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e.on want to fit a SMETS2 meter for me. Their leaflet is coy about switching supplier subsequently, saying "It is *possible* that if you change supplier, your meter *may* start working like your old meter..." (My emphasis.) In practice, have posters had problems switching with SMETS2 meters?
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AIUI SMETS2 is interoperable between all suppliers - that's their USP. There are though some, including my own company SO which are not yet fitting smart meters. If you migrate to SO and have a smart meter what happens? The answer seems to be here:
help.so.energy/support/solutions/articles/7000046259-i-ve-got-a-smart-meter-can-i-switch-to-you-
In short it won't work.
Some wider information here:
www.smartme.co.uk/
www.smartme.co.uk/technical.html
Some local Citizens Advice have funding for energy advice. It may be worth speaking yours to see if they can help, it's sort of information an
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>> Some local Citizens Advice have funding for energy advice. It may be worth speaking yours
>> to see if they can help, it's sort of information an
Hit post too soon. Meant to say this is sort of thing an energy adviser would know and might give you an informal chat without having to jump through hoops.
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My understanding was that SMETS2 are the truly "open" standard meters with which you can change suppliers without the need for a meter change. All domestic meters will eventually be SMETS2 I believe.
I had a BG smart meter which was their proprietary version and which reverted back to an old style meter (without anyone doing anything) when I swapped to IRESA but it had to be swapped out to regain smart meter technology when IRESA went bust and I was moved to Octopus. Octopus fitted a SMETS1 meter which I believe will eventually be upgrade over the air to SMETS2.
it seems that many people are reluctant to get smart meters. I'm not sure why, I think they believe that Bog Brother is watching you.
There is conceivably something in that, though whether it matters I'm not sure. I get half hourly consumption data from my meter (on the following day if I want it, via their web page, a programme or attached to my electronic bill when it comes). I was messing with my data the other day and I can quite clearly identify when I may have put the kettle on or SWMBO had the tumble drier going. I can certainly tell which nights I have charged the car, and roughly the cost per event ( - there is a very cheap overnight rate for EVs which others have signed up to and fill their batteries or do their washing overnight. I usually run the dishwasher during that timeframe. It's just under 1/3rd of the daytime the cost for four hours).
As we also have a smart gas meter with half hourly readings I can also see pretty clearly exactly when the boiler fired up and what it cost. I will be interesting reading over the winter as I had a new, supposedly much more economical, boiler installed in March and I'm expecting to be able to identify very clearly my savings!! :-)
I suppose the other consideration in response to your question is whether the new supplier can access SMETS2. I *think* they all can but I'm not sure on that.
If anyone is interested in switching Octopus I have a referral code which earns me and you £50. They were certainly among the very cheapest when I was swapped, and say they are 100% green on electricity. My leccy tariff is about 13.5p daytime and 5p for 4 hours overnight but they do other tariffs.
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Bog Brother sounds terrifying.Is he really watching me? Not sureI want to use the bathroom now.
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Not bathing is an option ;-)
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SMets2 should be 100% amongst all suppliers
Smets1 should allow the data to be collected at a central point
and then sent to your supplier.
The Smets1 depends on a system being written by Crapita.
It should have been delivered ages ago but is still not in place.
Smets1 & 2 are use if you cannot get a decent mobile signal because of poor coverage or you have very thick stone walls.
All the big 6 want you to sign up to a new meter to get their "best deal"
I have moved from Npower to SO saving having to put in a new meter & save £120 / year
Text from Npower today offering me a better deal since they found out I was leaving.
They have dropped the daily standard charge & the fuel tariff effectively matching SO.
I do not go back to companies that try to screw me on renewal - I walk whether it is Energy, Insurance - did not walk from SKY as Virgin were the alternative & poor - long tales ofwoe dealing with my late MiL. SKY knocked off £40 after 2 weeks of my cancellation period instead of adding £10 every month.
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>>I do not go back to companies that try to screw me on renewal - I walk whether it is Energy, Insurance
I don't. Who cares? I like my nose on my face.
I just get the best deal I can and take that. You'd soon enough run out of suppliers otherwise.
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All of those that compete on price, which is probably 95%+ of the market, will try to screw you on renewal. It's how the market works. The sign up offers would be uneconomic if all customers paid the same.
I think TT actually say that existing customers can have the same deal as new ones But they won't get it unless they ask for it.
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>> Bog Brother. Is he really watching me?
I'm sure you'll be able to flush him out.
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My typing really is carp...!!!
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Stop yanking his chain...er...sorry
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>>it seems that many people are reluctant to get smart meters.
>> I'm not sure why, I think they believe that Bog Brother is watching you.
I read
New government requirements have commissioned energy companies to install smart meters in business premises and domestic homes by 2019 – but this is only if a smart meter is wanted by the household or business. The government requires that smart meters are offered by energy suppliers to all small businesses and homes, but smart meters are not a legal requirement, therefore it’s not compulsory to have a smart meter installed. However, having a smart meter at your premises is likely to become the norm in years to come.
I am fed up with being pestered on the phone and by mails shots.
I do not need a so called smart meter.
It will not save me money and will probably get stored in the cupboard for a minimum of 11.5 years :-(.
I can do without the disruption of some fitter fiddling about further disrupting my day.
I have no intention in the future of changing the way we use gas/ electricity and at present I am not concerned about costs/ meter reading.
My light bulbs were changed to LEDs mainly to stop me climbing steps to change bulbs.
I will advise the next caller that I am changing suppliers unless they cross me off their pester list. End...
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Crikey, you’ve got LEDs. I rather thought with those views on technological change Henry Villas basked in the glow of gas illumination
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>> Crikey, you’ve got LEDs.
>> I rather thought with those views on technological change Henry Villas basked in the glow of gas illumination
>>
I do have a rather nice brass oil lamp in the hearth that served my grandparents well so am also well prepared.
I was involved with tec with the BBC in the early 60s and computing since the mid 60s -starting as a realtime programmer on one of the largest commercial CPUs in the country.
( In those days very few even knew what RT programming was. )
Now I must get back to learning about my new Instant Pot cooker.
That will give more savings than a so called meter. :-)
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Each to his own but I found the meter a thing of interest in a hobby sort of way.
I managed to learn a bit of PERL to enable me to modify some cunning programmes my mate wrote for me to extract my consumption data from the Octopus servers (it's legal!)
I can now set my gas consumption against my electricity against my solar generation - essentially am energy dashboard in a pivot table. Never done much of that before, despite having been a programmer myself in the past.
I have an absolute mass of data which is updated daily but, having made a fair bit of effort to get it and work out what to do with it, my interest has pretty much passed. :-)
On a more practical level it does make you think about how you use energy, and maybe assists you to be more efficient. Certainly one of my daughter's saves quite a bit now compared to what she used to spend, without much effort, just by more wise usage, not by cutting back.
I realise that not everyone cares that much about the environment or their expenditure.
Smart meters will be the way forward soon, as we will no longer just be on one rate or maybe 2 with Economy 7. Have a look at Octopus's Agile tariff for a taste of things to come. octopus.energy/agile/
It's one reason why I'll likely be getting Smart white goods when I need to change them.
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>>On a more practical level it does make you think about how you use energy, and maybe assists you to be more efficient.
I wish someone could explain that to SWMBO, I've given up. Economy 7-no way. She's not having the laundry and dishes done in the middle of night.
There's only two of us in the house with a water meter outside. I've read it over the last couple of years and it's not economical to be charged accordingly. She uses the washing machine 2-3 times a day and the dishwasher at least once.
As for switching off lights................... although most are now CFL or LED.
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What are you washing in the washing machine 3 times a day?
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>> What are you washing in the washing machine 3 times a day?
Not me, her!
Wears something once and in it goes. Buys new jumpers, takes the old ones to charity shops. I'm often heard saying 'is that new'. To the reply 'no, you just haven't seen it before'!
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>> Not me, her!
>> Wears something once and in it goes. Buys new jumpers, takes the old ones to
>> charity shops. I'm often heard saying 'is that new'. To the reply 'no, you just
>> haven't seen it before'!
>>
That's an awful lot of clothes to wear per day. She's not in a one woman theatre production every day is she ;-) ?
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Watch that Economy 7 tariff. You certainly get cheaper off peak electricity but you will be paying higher than the standard rate during the day. Probably only worthwhile if you have storage radiators or charge an EV overnight.
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I had one put in at our old place by OVO. It was a bit of a faff to get them to turn up, in the first few months the cost went up by 10-15% weirdly.
The bloke who fitted it gave me a tablet thing then they sent another in the post. I think opened one lost interest and chucked it in a draw, I think the other went in the bin.
Can't say I'd bother with one again.
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I recently had both Gas and Electric meters replaced by a Smets2 set up, having got sick of refusing the offer.
It was a pretty quick job, though the first electric meter (which, AIUI, is the master for communicating the readings from both) refused to play ball, and had to be replaced by a second one off the van.
As I was talking to the sub-contractor, he stated that he'd have to report the electrical installation, as it was obsolescent. Nothing to worry about, but it is original (hence almost 50 years old, and re-wirable Wylex cartridges and no RCDs in the consumer unit).
I said I was considering getting it upgraded, but with only a master supply fuse, and no isolating switch for the meter, it was going to be inconvenient getting the supply company in alongside an electrician to isolate the supply before the upgrade. I had thought about getting an isolator fitted in advance of any work, as the last quote I saw was something under £150, and it then means any electrician can do work (legally, without pulling the master fuse and resorting to help from the seal fairy) without calling the supply company in.
Oh, he said, XXX (my electricity retailer) will fit those anyway. I've got one on the van, I'll put you one on!
So, between the failed and replacement meter fitting, he added me a supply isolator - no charge, so it saved me a fair bit, and I'm now positioned for a consumer unit replacement at my convenience. ;-)
The "smart" indoor monitor was comitted to a cupboard after a few weeks, though.
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>> Nothing to worry about, but it is original (hence almost 50 years old, and re-wirable Wylex cartridges and no RCDs in the consumer unit).
You could of course, pending an full upgrade, in the meanwhile update with " wylex mcb push button circuit breakers".
One screw per mcb to swap them. plenty , S/H of course available on line.
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Still don't have one and would resist a fitting for as long as possible, I still think something is going to come out about them in the future (just a feeling).
I've also heard that your data can be 'daisy chained' from one household to the next and the next until a strong enough signal is found to send the data, don't like the sound of that.
Don't like those really really annoying adverts with children exclaiming that I can save the planet by fitting one and that grating actor saying how much I can save... untrue because you only save by changing your usage NOT just by fitting a SM which is misleading.
Sorry SM really grind my gears.. no wonder they seem to feature on R4 Money Box so often.
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>> Still don't have one and would resist a fitting for as long as possible, I
>> still think something is going to come out about them in the future (just a
>> feeling).
>>
>> I've also heard that your data ............
Can you help me?
My tinfoil helmet is worn out. Where do you get your replacements from?
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>> Can you help me?
>>
>> My tinfoil helmet is worn out. Where do you get your replacements from?
I'll bring one round tomorrow, to you £330 quid. For an extra 200 quid i'll emf map your house so you know the safest place to stand and think thoughts.
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...will he be able top change suppliers with that tinfoil helmet....?
(btw, I'm not sure he'll be safe thinking thoughts, going by his previous record)
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Is your smart meter killing you, sounds like a headline from the daily mail.
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No! As PPI is waning.
The next barrage of unsolicited phone calls,
"Do you suffer from one or several of the following symptoms? If so you may have a claim"
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>> Some in depth research
>>
>> www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.prophesyagain.org/single-post/2017/03/22/Is-your-smart-meter-killing-you
>>
I have had all of those symptoms - except possibly the menstrual cycle one.
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>> will probably get stored in the cupboard for a minimum of 11.5 years
From illustrations I have seen the meters are hefty pieces of kit, perhaps fixed to an outside wall. Is at so or are they installed inside?
If outside there would presumably be a repeater of basic information inside.
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...both my smart electric and smart gas meter went into the same location, and roughly the same footprint, as the non-smart versions they removed.
The remote display unit is about the same size as a mobile phone (slightly squarer).
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>> ...both my smart electric and smart gas meter went into the same location, and roughly
>> the same footprint, as the non-smart versions they removed.
>>
>> The remote display unit is about the same size as a mobile phone (slightly squarer).
They are much smaller than existing meters, and yes the display goes anywhere in the house
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Smokie,
my current fixed deal comes to an end later this month. I'm probably going with Octopus. Can you email me your referral code?
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I can't get a gas smart meter installed. Apparently my box, which is in the ground adjacent to my front door, doesnt comply with current regs as there is supposed to be some sort of pipe / tube more than 1 metre away from the door. If they fitted a new meter they would need to run a pipe up the front of my house, round my doorway and back down the other side. Not a chance I am allowing that to be done.
So they can't do it in its current box as the pipe doesnt comply. But says I , by not doing it you are also leaving me with a non compliant pipe so I am no better off! Engineer just couldnt see my argument!
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Smart meters make time of day pricing possible: later on - probable.
As one who is in the house a lot during the day (along with many other pensioners) that is not good.
I won't entertain one unless forced to by the law.
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I don't follow, Roger. How exactly would that work?
One attraction is that the cheapest tariffs may only be available to meter-holders.
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...more likely (and logical)if they wish to implement load shedding/balancing is that those without smart meters will be placed on the highest available tariff, since they cannot be physically managed.
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Time of day metering is already here, with Octopus at least.
The next day's rates are issued usually by 16:00 the previous day and you can choose when to use the electricity, on those devices on which you have a choice.
It's called Agile tariff. octopus.energy/agile/
People use the cheap rates to run their appliances, charge batteries for use in less cheap times (but that isn't yet so cheap to set up) and to charge their vehicles.
For me as they have a really cheap overnight rate (5p a unit for 4 hours) it isn't worth my while, as charging my car at that rate by far outweighs any other advantage (especially at other times of the year when the solar panels are in production).
There have been a very few occasions when they have actually paid you to take power from the grid!! Admittedly fractions of a penny and only for a short burst though...
Last edited by: smokie on Thu 12 Dec 19 at 14:28
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Peak domestic energy use isn’t actually during the day when pensioners are huddled round their one bar electric fires but between 4pm and 7pm when people return home from work, switch on their heating and lighting and cook their dinners. If charged on a variable rate electricity would be cheaper during weekdays between 9am and 4pm.
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Here's a site to browse around which has graphical displays of real Octopus pricing data.
www.energy-stats.uk/octopus-agile/
And, digging deeper, this for instance shows London region www.energy-stats.uk/octopus-agile-london/
This confirms CGNs comment above.
using a few timers, or better still a halfway house manual use of smart switches and devices or better even still a properly automated system of switching you could probably make quite a saving without any real impact, if that way of working suites you.
As per above if anyone wants to transfer let me know as I have a referrer code which gets us both £50 :-)
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Grid watch also gives you a good idea of when the nationwide peaks are.
gridwatch.templar.co.uk/
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I am thinking of switching to one of the smaller energy companies but they do not currently have a smart meter program.
My current smart meter is, as far as I can tell, a SMETS1, typically, though installed January 2019.
Is there any way of downloading usage stats from the meter to a Raspberry Pi or similar without a direct feed from the energy company?
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There is a device whose name escapes me at the moment which does the extraction. It uses clamps on you cables IIRC to gather the stats and you can do it in near-real time, but I don't think there are any ready-built interfaces for it, you'd need to code something. ISTR it is unlikely to become SMETS2 compatible, whereas many SMETS1 meters are likely to get an OTA update to SMETS2 (in the fullness of time!!. Around £50 IIRC, I'll look for the details later.
I download my gas and electricity usage and cost data downloaded (at 08:00, scheduled via a CRON job on the Pi), using their APIs to query the database. It writes it to a daily excel file and also to a consolidated Excel file so I can do reporting and look at trends etc. Those files sit on my NAS so no need to keep going onto the Pi to back t up to free space etc.
However once I got it working and had a look I sort of lost interest.
Octopus meters seem pretty compliant and I think they are now only rolling out SMETS2. Green energy at a low cost - what more could you want?? :-)
Did I mention I have a referral code for £50 each...
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E.ON fitted my dual-fuel smart meter yesterday. Gas and electricity had to be cut off for 30 minutes each but pilot lights were re-lit and there seemed to be no problems with electricity. Until this morning, that is, when I found the bathroom fan heater would not work, although it was working yesterday morning.
Sounds daft, but could the switch-off be responsible? The fuse box is mounted high and needs a step ladder to access but I suffer from vertigo and had a bad fall only three months ago. I am hearing-paired into the bargain and struggle to use the phone. E.ON have an email service but it is "vey busy at the moment".
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(Hearing-impaired, that is.) I should have mentioned that two similar devices are OK, extractor fans in bathroom and kitchen. Maybe the fan heater pull switch is broken.
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>Maybe the fan heater pull switch is broken
Sometimes they're not a simple switch because of either timer/delay or safety requirements in a bathroom.
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>> Sounds daft, but could the switch-off be responsible
Entirely possible something in the box tripped, or something in the heater needs to be reset.
you are going to get need to get someone savvy round for a look.
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Yes, what Zero says.
I'm sure you're quite savvy enough to know how to deal with the hearing problem, but can you not have someone make the appointment call for you and then conduct the visit with pen and paper?
If you haven't got someone then email me, I'll make the call for you if you want. I can have a text based connection with you [Messenger or WhatsApp or something] while I'm on a voice based connection with them. I'm sorry I'm not close enough to drop round.
You most certainly should not be climbing a ladder.
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Many thanks for your generous offer but I can ask my wife to phone for me if I don't get a response.
If I can see a person speaking to me I can understand them, as I did with the E.ON operative.
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>>I found the bathroom fan heater would not work, although it was working yesterday morning.
Sounds daft, but could the switch-off be responsible?
Reminds me of back-in-the-day when I tuned a customers car and he foned up 3 daze layder to say that his car radio hasn't worked since I tuned his car.
:o}
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>>I found the bathroom fan heater would not work, although it was working yesterday morning.
11 days on, E.ON being unresponsive in the interim, the fault was traced to a trip-switch in the airing cupboard. I did not observe what the heater installer was up to and he did not tell me about the switch. It was lost in an array of (non-trip) switches and controls in there.
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So they weren't working because they weren't switched on? That's a little embarrassing. Probably just as well E.ON didn't turn up, that would have been a little toe curling.
Still, all fixed and working now, so that's good.
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It (just the one) was working that morning, before being switched off. E.ON switched off the whole supply for 30 minutes in the afternoon and this must have tripped the trip-switch to "off".
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It was a circuit breaker, (could have been an ELCB) and yes the power surge can sometimes trip them.
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Smokie - you have email at your mod address.
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Switchover went through today. According to their notification email you should get your referral reward in about 10 days.
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No problem, I get my credit at the same time and Octopus were offering a better deal than renewing with my current supplier.
Can you zip up the Perl scripts you are using to grab API data off their servers and email them to me? No point in re-inventing the wheel. Delete your API key though. I'll keep you updated with any changes/additions I make.
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I will but they are a bit broken at the moment. I'm still getting daily data properly but it's a little corrupted and a little deficient. Still have more data than I really want though. I've not had the time to debug them, it's on the list but the list isn't moving much these days!! And they aren#t very pretty!!
I'll describe the problems in a covering mail. Presume the mail address on your account here is correct?
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Hi Smokie, the email address in my profile is correct.
Don't worry if they need a bit of extra debugging or tidying up. I can do that at leisure.
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Smart Meter Supplier Change - Bromptonaut
