A sad state of affairs indeed.
Lancashire Police have come in for some criticism both in mainstream and social media about the way they appear to be handling the case. All the Facebook detectives are having a field day.
Is it a case that they are being overwhelmed in order to control rumour and speculation whilst trying to get on with the job of solving her disappearance?
Todays headlines in the media are that they face criticism for releasing details of her difficulties.
Yet people seem to forget that these cases can be driven by the media finding out certain information and threatening to publish. Its all about the headlines and not about assisting in whats best for positive outcomes in the investigation.
Last edited by: Fullchat on Thu 16 Feb 23 at 16:43
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I think the Police had their hand forced by the wild rumour and speculation mill at work. From what I can glean fro the the media is the family making things tough for the ole bill in the press, lot of amateur theories being bounded about, gossip, even malicious intent at work in places.
Its all very weird.
The theory in the dog world is the spaniel did it.
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I've not followed this much but I did see a bit of the press conference, one of the senior officers said it was something he'd not seen in 30 years.
Lots of weird phonecalls about the missing woman and ideas as to who and why.
I don't know much about missing people cases, but I'm guessing it's fairly unusual for the police to go into depth about what lines of inquires they have followed up on and why, along with a missing persons background.
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I only worked on one major missing person hunt as a young officer, with others and cadets, we spent a long time looking for poor Keith Bennett.
This was before the Moors Murders came to light and we were mostly deployed in searching the demolition areas round the lad's home. It was a filthy, dangerous job, including derelict houses, factories and any building you cared to mention. We searched under floors, in lofts, factory boilers, drains, etc.
It was only when Wardle Brook Ave came to light that we were transferred to Wessenden Head on the Saddleworth Moors, another filthy, wet job.
I don't suppose we'll ever see the lad come home...sad. I fear the same for Nicola.
Ted
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This came up on a policing FB site and sums matters up exceedingly well:
Okay... despite many messages, we've held off commenting on this as it's a live investigation - but, as usual - the media are frying our brains...
First off, this is a LIVE Missing Person Investigation.
Nicola Bulley is missing, and, despite theories, no-one knows how or why.
Police are trying to balance a live investigation with the concerns of a devastated family, demands from mainstream media (who arguably don't give a s*** what's going on, as long as there's a headline to be written) and - in a fairly new twist - a large swathe of the public who are either trying to solve the case online, or turning up at the scene like it's some sort of "Dark Tourism" attraction.
Police are managing ALL of that, but the only one that ACTUALLY matters are the Bulley family.
There are young children involved, and some of you ("you" meaning people out there - hopefully not any of you lot) are absolutely obsessed with the case like it's some sort of reality gameshow.
It's not. It's a real life tragedy that decent people are hoping is resolved soon and with Nicola being found safe and well.
As for the gutter press...
Firstly, Police have a news conference. They don't say much, because your clickbait headlines are not their concern.
You went ahead anyway, preying on the mention of vulnerabilities and inviting criticism from the idiots who idolise your stories.
As a result, Police went on to elaborate on what those vulnerabilities are - in order to stop speculation.
In another frenzy, you couldn't get headlines out quick enough - again inviting criticism from those that don't know any better.
But then, there are people out there who SHOULDN'T NEED this spelled out for them... Like MP's and a former Detective who they've rolled out for some soundbites - for example.
Lancashire Police have one concern here: finding Nicola Bulley safe.
They're not here to pander to you and your conspiracy theories.
A statement on Sky News earlier, hidden in among all the aforementioned criticism is VERY significant.
It reads:
"...the family statement, published through the force, made clear the police "know the truth about Nikki"
The family added: "Despite what some media outlets and individuals are suggesting, we are being updated daily and receive support from our family liaison officers."
That's literally all that matters. Nothing else.
And whoever the FLO is/are - we take our hats off to you. We have no doubt that you, along with everyone else involved in this investigation - is doing a sterling job.
Try and ignore the noise. Police can't do right for doing wrong these days. But they turn up and get on with it regardless.
Praying for a positive outcome.
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They're damned if they do and damned if they don't.
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>> This came up on a policing FB site and sums matters up exceedingly well:
>>
>> Okay... despite many messages, we've held off commenting on this as it's a live investigation
>> - but, as usual - the media are frying our brains...
>>
>> First off, this is a LIVE Missing Person Investigation.
>>
>> Nicola Bulley is missing, and, despite theories, no-one knows how or why.
TBH I'd normally take anything cross posted from a Police FB group with a large pinch of salt; not because it's wrong but just that they often think in a way that's totally at odds to my own.
This however is absolutely spot on. What we're seeing is how a missing persons inquiry can pan out in an era where Social Media etc drive behaviours which are way beyond what we've seen before.
The scene seems completely free of any actual clues to an event, or motive if there was one, as to why Ms Bulley should have, to all intents and purposes, evaporated while out with her dog. The fact that she's female, apparently in a completely normal family situation and 'easy on the eye' multiplies the issues.
The Lancashire force, and probably the whole of the Police Service, are going to need to rewrite their manual on missing persons from the ground up.
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Almost all driven on TicToc apparently, the conspiracy theorists are latching onto to big time, one string claiming its staged with the family being actors. Why? to divert attention away from ( insert your favourite conspiracy here) by the government*
The issue with and for the police is bigger here tho. It shows up how they have failed to deal with social media, both external & influential to the business of policing, and how its become pervasive within the force allowing unwanted cultures and attitudes to develop.
*The idiocy of some of the public believing influencers and theorists on social media beggars belief, It makes you yearn for the day we are all controlled by AI.
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There's something inevitable about how vast numbers of people
(a) look to, it seems, the most venal, narcissistic or utterly vacuous demagogues / celebrities for their opinions, and
(b) reject the views of those with appropriate knowledge and experience articulating rational arguments.
Of course I would never do that. Nor would thee. Although I'm not so sure about thee.
I don't know about AI being a benevolent dictator. But maybe it has a role in indicating who might be worth listening to.
Is it even worth engaging with people who get their views from grifting internet 'influencers' and populist politicians?
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>>
>> I don't know about AI being a benevolent dictator. But maybe it has a role
>> in indicating who might be worth listening to.
>>
...that would be the death of this forum, though...... ;-)
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We seem to be down to about half a dozen active member active so a few chatbots would be good
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>> We seem to be down to about half a dozen active member active so a
>> few chatbots would be good
>>
....welcome, ChatCGN! ;-)
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>> ....welcome, ChatCGN! ;-)
We would getter puns anyway
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>We would getter puns anyway
Too many gottles of geer already?
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...I thought he was just emulating an IBM Chatbot....
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Its venison 1.0 it wont be woking properly till 3.1.
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>> Its venison 1.0 it wont be woking properly till 3.1.
>>
....and "they" will be fully woke a good few versions after that?
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User: "Hey Chatbot will you be fully woke after a few versions?"
ChatCGN V1.0:. "That does not commute"
Last edited by: Zero on Sun 19 Feb 23 at 11:23
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I found this podcast interesting on Times Radio looking into the psychology of some of the people who are visiting the scene and commentating. Tik Tok detectives and 'grief junkies'. It is just over 30min:
youtu.be/4xhIhxm5tRk
Last edited by: Fullchat on Sat 18 Feb 23 at 14:32
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A body has been found in the water a mile from her last known position.
Perhaps the keyboard jockeys will give it a rest now, but I doubt it.
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>> A body has been found in the water a mile from her last known position.
>>
>> Perhaps the keyboard jockeys will give it a rest now, but I doubt it.
I fear that both the amateur keyboard jockeys and those paid to work in offices that were once on Fleet Street will be straight onto how could the police miss a stiff in the water* close to the centre of their search....
*Assuming of course there is nothing to suggest it wasn't there all the time.
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I did wonder how the body was not seen earlier. Its a reasonable question, especially after one of the search teams was adamant their was no body in the search area.
I suppose we'll find out.
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SM seems to be full of posters criticising the police now. That'll be the police who've maintained throughout that she went into the water.
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>> SM seems to be full of posters criticising the police now. That'll be the police
>> who've maintained throughout that she went into the water.
Despite the underwater search expert who said. "If she is there I will find her"
When he didn't, he said "She isn't there"
Its not like they would have found her alive if they found her earlier.
The Tik-Tok conspiracy theorists will of course say "Its a plant"
The Spaniel is still the main suspect
Last edited by: Zero on Sun 19 Feb 23 at 18:24
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news.sky.com/story/how-police-could-have-avoided-dreadful-invasion-of-nicola-bulleys-privacy-12813753
A journalists view, unsurprisingly its if we don't find out what we want we'll hammer you until you do.
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Mark Easton on the BBC has an opinion "don't speculate" was the message all week and he's on the main news speculating as if it's going out of fashion. He has a history of this with other events.
"If she is there I will find her"
He'll just blame the Police.
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Why was/is this even a "top story" on the news at all?
We're inexorably becoming the US as far as news media goes.
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>>
>> The Spaniel is still the main suspect
>>
It supplied the only lead in this case.
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Its gonna get collared believe me.
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>> >> SM seems to be full of posters criticising the police now.
>>That'll be the police who've maintained throughout that she went into the water.
>>
>> Despite the underwater search expert who said. "If she is there I will find her"
>>When he didn't, he said "She isn't there"
>>
From what I recall from the reporting
" The police hypothesis using the facts.......she entered the water"
That seems reasonable to me.
Then the guess from no facts ... the dogs ball etc was added. This was instantly shot down " The dog has not had a ball for a year."
I think this immediately undermined the good police work.
IIRC it was stated that the water level in the river was low and a body would not have gone over the small weir.
The guy with the underwater high tec kit did his search.
He appeared to search from the bench area above the weir. Was that area restricted after " the river level was too low at the weir"?
The search expert was right, within his remit.
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If so, he maybe should have qualified his assertion more carefully then to save himself looking the ass he does now.
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>> If so, he maybe should have qualified his assertion more carefully then to save himself
>> looking the ass he does now.
>>
I agree.
He has attempted to clarify things today.
Peter Faulding, a former paratrooper and the head of Specialist Group International, carried out searches from the bench where Ms Bulley went missing down to the weir using state-of-the-art sonar equipment, but pulled out after three days, saying: "If Nicola was in that river I would have found her - I guarantee you that - and she's not in that section of the river."
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By comparison with an intrusive unhelpful (possibly obstructive) media and self appointed egotistical social media "investigators" the police come out of it all relatively well. They at least reached the right conclusion within a couple of days.
Whether they should have found the body earlier is very difficult to judge. Few of us, I suspect, have conducted an underwater search, but it is easy to imagine visibility close to zero with silt, and reeds, debris, tree roots, fallen branches etc.
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>>Whether they should have found the body earlier is very difficult to judge.
That could only be judged by the effort they made, and by somebody with more knowledge and experience than me. A lot of people were looking, including the independent expert.
Just one of those things, and it wouldn't have saved her. I see no reason to criticise the police.
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Why can it take so long to find bodies?
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64712383
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I'll let you read and digest this one. They are out there :S
Was posted on FB under the title of - THE PARALLAX VIEW - UK Karl Ballantine
It’s obvious that a blanket of secrecy has now been thrown over the tragic case of Nicola Bulley - a compliant media are doing the security services bidding - the lancashire police are busy blaming everyone else but themselves and Nicola’s partner is threatening to sue everyone - so that’s that then to all intents and purposes - nothing to see here - get back to dancing on ice and emmerdale - but to those of us with experience in these twilight worlds of subterfuge and dark cover ups it is plainly obvious that all is not what it seems - far from it in fact -
At the beginning of the search the police stated “there are no unusual domestic reasons for her disappearance” - that wasn’t strictly true -
We were told that she was a “mortgage broker” - that wasn’t strictly true either -
We were told that the river was being searched by specialist police teams and independent diving specialist -right down to the estuary - they all stated the she wasn’t in the water -
We were told that over 100 search specialists were combing the river banks using drones and sonar heat seeking equipment - we were told that there was nothing to be seen or found -
We then started digging ourselves on the BB site and found some very unusual facts which we published and they are still on that site -
We discovered a strange aerospace company owned and run by Nicola and her partner Paul Ansell - registered above a fish and chip shop in Porthcawl in Wales - Paul Ansell is an MRI aerospace engineer - Nicolas background is in MRI technology - that company was struck off on the 7 February after Nicola had gone missing -
We found that Paul Ansell had connections to both a very notorious post box address in Finsbury Road - London - and the Panama Papers -
We found that a friend and previous work colleague of Paul Ansell went missing in Poulton Le Fylde in Lancashire last October - his name was Derrick Clayton and was a retired MRI aerospace engineer at BAE industries - he has never been found -
We found that there were apparently two Paul Ansells - the second one worked for Marshall’s aerospace and was also an MRI aerospace engineer - strangely enough Derrick Clayton had also previously worked for Marshall’s -
The Police then told us that Nicola had serious alcohol issues related to early onset menopause and that she could be unstable - in direct contradiction of their earlier statement regarding her normal good health - they also informed us that they had been called out to Nicola’s home two weeks before she disappeared over a “domestic incident” -
We then had the extraordinary coincidence of a fake medium from Oldham finding a body on the river bank less than a mile from the bench where the dog was found - he was apparently there because he had “mystic powers” - he has now disappeared back to whence he came -
We then find out that the sacrificial lamb was to be the Independent diving specialist who has an 80% success record working with the police but couldn’t find Nicola - he still maintains that she wasn’t in the water when he searched it - he was NOT instructed to search the banks - he has now been removed from the police and security services list of experts - the Lancashire Police undertook the searches of the river banks -
We then are told that dental identification was needed - indicating that the body was unrecognisable after such a long time in the water - experts say that would not have been the case at all -
At the first inquest hearing - no cause of death was given and the file was marked classified and not for public consumption - none of Nicola’s family attended that hearing -
The links to these facts are on the BB site and I won’t post them again - all of this may be just a massive set of coincidences of course and you can make your own minds up about that - I know what I think - we shall never find out but it does all appear to have the hallmarks of well practiced government trade craft -
For reference purposes only with no allegations that they had anything to do with the Nicola Bulley case - Dr David Kelly - Dr Gerald McCann and Gareth Williams (the body in the zipped sports bag) were all involved in MRI rocket technology - xx
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It takes about 2-3 months to get a company struck off, because it has to be gazetted twice. I know, I've just done it.
Unless you're MI5 off course:)
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Let's hope that this is the end of the matter now.
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Even my intellegent, sensible sister joined in the pointless speculation.
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>> Even my intellegent, sensible sister joined in the pointless speculation.
>>
Too many cop shows on TV.
Everyone is an expert and nothing is ever straightforward.
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Every single cop show has a trailer with a cop bursting into a room holding a gun. Watch telly tonight and you'll see one in an ad break. Monumentally irritating.
That's why I love Columbo. And Father Brown. They solve crimes without shooting anyone.
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Have you everf though what Columbo must smell like? He never take off that raincoat and California is a pretty warm place.
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I thought the same with Father Brown. He cycles everywhere wearing all those robes.
Did they have deodorant in the 50s?
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>> I thought the same with Father Brown. He cycles everywhere wearing all those robes.
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>> Did they have deodorant in the 50s?
Cycling in your work clothes is fine; you just need to be careful about exertion.
Euston to the office at 08:00 was a cinch even in a heatwave; less trouble for being too warm etc than the bus.
Back up there at 17:00 much sweatier, but then again so was everyone on the bus or on foot
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Tue 27 Jun 23 at 18:25
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Yes, but Father Brown's rickety old bicycle probably doesn't have gears... does it?
And he's rather out of condition from the look of him.
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>> Yes, but Father Brown's rickety old bicycle probably doesn't have gears... does it?
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>> And he's rather out of condition from the look of him.
TBF my post was a bit tongue in cheek but if he pedals at walking pace he'll be fine :-)
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Nicola Bulley - Zero
