***** This thread is now closed, please CLICK HERE to go to Volume 3 *****
A thread for cycling chat....!
Last edited by: VxFan on Mon 8 Apr 13 at 10:13
|
Anybody else see this? The story of the WRC in the 80s and the eventual removal of Group B cars.
To be repeated in a couple of hours and again at midnight Thursday.
Not to be missed.
|
|
Not too keen on how the story ends a la Henri Toivonen.
Last edited by: Lygonos on Mon 10 Dec 12 at 23:24
|
|
yeah, it was on a few months ago.
|
|
Yes it was a repeat. Worth catching though for those who haven't. Most evocative, and scarcely believable now like a lot of things.
|
Yes, it was an unbelievable time. A friend and I used to follow the RAC rally, and the appearance of the Group B cars was an eye opener. I'm glad I saw them in their proper environment, not a museum or a demonstration event.
For sound effects - a Quattro with the anti-lag turned on, for visuals a Lancia on what could never have come from a petrol pump, the flames on the overrun were nearly as big as the car.
|
>> Yes, it was an unbelievable time. A friend and I used to follow the RAC
>> rally, and the appearance of the Group B cars was an eye opener. I'm glad
>> I saw them in their proper environment, not a museum or a demonstration event.
>>
>> For sound effects - a Quattro with the anti-lag turned on, for visuals a Lancia
>> on what could never have come from a petrol pump, the flames on the overrun
>> were nearly as big as the car.
I can remember the group B cars and the huge RAC rally stages. Cars used to go into the forests at night, and you never knew who would come out again alive or in one piece.
It wasnt only the cars, it was the stages, grizzly grisedale, killer kielder et all.
|
|
I remember watching the Lombard RAC rally on TV - would that have been the end of the 70s/ early 80s? One of my first ambitions as a nipper was to be a rally driver (absolute petrolhead as a bairn) after watching Mk2 Escorts and Sunbeam Lotuses ripping around the forests.
|
>> Yes, it was an unbelievable time. A friend and I used to follow the RAC
>> rally, and the appearance of the Group B cars was an eye opener. I'm glad
>> I saw them in their proper environment, not a museum or a demonstration event.
>>
>
Ditto
A sight and sound never forgotten
|
I did a modest amount of saloon car racing in my 970 Cooper S in the mid to late 1960s.
Brands, Cadwell Park, Mallory Park, Snetterton Lydden Hill, et al.
I would NEVER have had the bottle to compete in a rally.
|
|
Oh, it's rallying - bor-ing. I was hoping it was something to do with I Like Driving in My Car.
|
A Group B Quattro being given the beans through a forest stage is one of the finest sounds in motorsport.
A golden era of technology unencumbered by Health and Safety. Never to be repeated.
It's the same fundamental principle behind my love of 80s performance cars.
|
>> I did a modest amount of saloon car racing in my 970 Cooper S in
>> the mid to late 1960s.
At last, someone else who had that rarest of all Coopers...the 970S. Mine was a '65 car, BVT 662C...Stoke on Trent registration. Went like stink. Used it for honeymoon in '69 to the Highlands. Did a little club rallying, fairly gentle stuff, though.
Ted
|
|
Mine was a 997 Cooper. Spats, wide wheels, Goodyear Rally Specials, a cage and full harnesses. Unbelievable cornering, but the tyres didn't last long. Red with white roof of course.
|
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-20725496
Although I sympathise with the parent, a cyclist riding in a bus lane is pushing their luck...
|
Probably better in a separate thread than buried here.
>>Although I sympathise with the parent, a cyclist riding in a bus lane is pushing their luck...
Not necessarily non-compliant - cyclists can use a lot of bus lanes quite legitimately. I'd like to know the road layout.
Can't really form a view on the info given but the judgement sounds a bit fatalistic to me. Maybe he should have been charged with a lesser offence, or was he? There was the aggravating factor of the presumably illegal windows too.
I wonder why manslaughter, and not death by dangerous driving?
|
The defendant appears to be admitting he couldn't see out of his darkened windows: "said he had only opened his car door a little to see if anyone was coming.
>>I wonder why manslaughter, and not death by dangerous driving?
Do you need intent to injure to justify manslaughter?
|
The victim's father gave a very dignified interview on 5live's Drive programme.
CPS charged manslaughter for want of a better alternative. Engine off and parked meant that RT offences were not available. A gap in the law.
|
>> Engine off and parked meant that RT offences were not available. A gap in the law.
I thought the person behind the wheel was always responsible, even if a passenger opened a door carelessly. Has something changed?
|
>>, even if a passenger opened
>> a door carelessly. Has something changed?
No nothings changed, Thats never been the case.
|
>>
>> >>, even if a passenger opened
>> >> a door carelessly. Has something changed?
>>
>> No nothings changed, Thats never been the case.
>>
The driver is responsible for children, but not adults
|
>> The driver is responsible for children, but not adults
>>
Are you sure? How can a driver be responsible for the criminal act of a child?
|
|
Age of criminal responsibility is 10yrs. Anyway it is in the legislation and that's just fine.
|
Sorry don't understand
Yes I know the age of criminal responsibility 1s 10 years.
The question was "is an adult driver of a vehicle legally responsible of the criminal act of a child in a vehicle." Westpig implied that they would be. Not sure how that could be so
|
>> Sorry don't understand
>>
>> Yes I know the age of criminal responsibility 1s 10 years.
>>
>> The question was "is an adult driver of a vehicle legally responsible of the criminal
>> act of a child in a vehicle." Westpig implied that they would be. Not sure
>> how that could be so
I suspect the position is that criminal or civil liability arises because the responsible adult failed to 'control' the child.
IIRC when seatbelts became compulsory it was the drivers responsibility to ensure children wore their belts.
Adult refusers would be booked in their own name.
As somebody helping out with transport for an outdoor group at the time my concern was that while Copper A was booking the refusnik his colleague could go over my car with a fine tooth comb.
|
But in that the law makes the driver specifically liable for ensuring a child is wearing a seatbelt. The child itself is not committing any offence.
I still fail to see how a driver can be responsible for the criminal act of a child.
|
>> I still fail to see how a driver can be responsible for the criminal act
>> of a child.
It may be a separate offence rather than 'being responsible'. The driver failed to ensure that the child could not open the door. Whether he does so mechanically by using childproof locks or by giving the child rules and instruction depends an age etc of the child.
|
>> The victim's father gave a very dignified interview on 5live's Drive programme.
>>
>> CPS charged manslaughter for want of a better alternative. Engine off and parked meant that
>> RT offences were not available. A gap in the law.
Good answer.
Article here to that effect from the BBC's Home Affairs correspondent, who also mentions that the bus lane was shared by bikes.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-20732883
|
>> Article here to that effect from the BBC's Home Affairs correspondent, who also mentions that
>> the bus lane was shared by bikes.
>>
>> www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-20732883
Article concludes by quoting safety advice from a more bike oriented country:
But there has to be education too. In the Netherlands, they teach people to open a car door with their opposite hand - so if you were in a right-hand-drive car here, you would reach over with your left hand. That means your body turns and you look over your shoulder
Worth remembering.
|
>> Although I sympathise with the parent, a cyclist riding in a bus lane is pushing
>> their luck...
Most London bus lanes also allow cycles (and taxis). The exceptions tend to be the contra-flow type where pedestrian railings etc make them unsafe.
Obviously the buses need care but much safer than keeping out of their lane and mixing with rest. IF the cyclist here made a mistake it was 'keeping out of the way of traffic'.
I'd be riding a good metre+ out from parked cars so as to avoid the door zone altogether.
|
>> A thread for cycling chat....!
>>
Is that something you get off an incorrectly adjusted saddle?
|
The current Brommy suffered it's first puncture on 3 Jan. At three and a half years from new that's a pretty good ad for the optional Schwalbe Marathons.
Got the bike home by tube on Friday and sorted tyre Saturday. Glass chip close to sidewall had worked its way under the kevlar. As Mrs B was away took opportunity to hi-jack the kitchen as a workshop to do a proper service.
Chain tensioner was well gunged up and on dismantling had little if any lube on guide/tension wheel bearings. A smear of graphite grease added and everything cleaned up. Four new Aztec brake pads fitted and callipers cleaned, fettled and re-centred. Derailleur mech cleaned and re-lubed.
Both tyres were showing splits and damage; new ones ordered from the ever wonderful www.simpsoncycles.co.uk/ . Check ride, adjustment etc and time reserved this weekend to fit new tyres which arrived Tue. Really satisfied at end of day - job well done.
FF to this afternoon and fitting of tyres that arrived midweek - disaster. Marathons are notoriously difficult to get onto the rim. Front went on ok but not without a deal of sweariness The rear had me resorting to tyre levers; always a no no for fitting. Got it on at second attempt then dropped tensioner and chipped jockey wheel. At same time wheel nut rolled under fridge.
Anyway, finally get it all together and inflate tyres. Fornt was fine but rear......
Just as I forced in last 3 psi to get 100 BANG!!!! - sidewall split just where I'd used tyre lever. Bits of exploded inner all over kitchen and Mrs B cursing!!
SO I'm on the old red L5 for the rest of the week and another £20 to Mr Simpson for third tyre.
|
Oh the joys of cycling Bromp !
In between my inadvertant forest dismountings today ( jeez my back, leg, shoulder, pride hurts ! ) my son and I came across a guy in company with some other mud-ists on a snow bike. Never seen one for real before. Not a lot of call for them in Cheshire I guess.
However, the chap was telling us it works really well on mud. I'd need convincing I think. Something like these...
www.fatbackbikes.com/#
|
>>However, the chap was telling us it works really well on mud. I'd need convincing I think.
You can bet it will be hard work pedalling that. OK for you super fit types.
|
|
Don't feel particularly fit right now M ! I really must sell some bikes. I seem to have about 4 more than is reasonable...
|
Oh dear. Mine is on the Brompton kevlar green's, so far so good, but it's only done about 300 not very urban miles, I started using the rough bike instead when the weather turned.
Aren't the Marathon Plus supposed to be the Daddy? I thought they were the worst to fit?
|
>> Oh dear. Mine is on the Brompton kevlar green's, so far so good, but it's
>> only done about 300 not very urban miles, I started using the rough bike instead
>> when the weather turned.
>>
>> Aren't the Marathon Plus supposed to be the Daddy? I thought they were the worst
>> to fit?
I found the Brompton tyres short of grip in urban settings; alarmingly so on wet manhole covers or thermoplastic road paint.
Marathon Plus are supposed to be even more trouble to fit than Marathon standard though I'm not sure how they could be.
|
|
Don't think I'd realised you ran such high pressures on the Bromps. I put 40psi in my mountain bikes or drop the back tyre to 30psi when the going gets sticky. The guy with the snow bike told me he uses an amazing 4 psi ! Seems impossibly low.
|
That fat snow bike is a prime candidate for motorization. Doesn't seem to have telescopic front forks either. Low pressure tyres probably just as absorbent but with reassuring handling.
I'd have one, but only with the motor.
|
I've gone over to fitting Marathon Pluses (onto 700c rims) and have found them decidedly more difficult to fit that the standard Marathons. After much swearing and cursing, and just before I was about to resort to levering one on, I found that if I spent extra time seating the new tyre rims well into the 'well' of the wheel-rim, I could ease the last bit of tyre rim onto the wheel. It certainly called for a cup of tea when the job was finished!
I hate punctures, though, and wouldn't now consider using any other type of tyre.
|
Marathon Plusses can be a real pain to fit.
Do you use a strap or some sort of rope - er - tourniquet to keep the bit of tyre that has been fitted in place on the rim? Otherwise as you happily fit the tyre using your thumbs, the thing is unfitting itself behind you!!
|
>> Do you use a strap or some sort of rope - er - tourniquet to
>> keep the bit of tyre that has been fitted in place on the rim? Otherwise
>> as you happily fit the tyre using your thumbs, the thing is unfitting itself behind
>> you!!
Hadn't thought of the tourniquet approach using perhaps a luggage strap. Tried to wedge it with a tyre lever but keeping that in place while easing the bead in at other end needs three hands.
|
Curses !
Normally, at this time on a Sunday, I'm to be found heaving mountain bikes onto the roof of the Qashqai with a view to a forest trail outing.
However, the snow hasn't melted and indeed it is snowing now. I fear no amount of persuasion will convince anyone, including myself frankly, that such a trip would be the best idea today.
This in turn though brings its own consequences. It hasn't actually happened yet but my psychic powers predict a list of DIY jobs being suddenly seen as urgent...
:-(
Last edited by: Humph D'Bout on Sun 20 Jan 13 at 09:55
|
|
Many jobs can not be carried out in the cold, for numerous technical thermal reasons....
|
"Do you use a strap or some sort of rope - er - tourniquet to keep the bit of tyre that has been fitted in place on the rim? Otherwise as you happily fit the tyre using your thumbs, the thing is unfitting itself behind you!!"
Sorry, Duncan, I've only just spotted this addition to the thread.
I re-fettled my old Dawes Easystreet with Marathon Pluses a couple of months ago. The old tyres were 35c Marathons, but I moved them onto my daughter's bike because they had turned out to be wider than my original tyres and tended to catch on the mudguard stays. The replacements were 28c Marathon Pluses and I must admit, I was beginning to think that they were impossible to fit. They would pop out just as I was getting to the last bit and I suspect that it would have been easier if a second person might have been useful to hold the tyre in place during the operation. Just as I reached the point of blowing a fuse, I realised that great progress could be achieved by making sure that the rim of the tyre (the bead?) was pushed into the 'well' of the rim.
Once that was in place, the operation could be completed using just my (arthritic) thumbs. With that knowledge, the second tyre was much, much easier; and I could attack it with more confidence know that it WAS possible!
I was reluctant to try and ease the tyre on with any sort of lever as I can still remember, as a kid, using a screwdriver to lever the tyre on, only to re-puncture the inner tube.
|
Yes, they are a pig to fit, but worth it I feel.
Once or twice, I got very close to saying, "Oh blow this".
|
Meant to add to this a week or two ago:
Replacement tyre duly arrived. Tried the 'tourniquet' approach (using a Rohan webbing belt) and together with tip about keeping bead low in rim it worked fine.
Now halfway through overhaul of old five speed. The Sprinter hub has been sucessfully dismantled and part cleaned. Still need to do planet assembly and replace what I suspect will turn out to be a worn selector key.
New chain and sprocket to ordered along with a new and smaller chainwheel so as to reduce overall gearing and get a low ratio comparable with the newer BWR six speed.
|
Driver who knocked Bradley off his bike has accepted a safety awareness course.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lancashire-21442987
A good outcome on the whole though I worry others might see it as a let off.
|
|
Need a budget mountain bike to share between family around village and on hols. There is one on ebay very near here finishing soon that looks OK but it has rear suspension which we all hate. Wonder if I can just make up a fixed link to replace the spring and if this would affect anything?
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 15 Feb 13 at 01:31
|
|
Just about to buy No 2 a new mountain bike. So before I do, what's up with rear suspension?
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 15 Feb 13 at 01:31
|
Whoops forgot to change topic..
From a personal perspective for casual UK use on/off road I don't like the bounce. Mrs F and the teens like front suspension as it can take the shock out of arms/wrists but on my own bike I don't even have front suspension by choice.
Perhaps on a £2000 bike it's better sorted but on cheap bikes it's rubbish.
Not a problem for under 11s though as they don't seem to compress the spring unit enough to get the bounce to a degree they notice.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Thu 14 Feb 13 at 22:33
|
>> Just about to buy No 2 a new mountain bike. So before I do, what's
>> up with rear suspension?
Do you really need it at all? Quality suspension may add something in real downhill 'black route' stuff. In a budget MTB to be ridden on roads and basic forest type tracks it adds weight, complexity and cost for zero gain.
Teach the kids to suspend themselves by getting ass off saddle over rough stuff and taking weight between pedals and bars.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Thu 14 Feb 13 at 22:39
|
|
Always seems to me that rear suspension seems to soak up some of your peddling effort and makes them harder to work.
|
>> Always seems to me that rear suspension seems to soak up some of your peddling
>> effort and makes them harder to work.
Always seemed that way to me too. At least on cheap bikes.
|
|
Yes that's why I hate suspension. Also I prefer to feel the front tyre through the handlebars on rough ground and a cheap spongy front suspension spoils that aspect.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Thu 14 Feb 13 at 22:55
|
>>Do you really need it at all?
I truly have no clue. However, it would appear to be something that you need to make a positive decision to take or avoid.
I know that my wife has suspension on the front and is a darn sight more pleasant to ride in the Andes than mine is.
But currently none of the bikes have rear suspension, not have I ever knowingly ridden one that does.
|
I can think of three potential problems.
One is that you need some elasticity or give. A single pivot design, which is probably what the bike has unless it's a fancy one, with a very rigid rear triangle will be a very solid ride if the spring is replaced with a rigid link.
Another is that the removal of the spring will potentially apply shock loads to parts that aren't up to it, and something will break quite quickly (maybe even catastrophically).
The third is the fabrication of the rigid link. It will be in compression so needs to be beefy and well attached to be safe.
On top of all that you'll still have a horrible heavy bike when you've finished.
It would be easier to find a non-suspension one if that's what you want. I hate suspension on bikes, allowing that the Brompton has a small rubber lump - but that's partly a function of having a hinged rear triangle for folding purposes.
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 15 Feb 13 at 01:34
|
Yes I guess you are right on all points. If this bike comes cheap I'll get it anyway and just leave the suspension on with the adjuster turned up to max.
It's a model that had a retail of £250 in 2005 and I'm thinking of about £40 now. At that price we don't have to lock it outside the shops or worry when it's left outside the pub on our hols.
|
>> allowing that the Brompton has a small rubber lump - but
>> that's partly a function of having a hinged rear triangle for folding purposes.
Horses and courses. The Brompton's rubber block allows a slight flex, perhaps a little more than a full size steel rear triangle but far less than the equivalent on an MTB .
You don't see a Brommy flexing like the bargain basement folder I followed down Holborn nightly for a few months until it's owner surrendered. Indeed there's a stiffer block as an option on the B and riders can 'tweak' either using a jubilee clamp around the rubber block to influence te spring rate.
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 15 Feb 13 at 01:34
|
I wouldn't buy a bike with rear suspension for a child or an adult for that matter unless it was a quality set up with the intention of getting seriously offroad and airborne. All it achieves outside that narrow window is the addition of weight and the transference of pedal effort to the spring as opposed to the wheel.
I'm seen as a bit of a heretic among my mountain bike buddies in that I also don't entirely agree with front suspension either. I'm ( against my better judgement in an effort to drag myself screaming into the 21st century ) running quality sussy forks on my current main bike but I hate them and most of the time lock them out unless I'm pounding down a seriously rough descent.
Even then, I don't believe you get absolute control on the rough stuff or anywhere else when your wheel can move in four directions. As for the comfort / shock absorbtion well, I'm old school and for me that's what your knees and elbows were very cleverly designed for long before bikes were invented. Decent quality, appropriate width/tread tyres inflated to suit your bodyweight, the conditions you're riding in and your skill levels are far more important in my humble.
I'd sort of decided to persevere with my front sprung forks for a while but I suspect sooner or later I'm going to switch them for some carbon rigids. Just got to think of a way of sliding the couple or three hundred notes that'll damage me under the radar of the domestic chancellor...
Where you most feel the weight of both front and rear suspension is when climbing. Front especially on cheaper forks with no lockout as you're pushing against the spring effect. Even with decent forks ( and make no mistake even a pair of forks at <£500 are going to be rubbish never mind a whole bike ) the lateral twisting momentum when rough surface climbing is just horrible.
One of my oldest bikes, an early alloy framed job but with no suspension is also my fastest. It's failing in other areas and needs a lot of work or else I'd just use that all the time. Also it has rim brakes which are ok in the dry but utterly useless in the gloop.
If you're going to get down and dirty on any kind of regular basis it's well worth going for disc brakes but there's no need to be seduced into paying extra for hydraulic brakes. They just add cost and faff. Some say they're smoother than cables but I frankly can't tell the difference and I can adjust a cable without getting off the bike or even stopping if need be.
The guys who take this stuff really seriously are starting to go back to steel frames ironically enough ( see what I did there? ) Some of them feel the weight penalty is worth it for the extra flex steel provides. Alloy frames and even posh carbon ones don't fail often but when they do they tend to snap as opposed to bend/flex. That can be, at the very least, inconvenient depending on the circumstances you find yourself in when it happens.
In short, I'd strongly advise not buying a rear suss bike unless it's a class act and needed for a serious purpose. Finding a quality full rigid is though quite difficult at the moment too due to the fashion for front suspension but with the rise in popularity of 29" wheels ( most if not all mountain bikes have long been 26" until recently ) more are becoming available as people begin to realise you actually don't need or benefit much from primitive front forks which do nothing but reduce control and add weight.
If you do go for something with front suspension at least ensure it has a lockout switch or you'll be huffing and puffing your way up hills unnecessarily. The suspension is really only of any benefit when facing downhill on a rough surface or jumping. The rest of the time it's just deadweight.
|
I thought last night what we needed was an overview from a cowboy boot wearing downhill racer... log in this morning and there it is!
Useful info thanks. As I added above for the purposes of this worry free (theft) knockabout bike we'll put up with the suspension. Anyway even in our new just off the fen location it's quite flat so some of the suspension issues are not so crucial.
I'm interested in the control issue you mention with sprung front forks because it fits well with my totally non-expert feelings.
My own is a 30yr old non-descript rigid steel frame mountain bike which has just evolved a little with new handlebars, gearchangers, chainwheel/crank set and tyres to suit my use. It rides perfectly but was about 1" or so too large in the frame when I bought it all that time ago and now I'm twice as old it's feeling a little tall to get on/off.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Fri 15 Feb 13 at 09:15
|
Yes, sorry about the verbosity above, sort of got into it and warbled on !
Your old bike sounds mighty fine. Frame quality in that era was very good and if you've upgraded the running gear it's probably a good mount. I still have, stuck up on my garage wall, one of the very first decent Californian mountain bikes ever to come to these shores. Basic in the extreme by today's standards and I'm ashamed to say I've not ridden it in years but I can't quite part with it. It took me to places it shouldn't have been able to and I sort of feel it deserves a decent retirement.
As an aside, the "catherine wheel" accident I had some weeks ago probably ( although one can never be certain ) wouldn't have happened if I'd been riding a rigid.
The front wheel dug in on a steep fast descent and of course the front forks compressed throwing my weight further forward than I wanted causing or at least contributing to a series of forward rolls. Had I been on rigid forks I still think It'd have rolled through upright albeit untidiliy.
Of course it was not least due to rider error/arrogance and the ravages of advancing years...
|
|
A work friend is a MTBer. He has several bikes including his "downhill bike" that only ever gets pushed up hills and ridden down. Whether he goes in for rear suspension I don't know, but I do recall being incredulous at hearing what he paid for a set of suspension forks - into four figures.
|
Some do cost a fortune Manatee. The best topical analogy I can think of is that as with cars, you can get a good bike for not much money but it tends to be better to go for a simple machine with good basic components if you decide not to stretch the wallet. In other words, for a £4k car budget you'd get a really very good second hand Fiat but you'd get a really bad and utter shed of a supercar.
For those new to offroading or indeed those returning to it I'm a big fan of Halford's Carrera ranges. Reasonably equipped bikes at affordable prices which perform a lot better than they should. To continue the analogy, they're sort of where Fords are in car terms.
A friend of mine gave me an old Carrera some years ago when he was clearing out his garage. I still use that sometimes when my "good" one is in for fettling or when I'm going to have to leave a bike parked for any length of time and don't want to attract vermin.
|
You're right about the Carrera range Humph... few years back had some insider info on that range and they were well thought of by those involved in chosing them to buy/stock.
Anyway... I won Zebedee and rode it home yesterday. Springs front and rear on a very firm setting and it didn't feel too bad so that will do rather than my initial fixed link idea.
Seemed quite "draggy" on the road though (not brakes) and on checking it has 2.35 tyres. Never had wider than 1.95 before... I do always run an aggressive Michelin off road tread. It needs one tyre replacing and I'm thinking of swapping both to that smaller width.
Any thoughts?
|
|
Depends what you're going to use it for. Knobblies are great if you will normally be in mud or on very loose surfaces. For recreational dry trail riding and road use a narrower smoother tyre will be much better. Do not buy nylon knobblies. Waste of space. Rubber grips much better in poor conditions but will drag on tarmac.
|
It is true currently 80% of my use is on road but we have some great green lanes (wet/dry grass/earth/mud/tractor ruts), field edges and harder (loose gravel/dust) farm tracks locally which complete circular routes with the quieter roads. Happy to put up with slight disadvantages of chunky tyres on road for the off-road section grip. No real hills here just slopes so no high speed dowhill madness. In a way my off road stuff is more like motorcycle trials riding than motorcross.
I've never had an issue with 1.95s on the existing bike and the 2.35s look like moped tyres to me so I reckon I'll downsize on the springy machine.
BTW if you had a moment to look what mixed use tyre would you choose up to £20 or so?
Last edited by: Fenlander on Mon 18 Feb 13 at 10:06
|
|
For a budget tyre I'd favour Continentals but you might struggle to get them for £20. I see Halfords have a thing called Michelin Country Trail for £18. No idea if they're any good but at least they're rubber. Probably fine.
|
Ok thanks... I get the idea. Those Country Trails are about 75% as knobbly as the Michelin Wildgripper I've been using for years so could be a good choice. Available on Ebay for £26-95/pr with free delivery which seems value.
I looked at Continentals, again affordable on Ebay. Mind you I looked at one of their models and wondered if I really wanted"Rubber Queen" in bright letting on my tyres!
s3.amazonaws.com/CyclistNo1/assets/continental-rubber-queen-29-big.jpg
|
|
Actually, looking again, I'd maybe go with the Michelin Country Dry for what you describe. Be fine for a bit of light trail riding and a whole lot nicer on road.
|
>>>Michelin Country Dry
Will that really cut it for image outside the village shop... that old bloke who only goes out in the dry?
After getting the main bike sorted to my modest needs over some 30yrs so (apart from an over-height frame) it is just perfect quite amusing to be dropping a toe into the world of tyre choice to the Nth degree, brake block toe-in and suspension sag calculations.
I will resist the endless spend!
Last edited by: Fenlander on Mon 18 Feb 13 at 10:46
|
>>I will resist the endless spend!
Heh heh, you say that now...
:-)
|
Now then, when the bug bites ( and it will )...Here's a great starter bike, good price too...
tinyurl.com/aqcsjfd
|
www.car4play.com/redirect.php?http://tinyurl.com/aqcsjfd
Nice looking bike... moped tyres again though.. and are the forks leaning back a lot... wonder what that does for the handling? Anyway I'm much to tight (well when considering cycling) to pay £400 for a bike. Over some 30yrs the old one only cost around £200 in total to buy, upgrade few bits, service, replace tyres/brake blocks etc.
I've solved the tyre issue on the new machine, It'll get the Michelin 1.95s from the old bike. Decided at long last to retire my old too tall rigid one in favour of this springy beast. I'm taking the old machine's tyres, saddle, recent chain, handlebars and possibly chainset/gears/brake levers to fine tune the new bike. I'll hang the old frame high in the garage roof but I doubt it will see the road again.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Tue 19 Feb 13 at 11:06
|
You boys and your mountain bikes, Pfffft.
REAL off-roaders ride one of these -
www.wiggle.co.uk/colnago-world-cup-20-2013/
|
|
I sort of know what you mean but my 30yrs of REAL off roading (as opposed to playing at it in competition) would not be served by having my backside in the air and nose on the front tyre.
|
After watching last September's Tour of Britain from a couple of vantage points as it passed through Norfolk, we dropped in at the cafeteria at the old Reepham railway station. I cannot think of a nicer place for a cup of tea and a bun! [that's a firm recommendation]
As I sat slurping tea, my eyes settled on a beautiful, gleaming, red road-racing bike; it was truly a work of art! I had to take a closer look. "It's his pride and joy", volunteered the owner's wife, "it only comes out on high days and holidays!".
It was all carbon-fibre - well, apart from the tyres, and most of its weight came from the water-bottle strapped to the frame!
I hadn't heard of the maker before ........ but that was a Colnago.
The rider volunteered that he had paid over £2K for it, but he foresaw more second hand ones coming to the market in a few years time when enthusiasm waned following recent cycling publicity. "They might be nice and light", he said, "but you still have to pedal 'em!."
|
>
>> I hadn't heard of the maker before ........ but that was a Colnago.
>>
>>
The Ferrari of the road bike world. Many of the bikes you see in the professional peloton are Colnagos, repainted and badged in the colours of the sponsors own chosen brand of machine.
|
>>>"They might be nice and light", he said, "but you still have to pedal 'em!."
Probably the most important thing to consider in all of this cycling stuff. Our doctors has cycling mags in the waiting room and that's the only time I look at high end stuff. Last week I read a comparative test on seat posts up to £120. The text reminded me of high end speaker cable blurb.
|
Now then Fenlander, I do hope you're going to tell us you've been getting down and dirty on your new mount this weekend?
We've just got back from a 30-odd mile forest trail trip. Damn cold for the first few miles. 3C and trying to snow but eventually the old bones stopped creaking. Did the same fast technical descent that was my nemesis a few weeks ago at one point and managed to stay on the bike this time so that particular demon is conquered ! Having done it though, and high fived the lad at the bottom we were both put to shame by a a young, possibly german guy who followed us down the same trail showboating like crazy. Pulling stoppies on his clearly state of the art machine on near vertical loose surface sections. Had a chat with him at the bottom of that valley only to discover that he was into major jargon. Started bending on about optimum gyroscopic forces and suchlike. I just ride 'em and don't think too hard about how !
Might treat m'self to a whisky now...
|
>
>> Did the same fast technical descent that was my nemesis a few weeks ago at
>> one point and managed to stay on the bike this time so that particular demon
>> is conquered
Was your crash like this one?
www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/cycling/21567089
|
Er, no, I went bottom over breast two or three times before coming to rest on an exposed tree root more or less inserted where the sun don't shine...
:-(
Last edited by: Humph D'Bout on Sun 24 Feb 13 at 17:20
|
|
That's why we were taught to get onto our backs if we came off a motorbike. You spread the load over maximum area.
|
I stuck with the bike Tom, doing a sort of catherine wheel impression, I suppose I might have had some vague notion of recovering the situation. That didn't happen...Too old...Too creaky...
:-(
|
>>>Now then Fenlander, I do hope you're going to tell us you've been getting down and dirty on your new mount this weekend?
Indeed but not in the way you'd think. I have a rule with 4WD vehicle buying to avoid those that have actually been used off road... either farmer or weekend warrior types (www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNybnRkj-MY ) ... the compacted mud and extra wear is best avoided.
Buying this low end mountain bike blind on ebay I didn't actually expect it would have ever left the street.... wrong... he was a keen trail rider and in the light of day I found while superficially shiny the bike had every working part clagged up with a hard packed grease/silt mix.
So yes a down and dirty weekend stripping every moving part cleaning/greasing/ajusting every pivot/link/bearing race. Swapped over the tyres from my old bike and fitted 4 new brake pads.. now just waiting on a new chain to replace the gritty old one before I see how it goes newly serviced.
However you were obviously referring to my "real off roading" comment. It was made flippantly as I hate folks who draw their own line in the sand... put themselves above it... then say they are "real" cyclists/off-roaders/horse riders/motorists/hi-fi nuts etc etc and look down on the "non-reals".
My riding is different to yours in that the bike is secondary to its use... it's a tool to be used when needed. Doesn't remove the pleasure though... been riding a bike most days of most weeks of most years for around 50yrs now and never lose that feeling of freedom as you pedal off to wherever. Be it riding to the local PO with a rucksack of ebay parcels as this morning... exploring coastal paths on hols... or riding farm tracks and field edges trying to keep up with a horse.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Mon 25 Feb 13 at 11:43
|
|
Well, we had rain and even possibly snow forecast today but on the contrary it has been gorgeous weather. Coldish but sunny and bright and not a breath of wind. A bit gloopy in places on off road forest trails but really refreshing air. Good to be alive sort of day.
|
Brighton Indie band British Sea Power have produced a video to go with their album Machineries of Joy. Filmed in Kent it features former triathlete Kate Tiernan and a seventies retro road bike.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHUes0dGjUI
Cycling as it should be; wind in the hair and a smile on the face.
|
>>>I won Zebedee and rode it home yesterday. Springs front and rear on a very firm setting and it didn't feel too bad...
Posted the above about 6wks ago... and in the end that's as long as I could stand the bounce so yesterday went to a large city used bike dealer and test rode a few to get one that felt just right. Ended up with another old school rigid mountain bike but with a 3" smaller frame at the saddle (due somewhat to a slightly sloping back crossbar) than my original one of 30yrs which makes it just right for current use.
Of course I couldn't not fiddle so the garage loft spares store was raided and it is now even more just right with replacement saddle, wheels, tyres, sprocket set, handlebars/stem and my favourite handgrips.It's about 4lbs lighter than Zebedee too.
Perfect weather to get out on it this afternoon.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Sun 7 Apr 13 at 10:15
|
Wise decision Fenlander. Bad suspension is worse than no suspension. In fact for most purposes a rigid is best. As you say, they're lighter and much more controllable. We mainly use hardtails ( front suspension only ) for off-roading but with lockout forks so they can be made rigid for climbing or smooth surfaces. A non lock out setup at either end is an utter liablity. When climbing you're just pushing against the spring and losing energy instead of transferring it to the drivetrain.
Full suspension bikes are a very niche thing. The "inexpensive" ones are just daft and the real deal versions are horrendously dear. Even they though tend to be favoured by the "all the gear but no idea" brigade !
Enjoy your new bike !
We're off to get muddy just shortly as it 'appens !
|
|
Must get the Stumpjumper out again: not been using it for some time. Solid, very rigid, with semi-slicks, light. Last used over Longridge Fell. Feels very secure on downhill sweeping bends on the forest track, but I'm not very brave:) Amusing on wet grass when you get wheelspin in any gear: a necessary compromise as I rode to the Fell rather than drive up.
|
|
Speshy eh? Nice bikes. Your semi-slicks will be fine in the dry even on loose surfaces I guess and as you say much nicer on tarmac. I've got Kenda Kinetics on my main bike at the moment which are almost the opposite being pretty much tractor tyres in a very soft compound. Pigs on a smooth surface though, very draggy, but they've been great over the winter on snow and ice covered forest trails. Really incredibly secure. I'll change them for something less aggressive over the summer.
|
|
Winter tyre discussion eh..;)
|
|
Now I'm using my bike 2 or 3 days a week for cycling instruction, it was overdue a service last week. The book of words calls for removing the Shimano Nexus gearbox and dipping it into horribly expensive special oil. The Net says that ATF is just as good and cheaper. I chose the latter route and the gears have never been so sweet. New rear sprocket as the original was badly worn. Grease the roller brakes, run some oil into the pedal bearings and then investigate the bottom bracket. Yuk! The cartridge was sitting in a gloopy pool of rusty water and oil so I've drilled the frame to allow drainage and overnighted the cartridge in the recently-vacated tub of ATF. A new cartridge is in the post but the old one is holding up for now. Cable inners and outers separated for a dab of grease. Chain cleaned and oiled, dubbin on the saddle and it's ready for another year of mixing it with all manner of driving styles in Darlington, pub visits, shopping and commuting. Strictly road and track, very little mud involved but a lot of interaction with horses, dogs, walkers and motorists.
|
Got my bike out yesterday, I went on a 10 mile ride, mostly off road on rocky paths via the Mersey. It is an extremely well made bike, its three years old now and all I had to is put a little bit of oil on it and pump up the tyres.
The problem is its so damn clunky and heavy, or maybe I am just so unfit.
|
Good for you Rats ! Now we have the light nights, if you do half an hour on the bike every other evening or so and one longer run at the weekend you'll feel great within a month.
Forest was stunning today, a bit busy with walkers and horses near the access roads and car parks but once away from those areas it was deserted. Still some snow lying in shaded areas but signs of Spring growth appearing here and there.
8C and sunny which was just fine. The last few weeks of lower temperatures really ripped your lungs out on the steeper bits.
Both my wife and I got fairly airborne more than a couple of times which is perhaps unseemly at our age but "the son" was doing it so it had to be done...
Good day out.
|
Having listened to previous advice I bought No 2 daughter a bike with no suspension. So thanks for that, it was immediately obvious as the correct thing.
But another question;
My wife's bike has street tyres on it since she believes that mountain trails exist but she's never seen one. Mine has off road tyres. Now her bike is sooo much easier to ride around the streets its amazing.
How much of this is likely to be down to the tyres? (her bike is also better quality than mine, or at least 6 years newer).
Now the children's bikes have off road tyres. However, for 6 months of the year we cycle in the city (the mountains are snow covered). Would it be worthwhile getting another set of wheels with street tyres on them? We do tend to cycle often and far.
Finally, if any of you lot ever fancy some silly biking off road, then may I recommend this part of the world.
|
|
Mark, for sure the tyres will make a big difference. I wouldn't bother buying new wheels though. Just get some slicks or semi-slicks to fit and they'll be fine. If you have the hang of it changing the tyres is a 5 minute job.
|
Agree with Humph, the road tyres will make a huge difference. Even changing from a nondescript tyre on a roadbike to a quality make can turn an average bike into a very good one.
Tyres are your only contact with the road and on a vehicle with a relatively tiny power output like a bike they make the biggest single performance difference of any component.
|
>> Agree with Humph,
Me too. Changing the original tractor tyres on my Claud Butler Ravanna for some pretty basic slicks with tracked shoulders transformed it's on road ride. No worse on the forest tracks and disused railways that are my off road limit either.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Sun 7 Apr 13 at 19:18
|
Not sure what to with my tyres, they are nobbly kind and slicker tyres will be better for the road. The problem is I do cycle round the Mersey valley a lot which has some rocky paths and a lot of gravel paths.
Not sure if road tyres would be suitable for that sort of environment.
|
Ok, so it sounds like an obvious thing to do and I shall.
I'm a little bit concerned by RR's comment that the quality of the tyre can make so much difference though;
How on earth do I know what is a nondescript tyre or a good one? And does the quality of that tyre matter that much [within reason] since in the end it is a bike for a child riding around with her family?
Thanks for the help and sorry I know so little about this.
Last edited by: No FM2R on Sun 7 Apr 13 at 21:10
|
If you look on the internet retail sites such as Wiggle or Chain Reaction and go for a reputed brand such as Michelin, Continental or Schwalbe you'll get a decent tyre even on their budget ranges. Good tyres have a flexible sidewall that rides the bumps and lets the tyre roll well plus a more puncture resistant and grippier tread. Child or not she still has to power the bike under her own steam and something that glides across the road will be far easier to ride than the knobbly suction cups fitted to most MTBs.
More people are put off cycling by naff equipment that anything else.
Last edited by: Robin Regal on Sun 7 Apr 13 at 21:23
|
Ok, that funny noise you can hear is me sitting in the corner rocking backwards and forwards humming to myself.
I just looked on Chain Reaction. Dear God, when did it all get so complicated?
The tyres all seem to be things like 700x25c and I don't understand what that means.
At the moment the bikes have 26x1.95, 24x2.00 and 24x2.125 and I would merely like to take the given advice and put some reasonable, mid-range tyres suitable for road riding.
It rarely rains here, and I wouldn't cycle in it if it did. Mostly the tarmac is ok, but it can sometimes be a little dodgy. Kind of like a UK country B road, I guess.
I would like something much easier to cycle, but not something which is going to puncture all the time.
I know I'm asking a lot, but could you give me a pointer please.....
|
>> I just looked on Chain Reaction. Dear God, when did it all get so complicated?
>>
>> The tyres all seem to be things like 700x25c and I don't understand what that
>> means.
700x25 will be tyres for a road bike, e.g. slick, or semi-slick for a bike with drop handlebars.
>> At the moment the bikes have 26x1.95,
26x1.95 will be knobbly type tyres for a MTB.
Evans Cycles web site has some very good explanatory sections.
|
Absolutely agree with you RR, especially your concluding remark.
Don't suppose you have a branch of Halfords handy where you are Mark. However, I'm also sure there will be a decent bike shop available (if the internet isn't the best local route). They'll put you right with appropriate tyres.
Rats, if most of your cycling is/will be off road and you're not likely to be in a hurry, the knobblies will be fine and the best option, you'll get fitter quicker too...
|
|
I do cycle on the roads as well, but the ability to go off road is also a must. Scenic cycling is a lot more fun, and it is not really practical to cycle to my office as I usually have to transport computers, and its not a nice journey to cycle (too many busy roads).
|
One example for you Mark. Slightly narrower than you've got but your rims will take a range of widths.
www.wiggle.co.uk/continental-tourride-city-mtb-tyre/
|
|
Thank you RR, should I be overly concerned about width?
|
Halfords? No, not really. However, if I can find what i should buy on the internet, I should then be able to buy it locally.
Being steered by someone here and advised as to what to buy, when you don't know yourself, is not smart. You will end up with whatever they have in stock that they've been unable to sell to anyone else.
|
|
I have found Chainreaction very good if you email them with your query, they will reply quite quickly with recommendations .
|
BBC4 - Madness on Wheels - Manatee
