all up.
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>>No longer a simple>>
Hmm, too expensive.
I really don't see that you should be driven to buying a new car by this though. It must be curable.
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I think he wants to justify a new car ;-)
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>> I think he wants to justify a new car ;-)
>>
I was offered £15k for my car in exchange for a new Golf, resulting in me having to find another £7259 which is tempting for peace of mind but I would have to wait about 10 weeks for this factory order which I don't relish as I suffer from anxiety a lot.
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Its cost vs. benefit, isn't it.
If you have £7,000 to spend, and if the feeling of loss of that money will be tiny compared to the gain in peace of mind from a new car, then do it. The only argument against that move is financial, and that doesn't appear to be your priority.
If there is no other way which will bring you the peace of mind, then go for it. Money in the bank that you don't need for survival or other more important matters is supposed to be used for peace of mind, isn't it?
As for the 10 weeks, well prevarication isn't going to make that time any shorter.
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>> >>No longer a simple>>
>>
>> Hmm, too expensive.
>>
>> I really don't see that you should be driven to buying a new car by
>> this though. It must be curable.
>>
Of course it's curable, at least in theory, if you replace enough parts and is helpful If the culprits can be found. It's a matter of whose going to give in first, isn't it? I will feel a right idiot if I have all bearing assemblies replaced and the noise is there.
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My car went back to the dealership on Monday this week for 'extensive' investigations. Yesterday' I had a phone call asking me to come back today and road test it as they've replaced a wheel bearing. So fingers crossed for later this morning.
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Fingers crossed indeed... hopefully as they've replaced *a* wheel bearing they have managed to diagnose *the* wheel bearing.
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Mmm, I do hope Oldgit comes back relieved and happy. I think this has been some stress for him.
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>> Mmm, I do hope Oldgit comes back relieved and happy. I think this has been
>> some stress for him.
>>
An understatement indeed.
Yes, everything back to normal now after replacing front nearside bearing/hub assembly. This front nearside wheel, I suppose, took the main impact of the kerb when I inadvertently mounted it, swerving left to lessen the impact from the vehicle coming at me from the right.
The dealers said it was difficult to trace as it didn't show the 'normal' worn bearing syndrome but as we all know here damage can be done not manifesting itself in the usual way.
Anyway, it's the first time since getting my car back from their body shop in late July, that my car sounds normal again.
Thanks everyone for listening and giving advice on brinelling etc. I have now no need to order a replacement car and have plenty of time to consider other makes and models, though that might include a MK8 or the new T-ROC out later this year.
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Sounds to me like you have a pretty decent dealer.
Anyway, I am glad it is resolved now and not only do you have the problem fixed, it has been confirmed that you were correct - always nice to know.
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Well excellent news at last. Never good to be rushed into a car change if you can help it.
>>>Sounds to me like you have a pretty decent dealer.
>>>The dealers said it was difficult to trace as it didn't show the 'normal' worn bearing syndrome
Dealer speak for the guy who looked at it initially lacked experience and/or understanding of many independents... or on the ball seasoned DIYers come to it.
Those shiny premises count for little as I discovered recently when I took my BMW to the dealers for the first time in 3yrs and their understanding of service/repair issues was woefully lacking.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Wed 4 Oct 17 at 15:05
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I make those comments as on Aug 19th Oldgit said...
---Well, the dealers have had my car in for about two days and can find nothing wrong, mechanically. They have checked bearings and alignment or so I have been told but nada.
They said they compared my car with others on their premises and found everything to be within acceptable limits of general road noise---
Two days... hell I'd have diagnosed that in 20mins. I suspect Dog would have too.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Wed 4 Oct 17 at 15:09
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Hang on a minute though - do you hear that sort of odd rubbing noise:-)
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>> Hang on a minute though - do you hear that sort of odd rubbing noise:-)
>>
I do suffer from floating anxiety syndrome, so many a true word spoken in jest ðŸ˜
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Took me about 300 yds to diagnose SWMBO's car when she said it's making a funny noise. No idea what happened to it, quiet one day (I drove it), noisy the next. I suspect most main dealer techs dealing with new cars very rarely see or hear a failed bearing these days as they last 100k + usually.
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>> Took me about 300 yds to diagnose SWMBO's car when she said it's making a
>> funny noise. No idea what happened to it, quiet one day (I drove it), noisy
>> the next. I suspect most main dealer techs dealing with new cars very rarely see
>> or hear a failed bearing these days as they last 100k + usually.
>>
Agree, of course but when two nearside wheels have hit or mounted kerb and front O/S was hit by offending car, then premature failure can't be ruled out, at least in my books and car has only done 4.5k miles as of July incident.
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Volkswagen - Car Accident - further developments - smokie
