| Non-motoring > private school fees | Miscellaneous |
| Thread Author: Stuu | Replies: 108 |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 15:24
private school fees - Stuu
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My wife and I stumbled across the very grand looking Neville Holt school while on a jaunt in the countryside and it got us wondering what sort of fees private schools charge, as in the range of them rather than the headline figures. Any ideas? My mum and my uncle were both privately educated but my nan has no idea what it cost in the 60's because her mother paid all the fees ( my nan was a farm labourers wife at the time ). Are they worth the extra? |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 15:30
private school fees - nick1975
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£10-15k a year, can be worth it, but not always. As with most of these things all depends on the particular situation and circumstances. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 15:35
private school fees - Stuu
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| Wow that is some coin, but i guess if you have it to spare, its a better place to spend it than on a Range Rover! |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 15:41
private school fees - Perky Penguin
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I was at a public (ie private) school in Norfolk in the late 50s. The fees then were were £400 a year. I was allowed to be there on half fees as my late father had been a teacher at another public school, a sort of charitable arrangement. When I was 16 I got pre-selected to join the RAF and they gave me a £200 a year scholarship so from that point on I was self-supporting which pleased my mother no end! Fees can be around £20k a year now and towards £8K for a day school. Eton fees here www.etoncollege.com/currentfees.aspx |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 15:47
private school fees - Armel Coussine
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A word of warning though. Two of the eight schools I attended were expensive fee-paying boarding schools which were pretty good, a third was a Headmaster's Conference day school, partly state funded I guess, that was also pretty good. But in my extreme youth, around 1960, I worked at a small private day school in South London that called itself a grammar school. It was absolutely terrible, and as some of my pupils were worth better than that I told them so. It was wasted breath: they thought I was being disloyal to the school, not realising I was doing my best for them. My best at the time was pretty hopeless though. I'm a lousy teacher. I was unqualified on paper, and wasn't allowed to teach the two subjects I would have been some good at, but forced to teach things I knew little about. The job was in a string of other jobs that included building labourer, waiter and washer-up in a gay coffee bar, and it felt much the same but was more stressful. I ended up coming in later and later and spending the lunch hour getting plasterado with the school handyman in the nearest pub. I must have wanted to get fired because I was really relieved when I was. The school, which was full of 11-plus dunces whose parents were too snobbish to let them go on to a secondary modern, no longer exists thank goodness. Perhaps there are no places like that any more, but I wouldn't really bet on it. As for the English-for-foreigners sector, it appears to be riddled with crime and fraud. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 15:51
private school fees - Perky Penguin
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www.westfield.newcastle.sch.uk/fees.asp This day school in Newcastle is very good but look at the fees per term! Sharp intake of breath! |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 17:21
private school fees - henry k
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Some of the prices for top day schools in my neck of the woods. www.hamptonschool.org.uk/Prospective-Parents/Admissions/Fees.aspx www.lehs.org.uk/Financial_Information_32/index.php kingstongrammar.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=89&Itemid=109 kcs.org.uk/content/fees-finance £4.5K - 5.5K for starters £1,260 p.a. if you want to commute by coach "Over the past three years our pupils have secured over one hundred places at either Oxford or Cambridge." So the investment may be worth it? We were fortunate that our two both got into two local, top notch, state grammar schools. It was a close run thing due to the funny rules at the time but we were prepared to pay the rate if it came to that. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 17:29
private school fees - Iffy
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..."Over the past three years our pupils have secured over one hundred places at either Oxford or Cambridge." Secured 'over' one hundred places? I doubt many were in English, it should be 'more than'. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 17:32
private school fees - Zero
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| who says? |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 18:00
private school fees - Runfer D'Hills
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I went to one of the better known Scottish public schools from the age of 5 until I was 17. Look at the state of me! Can't be worth it... :-) |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 18:19
private school fees - Perky Penguin
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| I am not sure. Is there a rule? In a train derailment over 50 people were injured/ more than 50 people etc. On Sunday the temperature was over 100C or more than 100C. I haven't a copy of the definitive book - Fowler's Useage so I am stuck. Neither actually sounds "Wrong" to me |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 11:00
private school fees - Iffy
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...who says... Zero, Instead of instantly posting across me, as you do time and time again, look it up, do some research. I know that's not your strongest point, so I'll give you a pointer - try a dictionary. You might learn something. Then you could post with authority, instead of your usual argumentative unsubstantiated claptrap. More than that, I don't wish to say, so this post is over. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 21:08
private school fees - Zero
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>> ...who says... >> >> Zero, >> >> Instead of instantly posting across me, as you do time and time again, look it >> up, do some research. How about you get things right before you constantly and consistently tell us how to write on here, it makes you look stupid. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 21:57
private school fees - John H
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Zero was right. "1000 years of usage, the Oxford English Dictionary, the Columbia Journalism Review, and even most prescriptivists agree: over and more than are interchangeable.” and blog.writersdigest.com/qq/More+Than+Vs+Over+Which+Is+Correct.aspx "After an extensive search, I can safely tell you that there's no grammatical rule that says you can't use "over" instead of "more than." Most references (Webster's New World College Dictionary, Merriam-Webster.com and Dictionary.com, to name a few) define "over" as meaning "more than." In fact, Garner's Modern American Usage flatly states that "'the prepositional 'over' is interchangeable with 'more than' ... the charge that 'over' is inferior to 'more than' is a baseless crotchet."" Last edited by: John H on Mon 4 Apr 11 at 21:58
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Mon 4 Apr 11 23:38
private school fees - Iffy
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'Over' has a spatial meaning - 'the aircraft flies over the ocean'. Quoting from the Cambridge online dictionary: "above or higher than something else, sometimes so that one thing covers the other; above" dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/british/over_1 Using 'over' to mean 'more than' does appear as definition 13 in this dictionary: dictionary.reference.com/browse/over But it will be regarded as sloppy by the sort of people who are meant to be impressed by public school brochures about pupils sent to Oxbridge. And I bet the 'more than' meaning won't be taught once young Tarquin gets there. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 18:03
private school fees - Leif
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KosaiIggypop said: >> Are they worth the extra? .******* I went to a state school. It was full of 60's left wing politics. We were taught books such as Stan Barstow's A Kind of Loving rather than the classics. Not a bad book, but they should have put quality of English first, politics last. And I had one teacher shout abuse at me e.g. "You pfd middle class pfd". I feel that the pupils underachieved due to lack of aspiration from parents and teachers alike. Chatting with colleagues who were educated privately, it seems the key difference is discipline, and the fact that the pupil is the customer. In a state school the pupil gets in the way. In a private school they are the source of income, and the school strives to keep discipline. They will expel pupils who misbehave outside school. Recently I suffered harassment by local children. I spoke to a passing teacher, suggesting I should report them to the school. She replied "It's nothing to do with the school, they are not in school grounds". Were a pupil at a private school to get into trouble with the police, the school would probably expel them, possibly to prevent other parents from complaining that their little darling is mixing with the wrong sort. The private school creates an ethos of work within a disciplined environment. It helps that the pupils are in the school grounds most of the time, mixing with other pupils, not on the streets potentially mixing with unruly children from bad families. After all they almost all come from nice middle class families with aspirant parents who probably provide well for them. Are some private schools carp? No doubt, some are worse than decent state schools. Last edited by: VxFan on Tue 5 Apr 11 at 01:00
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Sun 3 Apr 11 18:04
private school fees - Leif
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Here is the first part of the previous post. No idea what happened !!!!!! KosaiIggypop said: >> Are they worth the extra? At work we've talked a lot about private schools, as a colleague sends his son to a fee paying day school, the ex technical director went to a public school, and another colleague went to a private school on some sort of scholarship. The ex technical director is very arrogant, sometimes very rude. His way to tell me to leave a meeting was to say "pfd off" and then carry on talking. Extreme arrogance and rudeness seems to be a characteristic of most public school educated people in my experience, and I've met a lot of them. I've always been astonished at how privately educated people shoot up the career ladder. I think it is confidence, which allows them to achieve more than more capable but less confident colleagues. But had I the wonga and kids, I wouldn't hesitate to send them to a public school. I'd rather they were successful fascists than nice failures. Last edited by: VxFan on Tue 5 Apr 11 at 00:59
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Sun 3 Apr 11 18:31
private school fees - RattleandSmoke
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It depends on too many circumstances. I do wonder if I would have done better if I had went to a private school but I am so glad I didn't. I went to one of the word inner-city schools you could probably imagine (it was in Moss Side) but that in its self was an education. Made me realise just how well off I was as I always thought we were poor because we didn't live in a big mansion like most the people in our family did. I lack confidence but I don't think going to a private school would have done anything to help that. My sister did do her 11+ and went to a grammar school as I live on the border of Trafford which still has the 11+ system. She has done much better in life than I did but then she didn't have all the problems I did and that wasn't down to schooling. If I had kids I don't think I would ever send them to a private school but I wouldn't want them to go a rough inner-city school either. I think a state funded grammar school would be far better compromise. Even my sister though did go through a very snobby phase and would often talk down to my parents, she has grown out of that now and I suppose a lot of us are guilty of doing that when we are teenagers. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 18:44
private school fees - Armel Coussine
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>> would often talk down to my parents, she has grown out of that now and I suppose a lot of us are guilty of doing that when we are teenagers. Heh heh... everyone in the world has been there Rattolo. But only the decent ones feel guilty about it. Fortunately they are a majority. Leif says that in his experience 'extreme arrogance and rudeness' are characteristics of 'most' public school educated men he has met. I have been a lot luckier than Leif (although of course some here may see me as an example of what he meant). However in a long life I have come to recognise that these qualities are by no means restricted to the richer classes but are found in about 20 per cent of men of all classes. Such people without recognising it are driven by fear, including fear of being shown up, and stupid lying and aggression set in early as their way of dealing with the threat. It becomes a neurosis, difficult to shift, very early on. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 18:56
private school fees - RattleandSmoke
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With my sister it was usually aimed at my mum as she went to a comprehensive (the 11+ was scrapped the year before she started) but reckons she would have gone to a grammar in the old system. My dad went to a grammar school (11+) and so did my sister so she often looked down on my mum because of it. She may not have a university degree but she can spell and knows the rules of grammar far better than any of us in this house despite being the only one who dosn't have HE education. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 18:58
private school fees - Leif
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Armel Coussine said: >> I have been a lot luckier than Leif (although >> of course some here may see me as an example of what he meant). I certainly would not put you in that category. >> However >> in a long life I have come to recognise that these qualities are by no >> means restricted to the richer classes but are found in about 20 per cent of >> men of all classes. Such people without recognising it are driven by fear, including fear >> of being shown up, and stupid lying and aggression set in early as their way >> of dealing with the threat. It becomes a neurosis, difficult to shift, very early on. Yes, I have met many other people who are rude and unpleasant too. And I have met nice public school people. But most (over 50%) range from decent but arrogant to downright nasty. It is possible I have been unlucky and that my industry attracts the worst of the bunch. I should add that my late mother, and her mother were privately educated, and I do see great benefits of private education. Just look at the proportion of MPs, company directors, doctors etc who are privately educated. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 19:12
private school fees - Runfer D'Hills
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Ultimately people are just people. We are all just smart monkeys. Education brings out the best in some whereas life experience nurtures others. All walks of life generate good guys and bad guys. Decency is not financially dependent or functional thereof. When I have, for example, been in the position of having to recruit people, I look less to their "standard" of education and more to what they have done with their lives so far. Of course certain jobs require specialist skills and a qualification in a relevant field doesn't hurt, but I have often found the best people not from their paper achievements but from their life ones. Our society is often too quick to compartmentalise and judge others by standards which are entirely fallible. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 19:16
private school fees - nyx2k
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i have lived in many expensive areas and i can say that ALL the state schools i have sent my children to have been full of violent, thick chavs with no respect for anyone or anything. the staff and teachers have been no better at all and deserve the kids they get to teach. my boys have been beaten several times in mdifferent schools in good areas but the majority of troublre makers have come from the local council estate. this may sound harsh but is 100 percent true and is why we choose to live in a small hamlet and keep ourselves to ourselves now. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 19:21
private school fees - Armel Coussine
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When I worked in the City - industry not money - I met a lot of marketing and sales and advertising people who were the sort of twerps you describe, Leif. But the truth is that selection by class doesn't provide especially superior base material. Schools are quite variable too. Some have (or had) a thuggish anti-intellectual ethos that could affect everyone. But there are advantages to private education of the old-fashioned sort. There are advantages to being made to learn a lot of boring stuff by heart when you are young enough to cram plenty of it in; there are advantages in not being encouraged to waste your time 'expressing yourself' before you have anything worth expressing in your head. There are advantages to being threatened with very real physical pain in the event that you are really idle about work. Not everyone makes the best use of those advantages. I didn't myself. Even so I became sort of educated despite everything. Standard government schooling declined in the sixties, seventies and eighties as politicians and teachers colluded to hide the hard facts that getting educated is often boring, that children naturally resist, and it is therefore in their own best interests to force them a bit. The carphounds wanted to have educated people without making anyone educate them. I think things may be improving a bit now but a lot of teachers are barely literate or numerate themselves after those thirty years. And it shows everywhere. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 15:05
private school fees - Alanovich
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Just look at >> the proportion of MPs, company directors, doctors etc who are privately educated. >> A lot of this is nothing to do with the private education per se, but the contacts one obtains by means of it. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 19:08
private school fees - Stuu
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My wife and I had a discussion on the merits of private education and we concluded that we would be happy to pay fees for a school if we felt it offered something extra over the state school choices. Being snobbish about what school your child goes to on account of its funding arrangements is somewhat silly, the only concerns I can see are the results it produces both academic and personal. Im certainly interested in the ethos of a place, which would vary hugely, but I dont think id send my kids to a state school to make a political point when I knew they would have done better elsewhere. Ive so far in life found state funded institutions far more interested in meeting minimum standards than striving for maximums. Not all, but the only time I received genuine positivity was when I rang up for a tax credits claim form, as if it was some kind of good thing to be doing it ( I consider it an evil albeit one of the lesser ). We decided we didnt like boarding schools at all, but a private day school of our choosing ( catchment area lottery - no thanks ) seemed the preferred option if funds were available. Ive got pictures of an Ignis Sport doing doughnuts on a very posh front lawn infront of a posh school :-) |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 19:18
private school fees - nyx2k
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but the results are down to the background of the parents and what the teachers expect and demand from the pupils. fee paying schools are normally better becuase the staff and parents wont have that bad behaviour from their or other peoples children. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 19:23
private school fees - RattleandSmoke
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I think the argument for private education is more valid in cities where comprehensive schools can be very rough. In London for example some schools now have their own police officers. In middle England there is probably enough decent comprehensive schools your kids can go to. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 19:29
private school fees - Stuu
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Rattle, theres no such place as 'Middle England' other than geographically, the bit between London and Manchester doesnt all look like Midsommer, the village of the muderous 99.9% white people. I went to a rough comp school in West Sussex in what is supposed to be one of the nicest places in England to live. Posh houses dont equal posh schools next door, doesnt work like that unless its the owners of the posh houses funding the school. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 19:41
private school fees - RattleandSmoke
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Maybe but the best schools in Manchester are in the best areas. Even Trafford's grammars do. My sister went to one of the worst of the grammar schools (still one of the best state schools in the UK) where as the closer you got to Altrincham the better the schools got. Maybe all comprehensive schools do have problems but at least in Manchester the better comprehensive schools are in the better areas, e.g Parrs Wood in Didsbury. My experience of comprehensive education is anything but normal it was extreme but than it itself was an education. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 19:43
private school fees - Stuu
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| Hate to break it to you but despite your best ideals, Manchester is a small part of a big country. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 19:45
private school fees - rtj70
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Well said ;-) I went to a Welsh bilingual school which many assumed must be private because we travelled so far to get to it. I did a round trip of about 40 miles per day to get there for 7 years! |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 19:43
private school fees - rtj70
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I think one has to look at the quality of education on offer in your area. Our local primary schools at the moment are doing well according to OFSTED (if you trust them) and the two nearest comprehensives are also doing really well. The nearest which is less than 1 mile from here is doing particularly well. I suppose we're lucky. The person we sold our house to moved to the area to be in the catchment area of a particular school. He used to live Disbury way. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 20:12
private school fees - nyx2k
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my local comp is so bad and its boys only. kids cant go on the bus as the stop before ours is another small council estate and my boys and others get beaten and spat at. so they either walk to another bus route that doesnt go through any estates before it picks my boys up and never had trouble on that bus but because the local lowlifw cant behave my boys have to walk a mile over several muddy fields in the dark in winter to get a bus and the same back again. or they get a taxi or sometimes ride but its 5 miles and half rural and half city traffic. to be honest the grade is a 3 on ofsted which isnt good enough so may have to sell up again and move as an area of hampshire has several secondary schools with grade one and good reports from parents |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 20:19
private school fees - Dulwich Estate
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A bit closer to the original question - ".....it got us wondering what sort of fees private schools charge,...." It's all over now thank goodness, but in London our choice was private education for the 2 sprogs or get out of the smoke. We stayed and I reckon we could have bought another house with what we spent on two places over a total of around 18 years ! |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 20:26
private school fees - RattleandSmoke
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I realise that but most people do live in cities in the UK and all cities have good and bad areas. The most important thing though is there is far more to education than GCSE results and that is where some comprehensive schools fail badly and is the main reason I moved schools when I was 13. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 20:41
private school fees - BobbyG
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I went to a private secondary after being at a state primary. School was 15 miles away. Hated it, being separated from my friends, having to travel, notbeing able to pal about with school buddies as they lived too far away. Hated the way we were always told that we were better than everyone else because we were there. Got decent grades but no better or worse than my state school peers. Saw some pupils expelled, suspended etc same as state school. My daughter goes to a state secondary, as mentioned in this thread very cross section of comunity at the school. Last exams she got 8 1's. All to do with her attitude, parents attitude and less blaming on everyone else. My son is a couple of years behind daughter and there is a noticeably different attitude from peers ie boys from girls. Very difficult for a boy to say no, or take a stance on principles when all the others don't. Easier for girls. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 20:51
private school fees - RattleandSmoke
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The school I went to had 11% pass rate at 5 A*-Cs but that was bad even by Manchester standards. Even at the time the very best comprehensives were getting 40% where as private schools were 90%+. My sisters grammar was 96%. I got 5-CS (the rest were d's) and that was enough to get my photo in the paper as being one of that schools best achievers that year! That is how bad it was. But when you saw the backgrounds of people at my school you realised how the results were so bad, it doesn't mean that if you went there you couldn't do well. As soon as I started college I got AB in my AVCE (in that year one of the hardest courses to pass due to many cockups, I got one of the highest grades in the country) and an B in business studies. Not really the best qualifications in the world but it showed how grades improved after leaving that crap school. I then went on to get a 2:1 (Hons) degree although I needed a lot of help with the maths side of things from my friends. I was only 2% of getting a 1st but that 2% would have been two months extra work which would have made me ill. I do really wish I did get better GCSEs but there is no point being bitter about it. It just annoys me that we had 10 maths teachers in two years, our English teacher just made us watch videos all the time etc. I would not have put up with now and when I we had a bad teacher at college I became the student rep and got more than 30 people to sign a petition to get rid of her. It worked and amazingly I was popular with the other tutors who were really waiting for a student to finally stand up to her. |
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Sun 3 Apr 11 21:13
private school fees - Dave_
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>> Are they worth the extra? I stumbled across this video a while ago: www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsNVmOa5Pd4 A fantastic showcase for Lewes New School on the south coast. Their fees are here: bit.ly/e0MpJi (links to Google cache of page, current page unavailable) Based on that video I would say yes, fee-paying schools are worth the extra. My middle child is due to start secondary education in September at a state school thankfully rated by Ofsted as outstanding, in fact well inside the best-performing 100 state schools in the UK. I hope they live up to their promises. Last edited by: Dave_TDCi {P} on Sun 3 Apr 11 at 21:14
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Sun 3 Apr 11 21:27
private school fees - Falkirk Bairn
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My D-i-L teaches in s "Selective Comprehensive" School with top 10 outcomes - the teachers are no better / worse than most other schools in the city. Selective school because the catchment area is posh - my son & d-i-l paid £450K for their 5 x bed house 15 miles from the school - near the school the exact same house (with a few posher fittings, eg granite worktops in the kitchen) is £765,000. Many of the parents employ a tutor in the senior school - up to 4 or 5 tutors per week @ £35 /hr for say 30 weeks /yr is cheaper than fees @ local fee paying schools. My own kids had attended local village school then the local comp - no tutors but plenty of home encouragement, got the 5 x Highers at first attempt and off to Uni @ 17 - graduating at 21.......jobs were easier to come by than now but then again Engineering is nearly always in demand ..............more so than many of the airy fairy degrees in "hot air subjects" |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 10:03
private school fees - helicopter
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We paid for our son to be privately educated at the local grammar school when the headteacher at his junior school told us that he was so far ahead of his classmates that he was unlikely to fulfil his potential at the local comprehensive. His school fees at that time were around £12 to 15 k per annum out of taxed income , the overall cost from age 10 to 18 for us was £100 k plus and it was a struggle for us. He worked hard and with the help of his school, particularly his history teacher he got a place at Cambridge . That set us back a further four years worth of costs supporting him although by that time he did have student loans and an inheritance from his grandparents to help him. He graduated with not one but two masters degrees. Although it was a struggle ,I would do it again in a shot.....he is a very successful , confident young man with a great career and a credit to us and his school. Frankly I do not believe that would have happened if he had gone to the local comprehensive.. Last edited by: retpocileh on Mon 4 Apr 11 at 10:04
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Mon 4 Apr 11 11:08
private school fees - Leif
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retpocileh said: >> Although it was a struggle ,I would do it again in a shot.....he is >> a very successful , confident young man with a great career and a credit to >> us and his school. Frankly I do not believe that would have happened if he >> had gone to the local comprehensive.. I am sure you are right. This really is a cultural thing with middle class parents willing to make sacrifices for their children. The attitude of my father and his wife was "get lost, earn your own way, why shoud we support you". During university holidays I had to pay rent if I wanted to stay at 'home'. During term time at university I was so poor that I shared a room with two other people, and the noise was such that during my finals I slept on a friends floor so that i could get sleep. There were days when I would not eat. This was pre student loans days. I do hope your son appreciates what you have done for him. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 11:27
private school fees - helicopter
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I do hope your son appreciates what you have done for him. ..... Oh yes Leif - his response to any comments from us as regards our sacrifices to get him where he is today 'Never mind , I'll pick you out a nice nursing home then Dad'....... |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 11:56
private school fees - BiggerBadderDave
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"'Never mind , I'll pick you out a nice nursing home then Dad'..." At least he's not planning on bumping you off. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 12:04
private school fees - Zero
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>> "'Never mind , I'll pick you out a nice nursing home then Dad'..." >> >> At least he's not planning on bumping you off. never been to a nursing home then? |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 12:06
private school fees - Fenlander
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| Ha.... he'll pick... you'll pay! |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 12:18
private school fees - BiggerBadderDave
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"never been to a nursing home then?" I should shouldn't I, probably full of single older women who are gagging for it. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 12:25
private school fees - Zero
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>> "never been to a nursing home then?" >> >> I should shouldn't I, probably full of single older women who are gagging for it. Nothing better than a gum job BBD! |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 13:57
private school fees - henry k
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>>During university holidays I had to pay rent if I wanted to stay at 'home'. >> During term time at university I was so poor that I shared a room with two other people, and the noise was such that during my finals I slept on a friends floor so that i could get sleep. >> There were days when I would not eat. This was pre student loans days. I do hope your son appreciates what you have done for him. >> Although we avoided private school fees ( even though my son had a a scholarship which we rejected) and I took early retirement with them both at uni, we took the early decision that we would fund them both if required so they could enjoy the full uni life. We trusted them to balance study and play without money worries. Both had a fantastic time and were well respected which still continues today. Son is doing very very well. My daughter is doing brilliantly and is back studying so we look forward to her fourth graduation in a couple of years. She is right at the top in her subject but is happy to teach and train others even though she herself has another two years of training to complete later. Fortunately this time round she does not need our funding. We were so pleased to be able to fund them even though we were not "rich". |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 11:14
private school fees - Cliff Pope
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Public schools are ancient semi-charitable organisations run by a board of governors, not for profit and with no shareholders. Conventionally the term is restricted to Headmasters' Conference schools. Private schools are nearly obsolete now, but were privately owned profit making businesses, typically owned by the headmaster. Read Evelyn Waugh Decline & Fall , or Monica Dickens Man Overboard, for some hilarious descriptions. Independent schools covers just about everything not run by the state. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 11:53
private school fees - Fenlander
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I currently use 2hrs of each day and 40mls min taking our two teens to their state school as we wanted a better one than the local catchment school. We did consider a private school but realised while we could afford one to go two would have been out of the question. No-one will ever really know how their choice affected any particular child but I think it's well woth the effort stepping away from the easy minimum cost local choice. Their state school brings them into contact with a wide variety of children but without the negative issues mentioned by nyx2k. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 12:19
private school fees - Alanovich
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My boy's school is a gnat's over 3k a term (boy is aged 6). Our plan is that we'll spend on his primary education with the aim of getting him in to our local Grammar School at 11 (school has a 100% record of achieving Grammar places for all those who applied over the alst 50 years). His sister will follow the same path (same school, as from this coming September). Cash flow will be restricted for the next 10 years, but seeing as we've been paying around a grand a month per child for full time nursey care for 6 years, it'll seem like a Christmas present as the costs will be lower then nursery care is/was. Imagine the party if both of them attain a Grammar place and we can start putting all that money into investments or the like. Fingers crossed. If this happens, it will feel like money well spent. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 12:28
private school fees - Zero
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>> Imagine the party if both of them attain a Grammar place and we can start >> putting all that money into |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 12:37
private school fees - Alanovich
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Hmm. Although I imagine there will be a degree of parental largesse when it comes to University, fees are the responsibility of the students themselves, to be paid off when in gainful employment. Abroad is also a university option for my two. Many cheaper establishments in other countries are starting to teach in English, and not only that my two *should* be at least bi-lingual by 18 or earlier. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 13:15
private school fees - Leif
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>> Abroad is also a university option for my two. Many cheaper establishments in other countries >> are starting to teach in English, and not only that my two *should* be at >> least bi-lingual by 18 or earlier. I wonder if university fee increases will reduce the number of overseas students coming to the UK? Overseas students are a big source of income for universities. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 13:17
private school fees - Bromptonaut
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University tuition fees are paid in full as a loan so largesse is limited to those wanting to reduce the 'millstone' of debt the offspring graduate with. Same goes for the maintenance loan. Although these, combined, are being compared size/size with parent's first mortgages the repayment schedule seems more like a graduate tax; not clear that there are obvious circumstances where default can make the whole sum die and payable forthwith. The catch for the middle earner is that the maintenance loan barely covers the cost of a self catered room in halls. Miss B, due to go to Liverpool or Sheff Hallam in autumn, is clearly going to need an 'allowance' of £200+ per month and probably food parcels on top!! Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Mon 4 Apr 11 at 13:19
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Mon 4 Apr 11 13:36
private school fees - RattleandSmoke
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I've been toying with the idea of doing a masters in the Netherlands for a year. I can't afford to it in the UK. I can go to a dutch university and get change out of £2K per year. I am thinking of doing this when I hit my early 30's as some sort of mid life crisis thing. I certainly not paying what the UK universities once, although I was offered a bursary to a masters in 2005 I turned it down as I wanted to just earn money. Last edited by: RattleandSmoke on Mon 4 Apr 11 at 13:37
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Mon 4 Apr 11 13:38
private school fees - Alanovich
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Brill idea Rattle, so long as you make sure you benefit from it financially when you return. Netherlands is an excellent place for British students to look for educational establishments. Good value and English widely spoken. Benefits of the "EUSSR", eh? ;-) Last edited by: Alanović on Mon 4 Apr 11 at 13:39
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Mon 4 Apr 11 13:48
private school fees - RattleandSmoke
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That is what I am researching. Although I am doing it for many reasons, getting a masters will just be a bonus rather than the real idea behind it. I had the idea when I was in Brighton reading the broadsheets on the train. Just need to find something relevant to study now. It all depends how easy it is for English speakers to get jobs out there too. Apart from a few trips to Amsterdam and and getting a train through most of the Netherlands I have very little experience of it. I am thinking some where like Rotterdam might be idea as it is close enough to get the ferry back home (I don't do planes). Last edited by: RattleandSmoke on Mon 4 Apr 11 at 13:49
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Mon 4 Apr 11 14:06
private school fees - Boxsterboy
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Interesting thread. Mrs BB and I were both private educated (in her case with a full Local Authority grant), but were fully hoping to send our kids to state schools. Having seen them and private schools, we decided to go private. The main differences were class size, discipline and equipment (local state junior school didn't have enough chairs/desks for some classe sizes, let alone computers!). The biggest difference however is the fact that an impressive minority of parents at state schools seem to have an active dislike of education which transfers to their kids, who in turn transfer it into their attitude at school, to the detriment of the whole class. You simply don't get that at private schools. (You do however get other 'issues' such as spoilt kid syndrome, but I guess you can get that anywhere.) Interestingly, some of our kids friends parents from Infants School, having tried a few years of state junior have moved them into the private sector. There are private schools and private schools - some far more grounded than others (and the same goes for the parents). Our kids are thoroughly enjoying their time at school and visibly grow in knowledge, confidence and ability daily. At £10.5k pa, to us it is excellent value for money. I think too many parents see education as the school's job, from 9.00 - 4.00 weekdays, when it is of course nothing of the sort. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 14:28
private school fees - Fenlander
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>>>of parents at state schools seem to have an active dislike of education which transfers to their kids, who in turn transfer it into their attitude at school, to the detriment of the whole class. Very good point. I've noticed this from primary onwards where so many parents were just itching to go in and *tell that teacher what I think of them* when issues came up. I've often said these foks who obviously hated their own school experience are doing much to damage the prospects of their own children. We support the school in 99% of what it does. I have the e.mail address of, and importantly know, all the teachers our girls come into contact with... makes a big difference. Last edited by: Fenlander on Mon 4 Apr 11 at 14:29
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Mon 4 Apr 11 14:33
private school fees - Number_Cruncher
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>>There are private schools and private schools - some far more grounded than others Number_Nipper is currently 3, and in private nursery, so, we don't have the decision to make yet, but, what's the best way to tell the difference between money grabbing charlatans of private schools and the good ones? Are there any obvious giveaways? If N_N is anything like I was, he'll find every opportunity to skive and avoid academic work, and so, will need to go to a firm and well disciplined schooling to keep him in line. Quote from 5th year report "N_C will acheive a good pass in the forthcoming O level French paper, which will be the result of natural ability, as it certainly will not be the result of any hard work on his part" |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 14:37
private school fees - Focusless
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One source of info is the school's Ofsted report: www.ofsted.gov.uk/ EDIT: might still grab your money but it might be worth it Last edited by: Focus on Mon 4 Apr 11 at 14:38
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Mon 4 Apr 11 15:31
private school fees - Boxsterboy
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There's a lot more to it of course, but I think you can tell a lot about a school from its car park. We looked at one school where the car park was full of Q7s, RR Sports, X5s, etc. The parents all seemed to look down their noses at the teachers. Other school car parks had far more 'normal' cars - and more 'normal' parents driving them! |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 15:58
private school fees - Stuu
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>>If N_N is anything like I was, he'll find every opportunity to skive and avoid academic work, and so, will need to go to a firm and well disciplined schooling to keep him in line.<< Funny you say that. My uncle was privately educated once he left primary school because he was labelled as very capable but very lazy. That was the grounds on which my great-grandmother said put him in this school, ill pay the fees. He now speaks conferences in his chosen scientific field. My nan said it was worth every penny. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 17:53
private school fees - Leif
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KosaiIggypop said: >> He now speaks conferences in his chosen scientific field. My nan said it was worth >> every penny. This thread has certainly provoked a lot of comment, and oddly enough I agree with most of what has been said. In fact, there seems to have been relatively little disagreement among posters. I used to be against selection at the age of 11, but reading this thread makes me wonder if I am right. There is something wrong with the state system. If posts here are to be believed, the benefit of the private system is not so much better facilities and smaller classes, as no-one has mentioned those aspects, but better discipline and less disruptive pupils with values derived from families that respect schooling. By selecting at 11, it might be argued that you filter out the disruptive element, and allow the better behaved children to learn in a better environment. Still, I know many people who were teachers, and they all say that teaching is awful due to too much state interference, and the inability to discipline children, in part because most teachers have strange over liberal views. I should add that I knew one superb teacher at my school, but that was not the norm, and it was over 30 years ago. He did enthuse me enough for me to gain a first in physics and a PhD. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 19:35
private school fees - Stuu
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Diane Abbott sent her son to private school. Nothing looks more stark than a prominant left-winger 'going Tory' by putting her child through an elite institution. If she doesnt rate the state system, I certainly wont have much confidence in it. My son has just started school and thankfully appears to be a bright little soul who can already read and write before he is 5, so Im very concious that his progress continues unabated and with his mother being a product of boarding school, its quite possible that should funds be available, he will go into a fee paying school I think. Some great insights about the system on both sides btw. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 19:41
private school fees - Leif
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>> Diane Abbott sent her son to private school. Nothing looks more stark than a prominant >> left-winger 'going Tory' by putting her child through an elite institution. If she doesnt rate >> the state system, I certainly wont have much confidence in it. Oddly enough that is why I respect Diane Abbott. She is a leftie, but she is not prepared to sacrifice her son for her career, and has the courage to send him to a good school. Good for her I say. And yes as I understand it she thinks the local schools are no good. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 20:01
private school fees - Zero
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to >> send him to a good school. Good for her I say. And yes as I >> understand it she thinks the local schools are no good. And there, in all this, is the key. Its a matter of how good your local schools are. If you are lucky to be in the catchment area of a good school, then the roundness of a state education is better for your kids, not just education but life skills, IMHO. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 20:24
private school fees - Crankcase
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Just to put the other side of it, for my own part, I was packed off to a minor public and hated every minute of it from 6 to 18. I also hated every minute of University though so it's probably just me. But it's not necessarily for everyone. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 21:10
private school fees - Leif
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Crankcase said: >> Just to put the other side of it, for my own part, I was packed >> off to a minor public and hated every minute of it from 6 to 18. >> I also hated every minute of University though so it's probably just me. But did you benefit from it? No pain, no gain, you might say. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 21:19
private school fees - Crankcase
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| How can one know? I wouldn't have thought so. Certainly not a conventional "success" anyway. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 20:33
private school fees - Bromptonaut
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>> And there, in all this, is the key. Its a matter of how good your >> local schools are. If you are lucky to be in the catchment area of a >> good school, then the roundness of a state education is better for your kids, not >> just education but life skills, IMHO. That sums up my experience as a parent. We have pretty good system down this end of Northants where the village primaries feed large(ish) rural comprehensives. The one in this village has around 1800 on roll. Probably about 6/700 from this large village with the rest bussed in from the smaller surrounding communities. Its presence is probably worth 10% on the value of my house. Both my kids have gone there and acheived good results. Maybe they'd have done better in a 'hothouse' but they'd have lost out on the social balance on and the expereince of doing all their growing up in the same cohort of friends. Cannnot agree with Leif about selection at 11. I'm not saying you cannot make some braod brush assessments at that age but the middle 60% of kids can show huge relative changes in attainment as they mature at differrent paces. And you cannot assume that the 20% who succeed on the day in an 11+ (or even accross yr6 in continous assessment) will not include it's share of disruptives. And if I'm wrong about that is it right to condemn those who failed to flaot to the top to spend the rest of their secondary education in a sink. I was lucky enough to get to grammar school and being split from best friends at primary who'd not made the cut was quite upsetting - probabably much more so for them. Although both drew from the same predominantly well heeled Leeds suburb the was a lot of quite vicous sniping between the grammar and secondary kids. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 21:09
private school fees - Leif
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>> Cannnot agree with Leif about selection at 11. I didn't say I am in favour of selection at 11, and I have always been against it for the reasons you give. But I do wonder if it is such a bad thing. I know it is very unfair to some, but then again, what about the others. I wonder if anyone has done research to work out if selection is in terms of overall results a good or bad thing, ignoring any moral issues. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 21:17
private school fees - Zero
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| Monitoring of educational progress should be carried out on an ongoing basis. To make judgements at a given age that could dictate the future of a kids education seems to me to be a little arbitrary. Children learn at different rates, boys always seemingly behind girls. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 21:37
private school fees - BiggerBadderDave
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"Children learn at different rates" When are you gonna start learning Zed? |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 21:38
private school fees - Stuu
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| I think that ship has sailed, now in the hands of somali pirates ;-) |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 21:38
private school fees - Zero
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| I had pulled more women by the age of 19 than you, does that count? |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 22:23
private school fees - Leif
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Zero said: >> Monitoring of educational progress should be carried out on an ongoing basis. Not sure what that means. Do you mean continuous testing? We had tests, but they never really meant much until the approach of O levels. >> To make >> judgements at a given age that could dictate the future of a kids education seems to >> me to be a little arbitrary. Children learn at different rates, boys always seemingly behind >> girls. One point I think that is significant is that when you are young, the difference in age between the youngest and oldest in the year can be significant, given that the brain develops abilities as you grow. I was always bottom of the class when very young, and I was one of the youngest in the class, and yet I went on to do well academically. I think the boy girl performance thing has changed a lot over the decades, with girls doing much better than they used to. Some say modern teaching methods favour girls. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 22:27
private school fees - Zero
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>> Zero said: >> >> Monitoring of educational progress should be carried out on an ongoing basis. >> >> Not sure what that means. Do you mean continuous testing? We had tests, but they >> never really meant much until the approach of O levels. No, one off testing is not the way, monitor actual class and coursework performance. Provides a much better view of a pupils ability. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 23:39
private school fees - CGNorwich
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"No, one off testing is not the way, monitor actual class and coursework performance" But how? You would need a disinterested observer to make the assessments. You could hardly leave it to the teachers to make an unbiased judgment of the progress of their pupils when their own performance is being judged on their pupil's progress. Last edited by: CGNorwich on Mon 4 Apr 11 at 23:40
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Mon 4 Apr 11 23:11
private school fees - Armel Coussine
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>>> then the roundness of a state education is better for your kids, not just education but life skills, IMHO. Good point Zeddo. My excellent nephew went to a comprehensive and is now doing very well in some quasi-technical, electronic-communications job that I haven't yet been able to fathom. But: he went to a good comprehensive in a well-heeled area of London when it was good, and both his parents could be described as distinguished intellectuals. My youngest daughter later went to the same school. It had changed by then and didn't suit her at all, although she didn't hate it. A place was wangled for her at an all-girls school with a good academic reputation and all was well. It's a good idea for the young to be plunged into a very wide variety of social situations. The roundness Zero mentions doesn't come easily, but its absence is felt in later life. A smug and narrow social circle makes people feel secure but leaves them sometimes on the back foot, even a bit alarmed, when faced with a profuse and noisy world. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 23:38
private school fees - RattleandSmoke
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When I was a student moderator we published some research which suggested that kids who went to private schools did less well in the first two years at university because they are not used to culture of shock of not been told what to do all the time. One reason I didn't struggle like some of my mates did at first is because I was already well used to teaching myself things. That said I seem to remember the research wasn't really conclusive because state kids and private kids often tend go to different types of universities. I still wonder if there really was anything in it. The biggest shock I had at university was simply the pace of the lectures soon got used to it though. Last edited by: RattleandSmoke on Mon 4 Apr 11 at 23:40
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Mon 4 Apr 11 23:47
private school fees - Stuu
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>>we published some research which suggested that kids who went to private schools did less well in the first two years at university because they are not used to culture of shock of not been told what to do all the time.<< And yet in the end, the people at the top of government more often than not are privately educated and they now tell YOU what to do... |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 23:52
private school fees - rtj70
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>> we published some research which suggested that kids who went to private schools did less >> well in the first two years at university because The ones I knew with private education did quite well. A few from Haberdashers, Eton, Manchester Grammar, etc. One went to Buckingham Palace every year with his family for a get together. A genuinely nice (and smart) bloke. |
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Mon 4 Apr 11 23:56
private school fees - Stuu
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| Ive often wondered how much better I would have done in private eductaion - I certainly learnt alot about human beings but precious little about the studied subjects due to an overload of 'reality'. Structure would have been bliss frankly. |
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Tue 5 Apr 11 00:00
private school fees - RattleandSmoke
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By well I meant struggled in the first two years, then they find their feet and do well. There was too many flaws in the statistics though. E.g eton graduate may go on to do chemistry at Cambridge, comp school leaver may go on to Lampshire Poly (made up name) may go on study Dave Beckham and do well on paper. I didn't really believe it for those reasons it was too general. |
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Tue 5 Apr 11 10:08
private school fees - Boxsterboy
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>> That said I seem to remember the research wasn't really conclusive because state kids and >> private kids often tend go to different types of universities. >> Too right. I had a private education and went on to a Polytechnic to do a vocational degree. Two of my cousins (on fathers and mothers side of family) went to local comprehensives in different parts fo the country, and went on to Cambridge University. One of them ended up doing a PHD on Black Holes. Similar gene pool, different school educations, way different further education! By the way when I was at Polytechnic, I was not 'overwhelmed' by the social diversities (or whatever you want to call it), indeed I met up with my best friend from infant school who had been through the state schools and was on a very similar course to me (although he did drop out at the end of the first year). |
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Tue 5 Apr 11 10:48
private school fees - John H
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>> published some research which suggested that kids who >> went to private schools did less well in the first two years at university because >> they are not used to culture of shock of not been told what to do >> all the time. Dons debunk claim that state pupils do better at Oxbridge www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/education/article669620.ece three other research papers published to date, AFAIK Schooling effects on degree performance: a comparison of the predictive validity of aptitude testing and secondary school grades at Oxford University www.informaworld.com/smpp/section?content=a914208601&fulltext=713240928 Fairness and undergraduate admission: a qualitative exploration of admissions choices at the University of Oxford www.kcl.ac.uk/content/1/c6/08/39/34/OxfordReviewofEducation.pdf Widening participation through admissions policy - a British case study of school and university performance www.bristol.ac.uk/academicregistry/raa/wpur-office/wprc/hoare-johnsston.pdf latest research by Cambridge - not yet published in full - seems to contradict the Bristol findings: "The most recent Cambridge university research, covering entrants from 2006-9, which may be shared with OFFA in due course, is reporting that "students from poorly performing comprehensives did not do better in university exams than others with the same A-level grades"." Last edited by: John H on Tue 5 Apr 11 at 10:49
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Wed 22 Jun 11 20:43
private school fees - Focusless
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>> Our plan is that we'll spend on his primary education with the aim of getting >> him in to our local Grammar School at 11 (school has a 100% record of >> achieving Grammar places for all those who applied over the alst 50 years). Alanović - are you aware of the petition that's going around the grammar school's feeder schools in an attempt to force a ballot on the future of selective education in Reading? I'm guessing you are. |
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Wed 22 Jun 11 21:48
private school fees - Dutchie
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| Are we saying that comprehensive schools are not up to scratch.And we have to send our children to private schools to receive a decent education.Enlighten me. |
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Wed 22 Jun 11 22:01
private school fees - Bromptonaut
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Depends where you live Dutchie. In much of the country we have brilliant bog standard comprehensives. Pupils study a wide range of subjects and leave at 16 or 18 as well rounded and qualified individuals who go on to the university, college or vocation their skills and ability justify. In parts London and a few other big cities there are areas where catchment and imbalance of facilities create massive gaps between 'succesful' and 'sink' schools. Rather than address these inequalities directly politicians of both parties prefer to posture and constantly restructure the entire national system. |
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Wed 22 Jun 11 22:06
private school fees - Focusless
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>> Are we saying that comprehensive schools are not up to scratch.And we have to send >> our children to private schools to receive a decent education.Enlighten me. For whatever reason, the school that gets the best results in the Reading area (where me and Alanovic live) happens to be selective. It's free, but it also suffers from being relatively under-funded. We felt it was the best place to send our son, and fortunately he got in, although I'm sure he would have done well at other comprehensives in the area such as the one my 2 stepsons went to. I just wanted to make sure Alanovic was aware of the aforementioned petition. Last edited by: Focus on Wed 22 Jun 11 at 22:07
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Wed 22 Jun 11 22:23
private school fees - Dutchie
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| Thanks, our children went to comprehensive,daughter carried on to Uni. |
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Wed 22 Jun 11 22:29
private school fees - Manatee
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>> Are we saying that comprehensive schools are not up to scratch.And we have to send >> our children to private schools to receive a decent education.Enlighten me. >> I'm not. Daughter did engineering at Cambridge from a compo. Well regarded school in a reasonable area, with good pastoral care. I think she would have been OK at any survivable school though, whereas some children would sink in a more "challenged" school. In a less good school with a poorer mix of ability, more will depend on the child (especially boys) and on the attitude and support of the parents. When we moved here nearly 20 years ago our daughter was 11. A key measure then (and now) was the %age of pupils achieving 5+ GCSE A-C grades. I think the measure for the local school was then 68%. Had we been over the county border in Bedfordshire, the only school I could have guaranteed to get her into had a corresponding measure of 19%. That was the major factor in buying a house where we did. I was just not prepared to put her into a school where a fairly moderate level of success was obtained only by a small minority of the pupils, and while she might have done well enough there, her brother certainly would not, in my opinion. |
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Wed 22 Jun 11 22:40
private school fees - PhilW
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I'll be honest, not read all the contribs to thread because didn't want to be influenced by other opinions or get involved in arguments! I taught in a not well known independent school (private or public school? You tell me!!) for nearly 30 years. My kids went to the local primary, middle and upper schools because, despite a good discount, we could not afford my school and luckily they both enjoyed their schools and have done extremely well! (Much better than me!!) A few points;- 1. There is a vast range of independent schools and a vast range of prices but all are very expensive in my view and may well require a great deal of sacrifice by parents in order to afford them 2. If your kids are well motivated and keen to do well and not easily influenced by peer pressure they will do well in any school (as mine did - luckily, and with little influence from me except for trying to "bring 'em up proper" - credit to them and SWMBO!) 3. I would say that at an independent school, there is much more emphasis on personal and individual attention, helped by smaller classes - max of 20 in class below A level and 12 at A level at my school whereas my wife taught up to 40 in a class. If a parent is paying several K a year for education of their children you, as a teacher, year head, tutor, are directly responsible and answerable at any time - phone calls, parents' evenings, personal visits from parents etc. If you don't do a good job you will be sacked and no questions asked. And if the exam results ain't what the parents paid for there is hell to pay!! 4. We were expected to do at least 2 evenings per week supervising "prep" - homework - for those who wanted, or parents who wished their children, to stay until 7pm. Done in virtual silence (with help available from teacher supervisor and prefects) but use of school library, computers etc. At least 2 hours of "prep" set per evening for all year groups and records kept of teachers who failed to set it or children who failed to do it. 5. Sports - as a teacher I was expected to coach games (rugby and hockey in my case). This was on top of normal teaching load for no extra pay. Usually one afternoon per week for each year group and Saturday afternoons looking after a team at fixtures, every other week at "away" games which might be from, say 10am set off until 7 or 8pm return. This, for many years, followed Sat morning lessons which made up for the afternoon of games. On any Saturday there could be at least a dozen, often more, teams playing fixtures. Each Year group had at least 1st, 2nd and 3rd teams playing. 6. You were also expected to put on "after school activities" in the evening - Geog/Hist/Science Club etc and to organise and take part in Field Trips, often residential eg WW1 Battlefield Tours, Geog/Biology Field Trips/ Adventure/CCF/Language trips to France, Spain, Russia, Italy etc - during "holidays", Easter, Whit, Summer. 7. My kids enjoyed sports - tennis, cricket, rugby, judo to name but a few, but had to join local clubs, nothing provided at school except for tennis and cricket matches where the "school" team was made up of local club members. 8. All school meals provided if required , and staff expected to supervise on rota, from breakfast starting at 7 am, lunch at 1pm, tea at 4.30 and supper at 7pm after prep. All these to cater for "working parents", often those who were working just to pay school fees!! 9. Exam leave - no such thing. Although lessons were not on during exam time we were all expected to be on site and on duty - helping pupils who came in to school (most did) to do their revision, do practice papers, complete coursework etc. My department even had a "Saturday Cousework and Revision Club" from 8am until 1pm for those who required extra help and a Christmas and Easter Holiday "Club" for the GCSE and As and A2 lots! 10. Staff expected to organise various charity events - fun runs, school fairs, 11. Parents very involved in school matters - various fund raising activities, charity fairs etc. 12. I was not involved but loads of music tuition, concerts, various orchestras, jazz clubs, "pop groups" etc - some superb singers and musicians. 13. CCF - again, not involved but a member of my dept was - loads of camps, training, adventure hols etc. Something on every weekend and one evening and afternoon per week. 14. Lastly, superb facilities. Class rooms spacious and bright, always good computer/IT stuff/ great sports hall, rugby, hockey pitches and a cricket square (best I've ever played on!) where they play county cricket, fantastic 6th Form centre with extensive library, study and social facilities. But then, we were competing with at least 10 other very good and well known Independent schools within 20 miles and if you don't keep up or emulate you ain't going to survive are you? Long post again for which I apologise. But then if you are going to send your children to independent school it could be the most expensive purchase you ever make (including your house!) In conclusion, I had a close friend who sent his 2 boys to our school. I advised him against it on the grounds of cost. They are now both in their late 20s and have done really well and he reckons it's the best money he ever spent. But then both my kids went to local comp and have done really well and I reckon it's the best money I never spent!! At least I hope this post might provoke you to ask what your prospective school provides - whatever you do, GIVE THEM A REAL GOOD GRILLING, it's a big investment - maybe 100s of K. You wouldn't want to waste that much dosh! Except on a Bentley Continental GT Supersport!! Phil As a final point - When my daughter was at primary school, aged about 7, she was asked to "draw a picture of your family". Mum was on it, so was her brother and the dog. No Dad? Wheres Dad? said Mum. "Oh, he's always at school " said daughter. Still brings a tear to my eye - but we still laugh about it!! We were expected to make the school our life - at the expense of our family if necessary. Mind you, I enjoyed it, and there is nothing like seeing a kid make the most of his ability, academic, sporting, music or just growing up to be a good kid, and maybe you have contributed just a little tiny bit. |
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Wed 22 Jun 11 22:45
private school fees - Focusless
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| Lots of good info Phil, but just to re-iterate, the grammar school I'm referring to does not have fees. |
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Wed 22 Jun 11 22:51
private school fees - Manatee
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>> Lots of good info Phil, but just to re-iterate, That'll be three times you've said it then ;-) Yes, very interesting post from Phil, and useful for those with decisions pending I should think. |
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Wed 22 Jun 11 22:58
private school fees - PhilW
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"the grammar school I'm referring to does not have fees." Fair enough Focus. Early in my career I taught in a fee free grammar school and a damn fine school it was too (despite me!!). There are also some fee-free grammars near my "old school" and they are direct competitors and very good schools so if you are charging a good few K per year you need to be on top of your game to survive. This is why I stress - if you are paying good money, make sure that money is well spent, grill them on every aspect of what the fee paying schools are providing that may justify the extra thousands. Don't spend the money if not necessary - buy a Jag Xfs instead, or was it a Bentley Cont Gt SS, Or maybe that Maserati Quattroporte if only for the name (Maserati Fourdoor????) |
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Thu 23 Jun 11 09:56
private school fees - Alanovich
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>> AV; - are you aware of the petition that's going around the grammar school's feeder >> schools in an attempt to force a ballot on the future of selective education in >> Reading? I'm guessing you are. >> Thanks - I am aware of it, but don't know how to participate though. Can I? Is it open to parents of children at private schools? |
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Thu 23 Jun 11 10:15
private school fees - Focusless
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>> Thanks - I am aware of it, but don't know how to participate though. Can >> I? Is it open to parents of children at private schools? I've asked the nice kind mods to pass on a letter. |
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Thu 23 Jun 11 10:27
private school fees - Alanovich
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| Thanks, Focus. BTW, have you come across any decent energy deals recently? You pointed me to a good package with Eon a while back and it's due to expire on 1st July - their current offerings aren't nearly as good, so I was wondering if you'd dug anything up lately? |
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Thu 23 Jun 11 10:47
private school fees - Focusless
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>> their current offerings aren't nearly as good, so I was wondering if >> you'd dug anything up lately? That's what I thought initially, but in fact the one they recommended, E.ON SaveOnline 7, seemed pretty close when I realised that the prices they quote include all the discounts. That is, although the one I (and I think you) had an 18% discount and the SO7 doesn't, the bottom lines were similar. So that's what we're on now. It also came out pretty well on a price comparison site, although allegedly ~£100 below the 'best' (Scottish Energy IIRC). Didn't think it was worth changing to another supplier - I'm pretty happy with Eon. |
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Thu 23 Jun 11 10:50
private school fees - Focusless
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| Oh and the price comparison site also said the Eon SO7 would be cheaper than the old tariff, albeit only by £16. |
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Thu 23 Jun 11 10:55
private school fees - Alanovich
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Yep, the SO7 seemd the best option to me too. Shame there isn't anything as good as the old one. Cheers, I owe you a pint today! |
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Thu 23 Jun 11 17:40
private school fees - Manatee
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| Oh, for a private messaging system. |
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Thu 23 Jun 11 21:11
private school fees - MD
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| Personal e-mail. Some do it all the time. Don't be shy. |
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Thu 23 Jun 11 21:42
private school fees - Manatee
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| I meant for the Reading electricity users group, not me! |
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Fri 24 Jun 11 12:44
private school fees - Alanovich
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Hi Manatee, Feel free to email me via the mods if you like. Would be happy to hear any info regarding local cheap energy supplies! |
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