Had a go in my in-laws new car last night, a very nice 60 reg C-Max 1.6 TDCi Titanium.
Thoroughly lovely car in every way, but still suffers from an irritating "feature" common to every Ford diesel I've ever driven, that is, a "dead" zone in first half inch or so of accelerator travel. The 1.8 TDCi S-Max I drove was particularly bad, which I put down to the 1.8 being a fairly old design of engine, but the 1.6 is a bang up to date Ford/PSA unit which I've also driven in a Citroen C4 and found it peppy and responsive. The 2.0 S-Max I tried was better, but felt "dead" in the first bit of pedal travel.
The performance (110 bhp) and refinement of the engine are both excellent, but it just doesn't have that reassuring crispness of response to small pedal movements that I enjoy with my ancient VW PD, or had with the 1.9dCi Renault engine, or even the 2.0 TDCi S-Max. You have to consciously "prod" the pedal, particularly when moving off from rest, which I'm sure you will adjust to, but with modern engine management, surely this is something they could "map" out relatively easily. It also seems odd, given that every other control in this C-Max, whether it's steering, gear change or brakes is weighted and modulated beautifully.
I also couldn't help thinking, as I thought when I experienced it in the other cars, that if this was my first experience of diesel, it would actually put me off.
As I said, the actual performance of the engine is fine in the context of this kind of car, and if you press the pedal further, response is fine. And as a car, it is lovely. Getting in the Golf afterwards, it felt vague, wallowy and slack. Which, in fairness 120,000 miles probably has something to do with, but the Ford chassis and steering are still amazing for a family wagon.
Has anyone else noticed this phenomenon with Ford diesels? It has to be a mapping / set-up issue as the same engines in other manufacturers cars don't suffer from it.
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Not noticed it in my S-Max 2.0. It compares favourably with other diesels I've driven. If anything, I find Merc diesels (I6 and V6) have a bit of a dead spot, which I've always put down to the autobox. They are certainly not as peppy off the mark as 4-cylinder manual diesels I've driven (although they soon make up for it!).
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>> Has anyone else noticed this phenomenon with Ford diesels? It has to be a mapping
>> / set-up issue as the same engines in other manufacturers cars don't suffer from it.
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I recall having to get used to my old Mondeo when I first got it, it felt as though it was easy to stall though once used to it it was never an issue.
Not sure the mapping on the 1.6 would be much different for Ford and Citreon etc however I found this engine to seem to be less refined in a (otherwise excellent) C4 Picasso compared to a C-Max (old type) and Fiesta (new type).
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>> I recall having to get used to my old Mondeo when I first got it, it felt as though it was easy
>> to stall though once used to it it was never an issue.
When I test drove the mark 3 Mondeo TDI 130PS I stalled it almost straight away. The revised mark 3 I got with the Euro IV version of the 130PS diesel engine was different. Never stalled it once. Maybe they changed something?
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I agree with Boxsterboy, none of my Ford diesels have ever been an issue and no real different to my VAG's
My wife has 1.6TDCi and the only time that goes a little flat was with supermarket diesel.
Wosrt car ever is a Merc D, but I think Boxterboy may be right that the autobox is more to blame although the engines are pretty lame off the mark but get going when for most diesels it all over ! makes for a fatiging drive though as you have to think so far ahead.
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There was an EGR (exhaust gas recirculation valve?) flatspot at about 1,500rpm on some TDCi engines.
There was a thread or two about it on the old place.
My 2.0TDCi needs a bit more throttle to pull away from rest than my old 1.8TDCi.
That's partly power delivery characteristics - the 2.0 is more like petrol - and partly because the anti-stall software was quite aggressive on the 1.8.
I remember reversing on quite a steep hill.
It was possible to move slowly with no throttle, although the car must have been giving itself quite a few beans to prevent stalling, let alone enough to move the car.
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I have a Mondeo TDCi Titanium, one year old. It exhibits a flat spot and as you have observed it is very irritating. I find the problem exhibits at low speeds and can make parking or manouevring in restricted spaces quite difficult. The problem often occurs when moving forward after stopping at a roundabout - the vehicle displays a reluctance to respond to the accelerator and then suddenly picks up. I mentioned the problem to the dealer at the 15000km service and although no comment was made in the report as to what action was taken the problem seemed to have gone for 2 or three weeks and then has returned as bad as before. No problem is apparent at high speeds. I will take the vehicle back to the Ford Dealer but I don't have any confidence that they will resolve the problem. From all that I have read on the web, many people with Diesel Mondeos are experiencing this problem. It appears to be a design problem but Ford do not appear to be addressing the problem.
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Ford - Ford diesels - throttle "dead spot" - Boxsterboy
