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Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 13 Mar 15 at 13:35
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>> Gary Glitter guilty.
>>
>>
Hardly a surprise.
Given his age and the nature of the offences I doubt he'll be out again.
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>> I doubt he'll be out again.
That's pretty much what they said on the news at tea-time.
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>> >> I doubt he'll be out again.
>>
>> That's pretty much what they said on the news at tea-time.
Is that a problem?
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>> Is that a problem?
Not at all. He'll be able to share a shower again with the old gang.
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Its funny init, perverts never age well.
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>> Gary Glitter guilty.
And jailed for 16 years
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-31657929
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>> >> Gary Glitter guilty.
>>
>> And jailed for 16 years
>>
>> www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-31657929
I'm sure he will be well looked after in prison.
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>>I'm sure he will be well looked after in prison.
Yeah - he'll also discover why jail time is referred to as "doing a stretch"
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I reckon he'll find he's not Leader of the Gang after all.
He may also live to regret Do You Wanna Touch...
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>> >> >> Gary Glitter guilty.
>> >>
>> >> And jailed for 16 years
>> >>
>>
On the same news bulletin I heard that the next story was about a nursery worker who raped a three year old among other things and got eight years. I can't see why that offence only merited half of Glitter's term.
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Gadd's record is hardly unblemished.
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>> Gadd's record is hardly unblemished.
>>
Absolutely true, but the rape of a 3 year old should be life with a very long minimum.
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Rolf's been quizzed again as well.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-31156427
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>> Rolf's been quizzed again as well.
And now stripped of his CBE.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-31711252
He has already lost a Bafta fellowship and accolades in his native Australia.
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>> lost a Bafta fellowship and accolades in his native Australia.
Nasty brute.
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'Orrible as Glitter and co are, it seems rather perverse to me that the media are far more interested in reporting on washed-up old celebs from the 70s/80s than in what is going on right now. I see another 20 chaps of Asian origin have been rounded up on drugs/rape charges by Northumbrian police.
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>> I see another 20 chaps of Asian origin have
>> been rounded up on drugs/rape charges by Northumbrian police.
They've been charged and reporting restrictions are therefore in place. Not much more to be said than names (which suggest Asian roots), addresses and offences on charge sheet.
More will emerge at trial.
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>> I see another 20 chaps of Asian origin have
>> been rounded up on drugs/rape charges by Northumbrian police.
Would you have said "Fred West - the chap of English Origin". "Dr Harold Shipman, The Doctor of English origin" Garry Glitter "the chap of English Origin" ?
If not (and I am sure you wouldn't) why not?*
IS the point you are trying to make the one that says as a country we are deliberately not reporting the child abuse cases you refer to, because the alleged perps are of Asian Origin?
Or maybe, the real reason that Garry Glitter gets reported widely is because being famous, he is deemed more newsworthy and will sell more newspapers.
You think that might be the real reason perhaps?
*It was of course right and proper to report Peter Sutcliffe as The YORKSHIRE ripper. The world needs to be warned about these damn northerners.
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I believe the main reason is the subliminal link to the Rotherham case being created. Wonder what the Police/CPS Press release said.
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>> I believe the main reason is the subliminal link to the Rotherham case being created.
>> Wonder what the Police/CPS Press release said.
The report on the BBC Tyne/Tees page is very brief indeed, no mention of names. Bit more in the local paper:
www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/northumbria-police-charged-20-people-8587632
Press may be aware of risk, however remote, that overt links to Rotherham might prompt defence to suggest a fair trial is not possible.
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It's also true to say that the Casey report and interpretation being placed on it have provided ample material for press to trumpet about Asian men and white girls without mentioning Tyneside too.
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"Would you have said "Fred West - the chap of English Origin". "Dr Harold Shipman, The Doctor of English origin" Garry Glitter "the chap of English Origin" ?"
I suppose that, for a long time, 'English' was taken as the default position unless stated; if not, it's e.g. 'Rolf Harris, the Australian entertainer'.' - as it was first reported.
You are correct though, there is no need to say where the miscreants come from - let's face it, when it's perpetrated on an industrial scale, they are unlikely to be a bunch of yokels from Norfolk, are they? ;-)
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>> You are correct though, there is no need to say where the miscreants come from
>> - let's face it, when it's perpetrated on an industrial scale, they are unlikely to
>> be a bunch of yokels from Norfolk, are they? ;-)
Sex for sale, on a sale that counts locally as industrial, wil be present in Norwich and Ipswich and I dare say services are available to Felixstowe's tuckers too. A fair proportion of it, perhaps even most, will be abusive in nature and linked to gangs and the supply of drugs and alcohol.
White guys are perfectly capable of keeping their end up in the vice trade. I doubt the MO of picking up and grooming vulnerable girls from care or damaged homes is unique to areas with an Asian population either.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Fri 6 Feb 15 at 15:07
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"Sex for sale, on a sale that counts locally as industrial, wil be present in Norwich "
Clearly, you too have walked down Rouen Road in Norwich.
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I
>> doubt the MO of picking up and grooming vulnerable girls from care or damaged homes
>> is unique to areas with an Asian population either.
>>
>>
That being so, where are the reports of gangs of non-asian men with same MO? Is it not being investigated, not reported?
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>> That being so, where are the reports of gangs of non-asian men with same MO?
>> Is it not being investigated, not reported?
Portrayed as gang/street/drug crime and not reported nationally. Girls seen, as was initially case in Rotherham, as complicit rather than victims. For that reason not investigated, again a problem in both Rotherham and Rochdale.
Possibly smaller groups within which girls passed round and who compete for territory and fight each other. Indeed it may be the oddity with the Asian cases that there is not the territorial angle.
Such shenanigans in various areas of London were reported in The Standard pretty regularly.
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>> >> That being so, where are the reports of gangs of non-asian men with same
>> MO?
>> >> Is it not being investigated, not reported?
>>
>> Portrayed as gang/street/drug crime and not reported nationally.
Rather odd, I would have thought abuse being in the news it would make some national news. Have you a link for these local/regional cases?
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>> That being so, where are the reports of gangs of non-asian men with same MO?
>> Is it not being investigated, not reported?
Yes Garry Glitters gang. You wanna be in his gang, his gang, his gang
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>>
>> >> I see another 20 chaps of Asian origin have
>> >> been rounded up on drugs/rape charges by Northumbrian police.
>>
>> Would you have said "Fred West - the chap of English Origin". "Dr Harold Shipman,
>> The Doctor of English origin" Garry Glitter "the chap of English Origin" ?
>>
>> If not (and I am sure you wouldn't) why not?*
>>
>>
Clff Richard, Asian-born pop star?
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"Clff Richard, Asian-born pop star?"
Should have been convicted years ago for his singing.
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>> Should have been convicted years ago for his singing.
Why? Pleasant voice and sings in tune. If you'd said 'for his choice of songs' I would have agreed though.
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"Why? Pleasant voice and sings in tune. If you'd said 'for his choice of songs' I would have agreed though."
Yes indeed - I should have said 'for singing .......... awful songs' [actually, one or two of them weren't too bad]
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As I understand it, the Rotherham debacle was news, not specifically that it was carried out by men of Pakistani heritage, but that it was ignored and suppressed for so long BECAUSE they were of Pakistani heritage.
That is the scandal which was allowed in the name of multiculturalism, or maybe, just plain cowardice on the part of those whose jobs depended on there being no "racial" waves being made.
The PC industry can add this to its list of costly blunders.
Last edited by: Roger. on Fri 6 Feb 15 at 16:54
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>> As I understand it, the Rotherham debacle was news, not specifically that it was carried
>> out by men of Pakistani heritage, but that it was ignored and suppressed for so
>> long BECAUSE they were of Pakistani heritage.
That's the narrative those of your persuasion and some of the press would like to prevail.
Louise Casey's report describes much deeper malaises. Included amongst these are persistent belief that the girls were willing and complicit, even where they were under 14, 'turf wars' between youth workers and social services and a a culture of bullying amongst both councillors and officers.
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>> That's the narrative those of your persuasion and some of the press would like to
>> prevail.
Maybe.
Or it may be the truth, ignored and excuses offered by those of your persuasion.
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>> That's the narrative those of your persuasion and some of the press would like to
>> prevail.
>>
But that doesn't mean it wasn't part of the problem, tbh I'd be surprised if it wasn't some sort part of the story.
Last edited by: VxFan on Sat 7 Feb 15 at 01:41
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>> But that doesn't mean it wasn't part of the problem, tbh I'd be surprised if
>> it wasn't some sort part of the story.
In the sense of a reluctance to tackle the issue yes. The Casey report includes misplaced 'political correctness' amongst the issues she found. It's bit part stuff though compared to the sexism, bullying and wider suppression (for reputational reasons) which she found.
This inspection revealed past and present failures to accept, understand and combat
the issue of Child Sexual Exploitation (CSE), resulting in a lack of support for victims
and insufficient action against known perpetrators.
The Council’s culture is unhealthy: bullying, sexism, suppression and misplaced
‘political correctness’ have cemented its failures. The Council is currently incapable
of tackling its weaknesses, without a sustained intervention.
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>> In the sense of a reluctance to tackle the issue yes.
When I first saw this, various family experiences suggested it would be an issue.
Last edited by: VxFan on Sat 7 Feb 15 at 01:41
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>> This inspection revealed past and present failures to accept, understand and combat
>> the issue of Child Sexual Exploitation (CSE), resulting in a lack of support for victims
>> and insufficient action against known perpetrators.
>>
>> The Council’s culture is unhealthy: bullying, sexism, suppression and misplaced
>> ‘political correctness’ have cemented its failures. The Council is currently incapable
>> of tackling its weaknesses, without a sustained intervention.
>>
Political Correctness is a major part of the problem, not a bit part.
People in roles like that think that 'their' way is the right and only way... then comes the bullying to ensure you comply....bung in a bit of ridicule for not being supposedly up to date.... suppression of anything that might go against their beliefs: e.g. ignoring criminality or anti-social behaviour from members of a BME* (Black or Minority Ethnic) background because if you challenge it you are racist for highlighting someone from that particular BME... and on it goes.
The good news is, that sort of crap is now being challenged... and not before time.
The BBC is a good example.
* don't bother correcting me if the term BME has been superceded.. that's what it was when I left that sort of environment, what I've posted wasn't intended to offend anyone and it covers what I need to say.
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>> * don't bother correcting me if the term BME has been superceded.. that's what it
>> was when I left that sort of environment, what I've posted wasn't intended to offend
>> anyone and it covers what I need to say.
>>
I know you said that, but's BAME now...
Seriously, that post echos alot of family members experiences. In their cases the bosses were petrified of being accused of racism.
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>> Seriously, that post echos alot of family members experiences. In their cases the bosses were
>> petrified of being accused of racism.
>>
I could bore you all to death with a considerable amount of evidence from my old field.
The daft thing was, my no nonsense approach was welcomed by many and I had no beef whatsoever from anyone from any kind of background that could be considered a minority for the whole of my 31 years service... (despite the fact there is an incredibly robust and intrusive complaints system)... not one sniff of anything and when you think I ensured two were sacked, one from a visible BME and another from a prominent religion... no Employment Tribunal, no complaint, no Federation hoo-hah...nothing.
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And something odd about the policeman that died in a road accident in Rotherham being investigated there?
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-31164399
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>> I could bore you all to death with a considerable amount of evidence from my
>> old field.
Many of their experiences were from the same field.
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>>Political Correctness is a major part of the problem, not a bit part.
You and I will never agree on this but having read both Professor Jay's and Louise Casey's reports I'm left with overwhelming impression that basic problem was a failure by both Rotherham Council and South Yorks Police to see the girls as victims rather than complicit participants.
Same with Lancashire cases and Rochdale Council/Greater Manchester Police.
In both areas earliest arrests were were girls or relatives kicking up, not the perps.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Fri 6 Feb 15 at 20:26
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>> You and I will never agree on this but having read both Professor Jay's and
>> Louise Casey's reports I'm left with overwhelming impression that basic problem was a failure by
>> both Rotherham Council and South Yorks Police to see the girls as victims rather than
>> complicit participants.
>>
>> Same with Lancashire cases and Rochdale Council/Greater Manchester Police.
Yes, you are absolutely correct.
Then you need to ask yourself, 'why is that?'
.... and the answer is....it's on the too difficult pile. Opens a can of worms. Too much weariness if you dig deeper....
No one wanted to investigate any Pakistani heritaged Muslim men.... easier not to.... and that is directly because of political correctness.
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>> Then you need to ask yourself, 'why is that?'
>>
>> .... and the answer is....it's on the too difficult pile. Opens a can of worms.
>> Too much weariness if you dig deeper....
>>
>> No one wanted to investigate any Pakistani heritaged Muslim men.... easier not to.... and that
>> is directly because of political correctness.
>>
What I should have added, is the irritance that if Mr Average did somehting to a lesser degree, but still wrong...the whole of officialdom would come down on him like a ton of bricks... yet some who really need some investigation and intervention lead charmed lives.
That is plain wrong.
To clarify I am not advocating a softly softly approach to this subject matter...i'd rather a robust approach to all of it.
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> >> No one wanted to investigate any Pakistani heritaged Muslim men.... easier not to.... and
>> that
>> >> is directly because of political correctness.
>> >>
>> To clarify I am not advocating a softly softly approach to this subject matter...i'd rather
>> a robust approach to all of it.
My argument, based on the analysis of both Casey and Jay, is that the issue was entrenched sexism around the position of the girls in the Police and RMBC. They were treated as authors of their own misfortune, willing and complicit in their situation. Indeed some of them saw themselves that way, believing themselves in relationships with the men who groomed them. It was that bit that was, like persistent returnees to domestic violence, that was regarded as 'too difficult'.
It's not just that nothing was done either, in both Rochdale and Rotherham the first people to be arrested were girls and/or family 'kicking off' over the situation.
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"right and proper to report Peter Sutcliffe as The YORKSHIRE ripper. The world needs to be warned about these damn northerners. "
Made me laugh - and I'm a Yorkshireman!! ;-)
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>> "right and proper to report Peter Sutcliffe as The YORKSHIRE ripper. The world needs to
>> be warned about these damn northerners. "
>>
>> Made me laugh - and I'm a Yorkshireman!! ;-)
Another of those occasions where, like over Cit cars, you and I have similar thoughts.
I was born at Hyde Terrace Hospital in Leeds.
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'increased significantly in size'
That happens to me around a milf.
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>> 'increased significantly in size'
>>
>> That happens to me around a milf.
Not enough to alert the authorities tho.
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Probably not enough to alert himself, Z.
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It appears from the aerial photograph that Sir Cliff lives in the Parthenon.
No marbles, of course.
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Floods of 'further allegations' against Jimmy Savile and Cliff Richard have suddenly been made. Good old Jim is beyond mortal reach now, and jolly good riddance, leaving all eyes focused on poor old Cliff and persuading the police to have another go at him.
'Historic allegations' are dodgy more often than not. Either Cliff is worse than we thought or he's being martyred. Bit of both perhaps.
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>> Floods of 'further allegations' against Jimmy Savile and Cliff Richard have suddenly been made.
Given he's dead Savile's wrong doing is effectively proven, no need for the niceties and formalities around courts and proof beyond reasonable doubt. Plausibility or at best balance of probability is enough. And I don't for a minute think that means he was any less of a monster. Still living he'd undoubtedly have gone down for a very long stretch.
In Cliff's case we're still at stage of 'allegations'. Since the much publicised raid others, over and above the male claiming casualty at Bramhall Lane have come forward. They're still being investigated and unless/until there's a charging decision and any resultant trial he's innocent, albeit reputationally besmirched.
What's also clear about Savile is that plenty of frontline staff saw what was going on but were not believed. Furthermore I suspect it was made clear their careers would suffer if they persisted with their allegations.
I hope today's landscape would be more receptive to any whistle-blower and that the 'PC' need to vet people with access to children and vulnerable adults is fully recognised.
It's probably not though.
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>> and that the 'PC'
>> need to vet people with access to children and vulnerable adults is fully recognised.
>>
>> It's probably not though.
>>
Good point. The thing is though that 99% of people being vetted are one assumes absolutely above reproach so the irksome procedures appear merely to put off good people from bothering to volunteer any more.
But are the procedures actually effective in trapping the bad ones? JS would perhaps have sailed through the modern vetting system precisely because no one dared to record anything, so his record would be clean.
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You may be right Cliff.
OTOH, if JS were subject to same Enhanced check as teachers etc it might possibly have thrown up police suspicions of him.
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>> 'Historic allegations' are dodgy more often than not.
But one can't help believing the accounts of Savile's sadism and disgusting stench from women he abused when they were girls, sometimes very young girls.
One assumes Cliff Richard's boy squeezes were treated more gently and fragrantly on the whole (of course one could be wrong). But now there's this Gadd geezer. He doesn't sound very nice.
Crap music too actually.
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There is going to be quite a few people in this boat, but I only know of the one case. There is a chap who got the CBE for his services to education, but has not worked since about 2006 as he fails a CRB test.
The reason for the failing is that he was convicted of gross indecency and did a few months of jail time way back in the 60s, but he'd not even be prosecuted now, and not even at the time in some other countries. The crime? He kissed his boyfriend in the supposed privacy of his own home and somebody saw it though the window.
Apparently he can apply for a disregard of this now, but I don't know the details as I'm quite remote from the case.
Last edited by: Slidingpillar on Thu 26 Feb 15 at 20:14
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>> The crime?
>> He kissed his boyfriend in the supposed privacy of his own home and somebody saw
>> it though the window.
Gross indecency was considerably more than that.
Definition of gross indecency
A sexual act that is more than ordinary indecency but falls short of actual intercourse. It may include masturbation and indecent physical contact, or even indecent behaviour without any physical contact. It is an offence for a man to commit an act of gross indecency with another man unless both parties are over 18, consent to the act, and it is carried out in private. This is punishable by up to two years' imprisonment or, if one of the parties is under 18, by up to five years' imprisonment. It is also an offence to cause or arrange for a man to commit an act of gross indecency with another man, even if the act is carried out in private and between consenting adults.
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>> >> The crime?
>> >> He kissed his boyfriend in the supposed privacy of his own home and somebody
>> saw
>> >> it though the window.
>>
>> Gross indecency was considerably more than that.
The 'offence' was in 1960 so modern definitions around consent at 18 are off beam before we start.
and it is carried out in private Fact they were seen through a window was enough to kill privacy as a defence.
You must have joined police about same time I became a Civil Servant; 1979/80?
Even then, the urge to catch 'queers' in flagrante was pretty strong. Coppers looking through skylights in public bogs, that kind of thing. That was at least the view of my 1979-82 colleague JM who was first 'out' gay man I ever met.
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>> You must have joined police about same time I became a Civil Servant; 1979/80?
Cadets Sept 1980.... PC at Training School: Dec 1981
>> Even then, the urge to catch 'queers' in flagrante was pretty strong. Coppers looking through
>> skylights in public bogs, that kind of thing. That was at least the view of
>> my 1979-82 colleague JM who was first 'out' gay man I ever met.
It wasn't quite like that.
If gay activity became a problem e.g. toilets, then it would be looked at.
There was a corner of Hyde Park that had the nickname of Gobbler's Gulch. I do remember driving the area car (Rover 2600 SD1) slowly down the footpaths in darkness until you get to a certain point, then letting rip with main beam... but if I'm honest it was more the fun of seeing people run for it grabbing their trousers than it ever was catching anyone.
Not nice for tourists to take a stroll through Hyde Park on a nice summer's evening and find a load of men lurking in bushes.. is it?...and I'd think the same for the modern day activity of dogging....sod off and do it at home or somewhere private.
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>> Not nice for tourists to take a stroll through Hyde Park on a nice summer's evening and find a load of men lurking in bushes.. is it?...and I'd think the same for the modern day activity of dogging....sod off and do it at home or somewhere private.
I can only agree Westpig.
But we're talking about deviant sexuality here. I have the strong impression that the risk of being caught at it or unmasked is an important part of the buzz for the numerous gays who have a masochist leaning. I have it more or less from the horse's mouth so to speak, although old Dobbin may be trimming the truth a bit.
Another possible reason for public sex is that it simply isn't possible at home. People who are 'bisexual' (which I always take to mean homosexual) may have wives and families they don't want to upset by coming out. Or they may be youngsters whose parents would be upset.
I like the story about the sudden mainbeams and chaps fleeing without their pants. But then I'm not queer. It was a tiny bit unkind really.
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>> I like the story about the sudden mainbeams and chaps fleeing without their pants. But
>> then I'm not queer. It was a tiny bit unkind really.
>>
Yeah, you're right.
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As I said, I'm a bit removed from the 'guilty party'.
Gross indecency was considerably more than that.
Definition of gross indecency
A sexual act that is more than ordinary indecency but falls short of actual intercourse. It may include masturbation and indecent physical contact, or even indecent behaviour without any physical contact. It is an offence for a man to commit an act of gross indecency with another man unless both parties are over 18, consent to the act, and it is carried out in private. This is punishable by up to two years' imprisonment or, if one of the parties is under 18, by up to five years' imprisonment. It is also an offence to cause or arrange for a man to commit an act of gross indecency with another man, even if the act is carried out in private and between consenting adults.
But although you say the offence is more than a kiss, which lets face it, could have been a snog, the fact it was an act between two men, thought to have been in private but wasn't, does fall into the definition you then give.
At the date of the 'offence' any sexual congress between men, or any age, in private or not was illegal as date is pre-Wolfenden report.
But, even if this was more, the 'offence' no longer exists and there is a total justification for CRBs or the enhanced version to be a reporting of convictions of current offences.
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>> news.sky.com/story/1440761/thatcher-turned-blind-eye-to-paedophile-mps
>>
>>
>> what next?
You mean "what MP will making and dramatising unfounded allegations and accusations to ensure he gets re-elected in a ward where child abuse by the previous mp is a hot issue" next?
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>> news.sky.com/story/1440761/thatcher-turned-blind-eye-to-paedophile-mps
>>
>>
>> what next?
Simon Dancuk, who now sits for Cyril Smith's former constituency of Rochdale, has a strong interest in these matters. Some might describe him as verging on obsessive. Nonetheless, if there are dossiers that go beyond rumour and hearsay and into facts that are corroborated, then there is a case for publication.
I'm not sure the event's around Cyril Smith's knighthood are linked. Smith was a prominent Liberal backbencher from his by-election victory in 1972 until he retired in 1992. He's reported to have been a hard working and diligent constituency MP. My Father had relatives in Rochdale who would have corroborated that. It's therefore quite natural that his leader would nominate him for an honour. At that time the only evidence against him was a charge, many years earlier, that didn't proceed. Corporal punishment was, regrettably, standard process in children's homes and the like until the seventies. Whatever Smith's motives when he smacked boy's backsides punishment would have been plausible cover at the time. On that basis he was given the benefit of the doubt.
The reluctance to disclose paperwork around his knighthood probably has more to do with setting a precedent than an attempt to 'cover up' activities that are now all but proven post mortem. It's a bit silly for the media to conflate the stories.
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One of Herself's cousins called today, worried that a convicted child molester has been lent a house here for a fortnight. There are varying numbers of children of all ages here. The fiddler may or may not have actually fiddled, but he's been strongly suspected of it in India and in an African country. The cousin's view was better safe than sorry, we don't want people like that living here. I completely agree. Nothing to recommend the cat.
The putative fiddler is an old friend of some other cousins I normally see as straitlaced, but they simply won't admit he's dodgy by definition, he's their buddy and that's that. He was fitted up in India and mud sticks, etc. etc.
Get the picture? It's weird. But I think the geezer will be seen off whether he deserves it or not. His faction is not a majority.
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>>The fiddler may or may not have actually fiddled,
It's probably your wicked uncle Ernie, Sire.
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Wot, the fastest milkman in the west?
No... Hat, coat, door.
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>>Wot, the fastest milkman in the west?
I was thinking of a track from www.lyricsfreak.com/w/who/fiddle+about_20146677.html
But you are probably too young to remember that Sp ;-)
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The Who were formed when I was five...
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I don't have any wicked uncles Perro. I used to have one who wasn't really wicked, just a bit caddish (a major in WW2), but he's dead now. I was down on him in my puritanical youth but now remember him as rather sweet (he may not have been, but he tried to be nice to me once).
I'm an uncle myself now of course. It's a responsible role, far too grown-up for me.
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>> It's probably your wicked uncle Ernie, Sire.
I don't have any wicked uncles Perro. I used to have one who wasn't really wicked, just a bit caddish (a major in WW2), but he's dead now. I was down on him in my puritanical youth but now remember him as rather sweet (he may not have been, but he tried to be nice to me once).
I'm an uncle myself now of course. It's a responsible role, far too grown-up for me.
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>>I'm an uncle myself now of course.
So am I Sire. An uncle to 8. A great uncle to 11, and great, great uncle to 2.
:o}
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>> wicked uncles Perro. I used to have one who wasn't really wicked, just a bit caddish (a major in WW2), but he's dead now.
My mother had another brother who died before I was born. My father had three brothers though. One was embittered and depressed, lacking in conversation, never recovered from a wartime affair with an opportunistic German woman, spent the last 20 years of his life sitting in an armchair smoking himself to death on 60 a day. Another went off to South America and became rich (and a bit caddish, notoriously stingy and very boring). The third and youngest was jumped-up, snooty and supercilious, a bit caddish himself finally. He was an industrial chemist and went off to South Africa where I thought he belonged ideologically.
All three were morally dwarfish compared to my old man who had brains, culture and a sense of humour. I was lucky in both parents and a few other things too. Without that unearned privilege I'd have died in the gutter years ago.
Uncles are a funny lot and a mixed bag. Aunts in my case were more genial and user-friendly. Indeed my own favourite uncle was no relation, just the second husband of my mother's sister. Her first husband was said to be a fine fellow too, a bomber pilot and friend of my father.
Can't think why I'm saying all this. My family are an odd and disparate lot.
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>>My family are an odd and disparate lot.
I think most large families are. I had an uncle who had a mental breakdown when he was in his twenties. He ended up in Bexley Psychiatric Hospital. I remember going to see him when I was a young toerag, he seemed to enjoy being in there - no responsibilities of course.
He was never the same afterward, he always had 'trouble with his nerves'
He used to self-medicate with Carlsberg Special Brew etc. until he died age 77.
He was a worker though - always on-the-go, mainly decorating, spending the money on the gee gees and beer. He was diagnosed with non-Hodgkin lymphoma when in his mid 7o's, but died quite peacefully at home in his chair, when his aortic aneurism burst - way to go!
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It was my good fortune that my father was studious and cultivated from an early age, which made him as it were radical and classless. He and the younger of his two sisters also had a certain warmth of feeling. Their other siblings all had a sort of working-class Bristolian coldness. My father's decision to marry a penniless, small, pretty, slightly barmy woman he met in Malta, who looked and sounded 'foreign', earned both of them sidelong looks for years. A bit envious, a bit admiring.
The worm's-eye view I had of all that took a bit of sorting out at the time, but in the end gave me, I like to think, some insight into the subtleties of British 'racism'. Don't think me pretentious.
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>>Don't think me pretentious. >>
What you?
Never!
Last edited by: Roger. on Tue 10 Mar 15 at 18:38
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>> pretentious. >>
>> What you?
>> Never!
Hignorant Rastaman!
It's a valid perception. I didn't want to seem to make too much of it or sound vainglorious. But I suppose one always does to some people.
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>>Don't think me pretentious.
Judge not, that ye be not judged.
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What an utter scumbag. If we're not going to execute him then we should work him.
Loss of freedom is significant punishment, but its not paying anyone back. Why shouldn't he now work to help the society he harmed?
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>> Loss of freedom is significant punishment, but its not paying anyone back. Why shouldn't he
>> now work to help the society he harmed?
What on earth do you think this slug can offer to society? As my part of society the only thing I want from him is to rot in jail.
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He can lick the roads clean. He can clean sewers. Then he can rot in his cell at night.
He should never be let out, we're not going to execute him, so make the b****** work.
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In the same way as you'll never see another Jimmy Savile Top of the Pops*, at least you'll never hear another Gary Glitter track on the radio.
*In case you're all missing him here's a moderately rude song from 2006 with a variety of amusing comments amongst the dross.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=QK01f5_aKY4
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Gadd damaged young girls, some children, and richly deserves his 16 years in jail.
But he didn't harm 'society'. He wasn't the only nonce around. One more or less makes no difference in damage to society terms.
Acually Savile was an exception in this respect: he did in a way single-handedly damage society. I think.
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>>
>> Acually Savile was an exception in this respect: he did in a way single-handedly damage
>> society. I think.
>>
But he did perhaps in the end demonstrate just how gullible and spineless people in responsible positions can be.
A bit like that experiment where people can be induced to torture others out of disinclination to disobey authority.
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Glitter's persistent offending is pretty disturbing but for me there was a real devil in the detail of the latest court case. One of the victims was about 12 and went with her mother (a Glitter fan) to his hotel after a gig where the mother willing offered the daughter to Glitter on a plate in return for the mother getting off and spending the night with Glitter's co-writer and producer (Mike Leander) in his hotel room.
What a sickening failing of parental responsibility... she should have been in court beside him.
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>> sickening failing of parental responsibility... she should have been in court beside him.
Yes, disgusting and depraved behaviour. And how stupid can you get? Nasty mucky children shouldn't be allowed to have children. It's tempting to advocate sterilisation for people like that.
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Scotland Yard said a 71-year-old man had been arrested "under the strand of the investigation we have termed 'Others'."
The Met Police has not named Clifford.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-31861567
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................and now allegations of mass grooming, as in Rotherham, in Sheffield, apparently.
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Operation Yewtree - Volume 24 - Robin O'Reliant
