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An excellent article, Roger. Thanks for posting it.
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What's this rubbish bout a bloodless coup? Williamites landing at Brixham England was invaded by a large and well-trained foreign army, initially 21,000 men but later increased, that was brought in November 1688 on 500 ships. The English army ran off, in essence. Some skirmishes, some early deaths.
The fall-out was felt more in Scotland and Ireland where William was resisted. Jacobite rebellion: Glencoe, Boyne, Killiecrankie with many more deaths.
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Yes we like to forget the Dutch invasion and pretend that our island has remained inviolate since 1066
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>> Yes we like to forget the Dutch invasion and pretend that our island has remained
>> inviolate since 1066
Lest we forget 1797 and the Battle of Fishguard
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>> >>
>> Lest we forget 1797 and the Battle of Fishguard
>>
Aye, we were the last place in Britain that had to fight those dastardly foreign hoards off.
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>> >> >>
>> >> Lest we forget 1797 and the Battle of Fishguard
>> >>
>>
>> Aye, we were the last place in Britain that had to fight those dastardly foreign
>> hoards off.
Get out of it, they came ashore, saw the place and surrendered.
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Didn't the Channel Islands get invaded?
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they did. Last time by the Germans in WW2. But the Channel Islands are not Great Britain.
Last edited by: Zero on Sat 23 May 15 at 21:24
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I think you will find they are. They are not part of the UK but they are part of Great Britain and the only part of Greqt Britain to be invaded in the war. Residents are British citizens.
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Geographically Great Britain is the landmass that constitutes England, Wales and Scotland.
Politically it includes the islands attached to these 3 nations (Wight, Anglesey, Hebrides, Orkney and Shetland in particular).
It does not include the Channel Islands or the Isle of Man - they are self-governing
Last edited by: Lygonos on Sat 23 May 15 at 21:34
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Yea you are correct.. They are of course part of the British Isles, a geographic term, and are a Crown Protectorate and their citizens are British subjects,although not necessarily British citizens so technically the invasion of the Channel Islands did not constitue an invasion of Great Britain.
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>> I think you will find they are. They are not part of the UK but
>> they are part of Great Britain and the only part of Greqt Britain to be
>> invaded in the war. Residents are British citizens.
They are not part of Great Britain, they are a crown protectorate. They are British Subjects, but a passport issued to a Jersey Citizen is issued by the Jersey Government and does not for example give the same rights of employment in the EU.
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>> They are not part of Great Britain, they are a crown protectorate. They are British
>> Subjects, but a passport issued to a Jersey Citizen is issued by the Jersey Government
>> and does not for example give the same rights of employment in the EU.
Great Britain is a geographical term covering the landmass of England/Scotland/Wales. It can be assumed to cover off islands such as Wight , Anglesey, the inhabited Scottish Isles and probably Man too.
The Channel Isles though belong geographically to France.
Citizenship is a different question.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Sat 23 May 15 at 22:06
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The Ordnance survey provides a clear explanation. The Channel Islands ae part of the British Isles.
www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/blog/2011/08/whats-the-difference-between-uk-britain-and-british-isles/
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What about the Falklands !?
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I have been geographically enough confused by watching Australia appearing in the Eurovision Song Contest.
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>> What about the Falklands !?
What about Gibraltar?
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>> The Ordnance survey provides a clear explanation. The Channel Islands ae part of the British
>> Isles.
>>
>> www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/blog/2011/08/whats-the-difference-between-uk-britain-and-british-isles/
Although that article shows the CI on the maps the logic by which they're taken to be part of the British Isles is not clear. The text describes them as being GB, Ireland and the 5000 or so islands around our coast.
Given the proximity of CIs to France it's not clear how they fall within that description.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Sun 24 May 15 at 08:08
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I've always seen the CI discribed as part of British Isles, never france.
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>> I've always seen the CI discribed as part of British Isles, never france.
I agree they're often described as such, and if the description is about allegiance and politics then in a sense it's correct.
But purely geographically surely they belong to the Cotentin peninsula of France?
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No i don't think so. Never thought or seen it as such tbh.
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>> No i don't think so. Never thought or seen it as such tbh.
Looking at a map it seems plain as a pikestaff to me but this forum would be useless if we all agreed.
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There is an argument in logic for what you say but I'm afraid common usage is against you.
The Oxford dictionary gives:
"A group of islands lying off the coast of NW Europe, from which they are separated by the North Sea and the English Channel. They include Britain, Ireland, the Isle of Man, the Hebrides, the Orkney Islands, the Shetland Islands, the Scilly Isles, and the Channel Islands."
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The Channel Islands are a Crown Protectorate. They are not part of The United Kingdom.
So says Wiki:-
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Channel_Islands
Last edited by: Duncan on Sun 24 May 15 at 05:14
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Two weeks from now I shall be in Jersey for a few days. Should I be afraid?
Is gin expensive there? We drink lots of it. Beer too.
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>> Two weeks from now I shall be in Jersey for a few days. Should I
>> be afraid?
>> Is gin expensive there? We drink lots of it. Beer too.
I think you will find drinks expensive compared with those in the north of England. Probably more comparable with those in the SE. My local pub was charging £3.70 a pint for Fuller's Olivers Island this week.
Last edited by: Manatee on Sun 24 May 15 at 10:38
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>> Two weeks from now I shall be in Jersey for a few days. Should I
>> be afraid?
>> Is gin expensive there? We drink lots of it. Beer too.
Nothing is cheap there. Except car hire.
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>> The Channel Islands are a Crown Protectorate.
>>
The Channel islands are not a constitutional entity. Jersey and Guernsey are individually crown dependencies.
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>> >> The Channel Islands are a Crown Protectorate.
>> >>
>>
>> The Channel islands are not a constitutional entity. Jersey and Guernsey are individually crown dependencies.
Sark was until recently a Baronial Fiefdom, now its a Barclay Brothers fiefdom.
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>>Nothing is cheap there. Except car hire
Are hire cars still number plated H there? According to residents it stood for Horror Car but I found I experienced the horror when a local, throwing his weight about, cut in on me in my H car. I thought of reporting him but a self-exiled Jerseyman told me not to bother, the police and courts would always discount a mainlander's complaints against a resident. Have posters any recent experience of this?
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>> >>Nothing is cheap there. Except car hire
>>
>> Are hire cars still number plated H there? According to residents it stood for Horror
>> Car but I found I experienced the horror when a local, throwing his weight about,
>> cut in on me in my H car. I thought of reporting him but a
>> self-exiled Jerseyman told me not to bother, the police and courts would always discount a
>> mainlander's complaints against a resident. Have posters any recent experience of this?
Got friends in St Helier, and lived on Guernsey for a year - have hired cars there many times, last time about 3 years ago. Cant remember if it still had the red H or not, but either way locals do not try and throw their weight about with H drivers, they try and steer clear of them. Tho it has to be said, the locals do think the H drivers are a little pedestrian on the road, and have a tendency to stop when they think they are lost. None of them realise that if you just keep driving you will hit the coast pretty quickly. You can't get lost there in the true sense of the word.
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>> Sark was until recently a Baronial Fiefdom, now its a Barclay Brothers fiefdom.
>>
The Barclay brothers own the island of Brecqhou, not Sark.
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>>
>> >>
>> >> Sark was until recently a Baronial Fiefdom, now its a Barclay Brothers fiefdom.
>> >>
>>
>> The Barclay brothers own the island of Brecqhou, not Sark.
You need to check up on how they have expanded.....
Last edited by: Zero on Sun 24 May 15 at 13:14
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We shall not be hiring any cars. Easy 13/18 mile linear walks each day around the coast, using public transport. Those in our group not walking will be partaking of liquid refreshment at lunchtime, hence no car hire.
Need to see if there is a Spoons, although our 'tour manager' is on the case for the best beer n grub in an evening.
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>> Need to see if there is a Spoons, although our 'tour manager' is on the case for the best beer n grub in an evening.
>>
So far as I can see, this is the nearest Wetherspoons to St Helier.
tinyurl.com/qaxjglz
Not too far..
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I think the Lamplighter will become our regular evening boozer...
A couple of my friends are open water swimmers but it's a long way home after last orders.
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Legacy, does your ale expertise extend to the Lake District?
We have a family holiday coming up, at Coniston; my daughter found a rental cottage there that will accommodate her and husband, my 7-month-old granddaughter, both sets of grandparents and my son/her brother.
Last time we stayed near Coniston I struggled to find a decent pub. The house is very near the Sun which we have tried before and should have been good (good choice of ales, pleasant surroundings) but to say the staff had not been sprinkled with the dust of hospitality would be putting it kindly - young, untrained, uninterested casual staff and no obvious supervision. For some reason I find myself resenting forking out to feel like a nuisance. A glance at Tripadvisor suggests it hasn't improved (most frequent rating "Terrible")
The Wilson Arms at Torver was OK, but one I can walk to in the village would be handy.
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Sadly my experience of lakeland pubs is quite extensive! As you say, the honey pot areas suffer from lack of hospitality on occasion. We stayed at High Tilberthwaite Farm Cottage a few years ago and walked into Coniston every evening.
When in Ambleside I only venture inside the Golden Rule, or the Gilded Lily for live music (I like Molly Warburton music). Closer to the M6, I was chauffeuring recently after a day on the fells and drinking pots of tea, the Eagle & Child at Staveley ( Bird & Illegitimate as we know it) serves good food & drink, as does the Watermill at Ings, two miles further along the A591 towards Windermere.
Friends were in Coniston recently so will ask tonight when I see them in my local.
No experience of the pub in Torver. I steer clear because of a past indiscretion with a female!
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Thanks LL. The Golden Rule - a pal of mine lived up the lane just above it, so I knew it well decades ago. We called in a couple of years back and it wasn't much different!
We went repeatedly to the Lakes in the pre-child era, camping and hoping for dry weather...well I suppose that's why there are all the lakes. More recently we had a few days in Ravenglass, doing Wainwright's "walks from Ratty" - not challenging enough for you I suspect.
The cottage is on the path to the Old Man - we'll have to huff and puff up that at some point I expect, in justification of pints to follow.
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We normally drink in the Black Bull, or with the locals at The Ship. Friends of mine prefer The Sun, a larger selection of beers, but I'm not keen on the place.
Forget the OM. If you must go high, DowCrag via Goats Water. I then drop off to Walna Scar Road, head W 750 m, then due S to Water Yeat Bridge then E thru the plantation to Hummer Lane, then footpaths S of Torver to meet the Cumbria Way and follow the shoreline back to Coniston. About 12 miles tops, a bit more if you go over Dow Crag
OS OL6 is your friend
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Or walk to Ambleside. 11 miles and the second half of an LDWA Spring in Lakeland walk. We had a check point at the Coniston Institute before finishing at the Scout Hut in Ambleside. Let me know if you want very precise route directions!!
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>> We stayed at High Tilberthwaite Farm Cottage
>> a few years ago
Blimey, that took me back a few years. We stayed at High Tilberthwaite a couple of times when I was a kid. Probably 1970 and 71 so I'd have been 10 or 11. In those days it did Dinner, Bed and Breakfast as did many Lakeland farms. No menu, you just had what the farmer's wife cooked. The famryard was graced by a pair of geese. The gander did not like visitors at all and ran at you beak in the lead hissing like a snake!
My sister and I 'helped' feed the orphaned/abandoned lambs and were allowed to watch the farmer, a Mr Birkett IIRC, deliver a lamb.
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In, out - shake it all about. - Dog
