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There are three sets of light-controlled crossroads that I have to navigate most times I drive out. Imagine that I am waiting at one for the lights to change. I want to turn left but a car in the opposite lane ahead wants to turn to his right, my left. At the change, I turn as planned and invariably the opposite driver holds back till I am clear of the junction. Occasionally they race to beat me to it, with the obvious risk of collision. Who has priority?
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I would say you do, he is turning across apposing, potentially straight on traffic.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Thu 22 Nov 18 at 15:13
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Yup, As I am crossing another carriageway, I always assume the other has priority
Last edited by: Zero on Thu 22 Nov 18 at 16:12
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Even if you’re driving a BMW? Shirley not.
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I use a junction regularly as the right turner given in ambo's example.... and where if you fail to take any small opportunity to make that turn you can be there ages at commuter time.
If at the head of the right turn queue with lights red I sit poised while assessing the car and driver opposing for the slightest chink in their reactions to get across in the first sniff of green appearing. A newish Honda Jazz with grey haired driver chatting to wife over their bargains having just left Lidls down the road is a near cert for an opportunity.
But I do respect once the flow starts it's totally their right.
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Unfortunately priority and right of way mean nothing to some (many) drivers. No point in claiming right of way with your bonnet folded in half up your windscreen.
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Bit like power and sail? Where does a submarine sit in the hierarchy?
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>> Bit like power and sail? Where does a submarine sit in the hierarchy?
>>
On the surface the same as any other ship. Dived, there is a form of control similar to air traffic control with allocated transit routes, depth brackets, and exclusive areas. If two submarines are operating in the same area they will be allocated water above and below a specified depth.
Don't get carried away about power and sail, if power needs to stay on the wet bit, sail loses.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Fri 23 Nov 18 at 16:37
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>> Don't get carried away about power and sail, if power needs to stay on the
>> wet bit, sail loses.
youtu.be/_tUoUxzt9sI
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I've sailed around there, just as many wallies on the wet stuff as dry. The tanker obviously isn't big enough.
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>> I've sailed around there,
So have I, the red funnel line have little sails painted on the bridge wings to indicate the number of "kills"
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>> On the surface the same as any other ship. Dived, there is a form of
>> control similar to air traffic control with allocated transit routes, depth brackets, and exclusive areas.
>> If two submarines are operating in the same area they will be allocated water above
>> and below a specified depth.
Except of course if you are sneaking about around someones back door to see who's at home and what they are up to.
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>> Except of course if you are sneaking about around someones back door to see who's
>> at home and what they are up to.
>>
They would not know you were there, and if they did they would soon let you know!
There is an understanding on depths to use in open water.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Fri 23 Nov 18 at 17:44
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>> If at the head of the right turn queue with lights red I sit poised
>> while assessing the car and driver opposing for the slightest chink in their reactions to
>> get across in the first sniff of green appearing. A newish Honda Jazz with grey
>> haired driver chatting to wife over their bargains having just left Lidls down the road
>> is a near cert for an opportunity.
I do exactly the same of course, often snicking the car into sports + mode* just in case. Jazzi are fair game, Audi RS4's are not you will get embarrassed badly.
*As soon as that picture representation of car the with glowing red wheels appears in the centre display Mrs Z grips her seat and the dog hunkers down with her claws gripping the cage mat.
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>> *As soon as that picture representation of car the with glowing red wheels appears in
>> the centre display Mrs Z grips her seat and the dog hunkers down with her
>> claws gripping the cage mat.
>>
I too wish it was a little less obvious to the passenger when youve put the BMW into sport or sport +... Somewhat strangely the MINI is more discrete - putting that into sport just brings up the same type of car graphic, but with a rocket going up from the car and, if you’ve set sport to include sport chassis, a go-kart as well... it also adds stripes to the bonnet :)
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>> Who has priority?
I'm surprised you even ask. If he's turning right, he must give way to the oncoming traffic.
For the right-turner, it might be tempting to take advantage of a bimbling pensioner in a Jazz, but what if (a) the OAP turns out not to be a bimbler, or (b) the motorcyclist behind said bimbler has the same idea and decides to pass him as the lights change?
The problem with doing junctions, roundabouts etc on lightning reactions is that it greatly increases your chances of surprising somebody else. You can then have the sort of accident that isn't your fault, but is still one that you should have avoided.
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It comes down to did you anticipate or were you surprised? I believe it is not a good idea to surprise other drivers.
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>>>The problem with doing junctions, roundabouts etc on lightning reactions is that it greatly increases your chances of surprising somebody else.
>>>what if (a) the OAP turns out not to be a bimbler, or (b) the motorcyclist behind said bimbler has the same idea and decides to pass him as the lights change?
>>> I believe it is not a good idea to surprise other drivers.
Really important points. If you are going to take such opportunities it's crucial to be totally aware of the potential for the unexpected yourself... and be prepared to back off if needed.
I'm the first to "nip through" when safe but also the first to give way in an "after you" manner when that's appropriate.
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Supposing in the orginal example you were turning left on a green filter.
Can you assume that the light sequence means that there will never be a right filter showing at the same time from the opposite direction?
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I don't think even a traffic planner would give green lights to conflicting traffic. If they did a green light only gives permission to proceed if it is safe to move.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Fri 23 Nov 18 at 21:14
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They wouldn't be exactly conflicting, more sort of merging.
My memory says that long ago filter left signs didn't give priority, but only permission to ignore the red light (for straight ahead) and turn if the road was clear.
Now the Highway Code only says "You may proceed in the direction of the green arrow".
"May proceed" doesn't exactly say that the other light will be red and that you have full priority.
Or does it?
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>> They wouldn't be exactly conflicting, more sort of merging.
Have you seen the way some drivers merge? You could believe that everyone else was invisible.
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>> Who has priority?
>> I'm surprised you even ask.
Probably because it has so often been impressed upon me, in family, several schools, the Army and innumerable years of marriage, that I am wrong.
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>
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>> Have you seen the way some drivers merge? You could believe that everyone else was
>> invisible.
>>
So what does a green filter arrow mean then - "You have priority, the other traffic is at Red" or as the HC says, "You may turn left" ?
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>> So what does a green filter arrow mean then - "You have priority, the other
>> traffic is at Red" or as the HC says, "You may turn left" ?
>>
A green filter arrow does not usually put you into a merge or conflict with traffic situation. It also means you may turn if safe. Sometimes a left filter has a green arrow followed by a give way line and sign.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Sun 25 Nov 18 at 10:30
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>>So what does a green filter arrow mean
I believe the highway code states any green light means: "you may proceed IF THE WAY IS CLEAR" - my caps.
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As BT said.
I treat a filter arrow as if it is just a green light for the direction it is pointing, e.g. if it's a right turn I might have to give way to oncoming traffic.
However, most people seem to think (for a crossroads when turning right) -
- a full green means give way if turning right
- a full green with right filter, or the right filter on its own, means that oncoming traffic has a red light
I'm pretty sure I have seen junctions where traffic has to give way on a filter but they seem to be rare or extinct now so maybe the designers have gone with the flow and use it only where there is unimpeded right of way, possibly for safety reasons.
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That's my understanding too, but I've only just come to appreciating that was probably my assumption after reading this thread.
So if the person turning right in the original example had happened to be at a right filter, the left-turner would not have known that, and the right-turner might perhaps have been accelerating hard in the belief that he had priority on a filter?
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Sometimes there are no strict rules regarding traffic control.Common sense,you have the right over a car croses you.If you collide be intersting what the insurance company says.
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Priority at crossroads - Old Navy
