I know we've talked about this before, but I wondered if there were any updated experiences.
We still run incandescents in most rooms, including the ones where lights are on the most.
Thinking that the market has moved since the last time I did the sums, I've run a spreadsheet up. Looking at prices online, it seems to me that:
a) We would end up with a light that is perceptibly different
b) I would save, over three years, just under a fiver a month using the cheapest (and probably nastiest) LEDs from Hong Kong via eBay. That saving is the best I'm likely to get therefore.
It therefore hardly seems worth it financially, but I'd be interested if my supposition that the light would "feel" different is still valid, or whether newer alternative LED/CFL units do now give a feeling similar to the older incandescents?
What have you done in your house, and was it the right choice?
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I've recently fitted GU10 LEDs in my kitchen. Cannot remember the wattage/lux rating but they were labelled as a direct replacement for the 50w incandescent spot/floods used previously.
They were not cheap, around £12 for a four pack similar to these:
tinyurl.com/lxzg5o2
The colour/quality of light is as good as or slightly better than the incandescents.
I was looking at bulb life rather than electricity cost; the incandescents seemed to fail almost weekly.
I've also got a standard mini globe replacement LED in my outside/porch light. Again it's as good/better and won't cause low level heat damage the 40w tf was.
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Entirely LED here (even managed to find one to fit in the fridge...) and no regrets.
Don't go for the cheapest you can find, you'll regret it. The brightness will probably be OK, but the colour will be terrible (either a ropey colour cast or weird effects caused by missing bits of the spectrum). The cheap switching power supply may also knock out your FM/DAB/TV/DSL signals.
These from LED Hut are the best I've used (also see the "Cob" style):
www.ledhut.co.uk/home-page-bestsellers/new-4-5-watt-gu10-led-350-lumens.html
Edit: Incandescents and CFLs will be banned when I'm running the country.
Last edited by: Fursty Ferret on Tue 24 Feb 15 at 11:49
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At the beginning of winter 2013 we changed eight GU10 halogen bulbs in our kitchen with LED replacements.
The light was brighter and they haven't needed replacing yet. Cost was £28 and I was against it!
I've been proven wrong with my annual statement from Eon.
We've used 8% less electricity in 2014 than in the previous year but we haven't changed anything else.
Hope this helps!
Pat
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I should add that we had a new kitchen recently, into which we have some nice LEDs. They give a bright light that is excellent for cooking by etc. But I wouldn't want that in the lounge.
Looking at the links for lamps given above, it's clear my financial saving would be less than I put into my spreadsheet. Over three years, given that I would probably have to change light fittings as well, it would probably cost me money to make the change.
Finally, the "hidden" advantage of incandescents in the lounge is that the heat produced means I burn a smidge less oil keeping the place warm I suppose, although I've not factored that one in!
Last edited by: Crankcase on Tue 24 Feb 15 at 11:59
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According to the March edition of Which? the EU are shortly to be voting on whether to ban
halogen bulbs from either 2016 or 2018.
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I have experimented with various led lights and have come to the conclusion that if you buy quality it is the way to go. My house is fully led lit and my lighting load has dropped from just over 3Kwh to less than 1Kwh, obviously this is total load and not all of the light is on at all times. The big savers are the kitchen, reduced from 340w to 30w, the lounge reduced from 370w to 30w, the office / sewing / craft room reduced from 160w to 15w. These are the main heavy use lights in our house. We were commenting a few days ago that our electricity bills had dropped over the last year. You have the choice of warm or cool light quality output bulbs, all ours are warm except the halogen spot replacements which are cool. I have found that the TCP branded 5w halogen spot replacement bulbs from Home base are good, and the thing to look for when buying bulbs is the lumen output (brightness) you need at least 1000 lumens to replace a 100w incandescent bulb. Whether converting my house to LED has been cost effective, in the long term, yes, the bulbs fitted should outlast me and if my antiquated eyes can see perfectly with them they can't be that bad. I do have a 5w led spot reading light behind my chair though.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Tue 24 Feb 15 at 12:10
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What are the problems with LEDs ?
A friend has just swopped over to a LED replacement bulb in his reading light and I was a little surprised how hot it gets.
I am already off to buy some "quality" BC pendant lamp holders to replace the existing ones that are breaking up.
I am getting a little fed up with having to regularly change bulbs. Some are from my stock of quality brands and the others are " heavy duty / industrial bulbs bought recently at my local high street shop.
I can easily get Halogen 60W standard BC candle bulbs but is there a LED clear BC 60W candle bulb ?
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Introducing LEDs at every opportunity at ours. GU10 spots in hall and landing and G9 capsules in one set of wall lights, a 3.5W BC in my work room and another in the boiler cupboard. Very pleased with them all, although I admit I've not checked the electricity bill as thoroughly as Pat.
They're especially good in places we don't spend much time in but want to keep lit so we can pass safely through. The light is a touch harsher than incandescent spots, but then you don't choose spots for subtlety in the first place.
The main appeal to me is bulb life. G9s in particular are expensive and last for weeks instead of the promised years. I'm getting better life out of the ten 28W G9s in the living room by more careful use of the dimmers and never turning them up full, but even that only got nine months out of the last set - maybe 1,000 hours against the claimed 10,000. There are dimmable LED G9s but they're still too expensive; once they're down to, say, £4 apiece, I'll make the swap.
And Henry, yes - I bought the boiler cupboard bulb at Waitrose and there were both globes and candles in BC and ES, 3.5W and 5W, I think, which should cover what you need.
Last edited by: WillDeBeest on Tue 24 Feb 15 at 13:49
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>> The main appeal to me is bulb life. G9s in particular are expensive and last
>> for weeks instead of the promised years.
My mother has fittings with G9 capsules in both her bedrooms. Barely a fortnightly visit goes by where I don't have to get out a ladder and faff about replacing one or two of them. And I'm not the only one performing service, my brother in law and her home help change them as well. They're also a pain to get in or out and it's not difficult to break them in the fitting.
About to order a bulk set of LED equivalents.....
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B&Q have filament LEDs which look incredible - basically, you can't tell the difference until you turn it off.
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Never got on with LED, I don't like the light they put out. Too harsh and similar to being in a lab or similar.
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>> Never got on with LED, I don't like the light they put out. Too harsh
>> and similar to being in a lab or similar.
>>
May be worth looking at them again, the technology has come on by leaps and bounds and they're no longer automatically a cold blue light.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Tue 24 Feb 15 at 19:05
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I never thought of them as blue, I can't really put my finger on it. It just seems too clinical.
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Can you get them to fit in normal free standing lamps?
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>> Can you get them to fit in normal free standing lamps?
>
They come in same Bayonet, ES and other fittings G10, G9 etc as tungsten filament/halogen bulbs.
ATM no version I've seen looks right in 'exposed bulb' candle and similar fittings. OTOH under a shade or diffuser or in spot fixtures they're indistinguishable from conventional types.
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>> >> Can you get them to fit in normal free standing lamps?
>> >
>>
>> They come in same Bayonet, ES and other fittings G10, G9 etc as tungsten filament/halogen
>> bulbs.
This website gives info on the available fittings, I have not bought from them.
www.ledhut.co.uk/
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I was thinking they were all those spot lights things still, awful things. Seems to be a wider range now, mind you we have fluorescent tubes in the kitchen so no chance to convert. All the others are normal energy saving light bulbs and we don't have much light on in the rooms we are in. Maybe when they go, I'll have another a look.
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We chose a modern fluorescent light in the kitchen. Best light to work by and also cheap to run
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You can get LEDs to fit into fluorescent fittings, I have seen them fitted in some shops.
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This advert tells all, I only have flourescents in my garage, not used enough to make it worth while.
tinyurl.com/puav8lp
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£60 for two of those, I think I'll leave it.
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Were they the 5ft tube type?
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Don't have any filament bulbs in the house now, The cooker hood bulb was the last to be changed last week.
We have a mix of LED and energy saving fluorescent type, every new bulb bought is now an LED.
You can get any colour temperature you want LED wise, but other than the "kitchen white" costs more.
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All my LEDs are warm white except a few GU10 spotlights.
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Thanks for the responses.
After reading them I reckon I won't be changing from the traditional incandescents, but at least I know there's no killer reason to that I missed.
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>> Thanks for the responses.
>>
>> After reading them I reckon I won't be changing from the traditional incandescents, but at
>> least I know there's no killer reason to that I missed.
>>
>>
Just get these:
www.bltdirect.com/prolite-led-filament-6-watt-bc-gls-light-bulb-80-watt-alternative?adcid=pla&gclid=Cj0KEQiA37CnBRChp7e-pM2Mzp0BEiQAlSxQCAkxisd9CifCMrkylZ-dwMDUgUnUmtsvNnZLD7zjx-gaAjPv8P8HAQ
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Once you an get an LED that replicates the 100w TF for output and colour temp it's difficult to see any market for CFLs.
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>> >> Thanks for the responses.
>> >>
>> >> After reading them I reckon I won't be changing from the traditional incandescents, but
>> at
>> >> least I know there's no killer reason to that I missed.
>> >>
Even for the simple fact that this planet only has finite resources and as a developed society we can make simple, relatively inexpensive, changes to our lifestyles which might leave my generation and that which follows something to live on.
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>> Even for the simple fact that this planet only has finite resources and as a
>> developed society we can make simple, relatively inexpensive, changes to our lifestyles which might leave
>> my generation and that which follows something to live on.
Naahh.
The world's not really getting warmer, CO2 in atmosphere is still same as it was in 1800 and anyway something will turn up.......
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>> The world's not really getting warmer, CO2 in atmosphere is still same as it was
>> in 1800 and anyway something will turn up.......
>>
Even if FF continues to earn his crust by driving a plane that burns fuel by the ton. :)
Last edited by: Old Navy on Tue 24 Feb 15 at 22:04
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>> >> The world's not really getting warmer, CO2 in atmosphere is still same as it
>> was
>> >> in 1800 and anyway something will turn up.......
>> >>
>>
>> Even if FF continues to earn his crust by driving a plane that burns fuel
>> by the ton. :)
>>
That's got nothing to do with it - people still need to get from A to B and if I didn't do it, someone else would. What's more, I can (and do) actively influence how much fuel is used by how I fly the aircraft, saving close to a tonne a day simply by flying it carefully.
LEDs have now reached the point where there's no benefit to having incandescent light bulbs any more, and if you can afford to replace them, you should. Not least because you'll make the money back within a year.
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>> LEDs have now reached the point where there's no benefit to having incandescent light bulbs
>> any more, and if you can afford to replace them, you should.
Unless the cursed things give you raging headaches, like they do me.
The constant flickering they give out really makes me suffer.
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>> Naahh.
>>
>> The world's not really getting warmer, CO2 in atmosphere is still same as it was
>> in 1800 and anyway something will turn up.......
My foot! I've already got three Polar Bears in my back garden.
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>My foot! I've already got three Polar Bears in my back garden.
Keep 'em away from my Penguins.
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Bunch of wimps, there was ice on my car when I put it in the garage a couple of hours ago.
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You put a car in your garage that wasn't completely dry? Good grief, man, have you learned nothing from your years here? Next thing you'll be telling us you haven't changed the oil or tweaked the grease nipples since last Wednesday.
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But I won't have to hack the ice off it in the morning and it is modern enough to have a 12 year rust warranty with 11 & 1/2 years to run, way longer than I will own it. :)
Last edited by: Old Navy on Tue 24 Feb 15 at 23:13
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>> >My foot! I've already got three Polar Bears in my back garden.
>>
>> Keep 'em away from my Penguins.
It's OK Kevin...with those big paws, they can't get the wrappers off.
>>
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The wonders of modern technology, my car did not dissolve overnight like a 1960s BMC product.
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Good. Now get out there and change the oil. Better do the cambelt too; you can't be too careful with these things.
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Those are same set I linked Bobby. They're fine in my kitchen- four in a ceiling fitting.
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I have those Homebase GU10 LEDs they are excellent and plenty bright enough. The light is focussed, the 1000 lumens applies to standard bulbs.
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Anyone have 60W SES candle bulbs that they have replaced with LED ?
If so what did you buy?
Most seem to be 5W/40w equivalents in the main shops?
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probably because most SES incandescent candle bulbs are only 40 watts. Usually, being used in smaller enclosed light fittings higher heat outputs than that are not desirable. So mine were replaced with 5 watts (i.e. 40 watts)
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We have 60w incandescent candles in two rooms, for a total of 16 bulbs. Not all are on at the same time I should add, and in fact most are never on at all, but there they are.
Seeing which way the wind was blowing a few years ago I stocked up, so am unlikely to run out before moving house.
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>> We have 60w incandescent candles in two rooms, for a total of 16 bulbs. Not
>> all are on at the same time I should add,
Well I would guess that, with a total of nearly one kilowatt of light at your fingertips, your earth wallet must be quaking in its boots.
Last edited by: Zero on Tue 10 Mar 15 at 08:14
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As most of them are turned off most of the time, I keep more of your mortal pennies safe in my bank than you might think.
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>> We have 60w incandescent candles in two rooms,
>> Seeing which way the wind was blowing a few years ago
>> I stocked up, so am unlikely to run out before moving house.
>>
I too stocked up but I can easily buy them in a shop in the centre of Surbiton.
As I have posted before they are "industrial / heavy duty use so that is alright.
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Asda currently have a six pack of LED GU10 bulbs for £18.
Note on the shelf though - the individual ones on the shelf are a fiver a time but look out for the cardboard shipper with the six packs in it.
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I saw that six pack of GU10s discounted to £9 in the Livingston ASDA last week. I suspect it was a few end of line packs. Pity I have already replaced all mine.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Fri 27 Mar 15 at 23:00
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One point to watch if you are sticking with incandescents is that the recent ones have nothing like the life of the old ones. They are obviously churning them out cheaply and marketing them to old stick-in-the-muds masquerading as "heavy duty" to beat the ban, but they are nothing of the sort. I am endlessly replacing them in my garage inspection lamp after even the tiniest knock, and they often fail when switching on.
It seems to be these very small ones they make now, not the old ones the size of a large pear.
By contrast the oldest bulb in our house is also the one that gets used most. The pantry bulb must be at least 20 years old, and it gets turned on and off dozens of times a day.
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>>By contrast the oldest bulb in our house is also the one that gets used most. The pantry bulb must be at least 20 years old, and it gets turned on and off dozens of times a day.
I've still got a bulb marked 'Winfield'. Must have come from Woolies yonks ago.
I've given up on inspection lamps fitted with bulbs and just bought a twenty LED, re-chargeable job from ALDI for a tenner.
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My favourite type of bulb is the 20w G4 bulb I use in my desk lamp. I switch it on at 6am every morning, and leave it on all day - 7 days a week, until I naff orf upstairs to bed.
It seems to last 4ever - unlike the blimming GE halogen cooker-hood bulbs that go nipples up soon after replacing them.
I'll have to fit LED's next time I sup hose.
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6am ??? You're over 60 and retired, man!...Pull yourself together........still got another 3 hours sleep to contend with here !
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As of today the bulb to have is made of Graphene. Per this mornings news, cheaper to make, cheaper to run and longer lasting. I haven't seen details, but they sound really good.
This is the first commercial application for the wonder substance, discovered at Manchester University.
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In tungsten equivalents LED bulbs on the market only go up to 60 watts although I have found one 10 watt LED that may reach 75 tungsten. Yet the 100 watt tungsten must be one of the most popular, so how come no-one markets a LED equivalent of it?
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Confusingly, since they are sold on high efficiency, they overheat!
Usually they talk about a 90% saving, but my reckoning is that you need to go to about 20-25% of the power level to get an equivalent light outout from an LED.
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Mind when you buy a GU10 fitting that it is GU10 not GX10. Am just about to replace some spots with a GX10 fitting.. GX10 bulbs look just like GU10, but they're a slightly different shape so are not interchangeable. And They're £25+ each...
A new GU10 fitting is cheaper than one of those bulbs. Crazy!
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>> Mind when you buy a GU10 fitting that it is GU10 not GX10. Am just
>> about to replace some spots with a GX10 fitting.. GX10 bulbs look just like GU10,
>> but they're a slightly different shape so are not interchangeable. And They're £25+ each...
>>
>> A new GU10 fitting is cheaper than one of those bulbs. Crazy!
>>
Ob, so *that's* why they wouldn't fit. I had to use a bench grinder to get mine into the fitting. At the time I assumed it was some weird convention to stop you using halogen lights in fittings that couldn't take the heat.
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>> Yet the 100
>> watt tungsten must be one of the most popular, so how come no-one markets a
>> LED equivalent of it?
Because its not that popular. 100 watt incandescent bulbs were not that popular because they give out loads of heat, burn the bulb holder and use a large amount of power.
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Must have been a bit gloomy round yours. !00W incandescents were the norm I think in most pendant lights. Indeed I can remember the mighty 150W we use to have in our living room.
I think that some manufacturers are now marketing a 100W equivalent LED
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I'm sure there used to be 200W ones as well.
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>> I'm sure there used to be 200W ones as well.
never seen a 200 watt incandescent bayonet fitting bulb.
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>>
>> never seen a 200 watt incandescent bayonet fitting bulb.
www.amazon.co.uk/EVEREADY-WATT-BAYONET-PEARL-LIGHT/dp/B004ZK2QP8
There you go. Only £2.49 that will dispel the gloom at Chateau Zero
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>>
>> >>
>> >> never seen a 200 watt incandescent bayonet fitting bulb.
>>
>> www.amazon.co.uk/EVEREADY-WATT-BAYONET-PEARL-LIGHT/dp/B004ZK2QP8
>>
>>
>> There you go. Only £2.49 that will dispel the gloom at Chateau Zero
We have WINDOWS, with CLEAN GLASS. I suppose a Norfolk mud hut with slits for windows needs them
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Do you live in the land of the midnight sun?
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>> Do you live in the land of the midnight sun?
Yes, every lamppost has one.
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Ah I see! your house is illuminated by the light of the street lamps streaming though your windows. Keeps the energy bill down I suppose. Needs must.
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I asked my Mother. Apparently we used 100 or 200 in the central lights and 40, 60 or 100 in the wall and standard lights.
And she'd know!!
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>> Must have been a bit gloomy round yours.
Nope it wasn't, hence only 60 watts were the max I and everyone else I know used.
Last edited by: Zero on Wed 8 Apr 15 at 18:23
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>>Indeed I can remember the mighty 150W we use to have in our living room.>>
My Victorian property has 11ft ceilings and we use two 150w bulbs in the living room. Bought a shed load before the EU ruling came into being, as low energy bulbs are a complete waste of time in such circumstances.
Would be akin to literally being in the dark otherwise...:-)
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> I haven't seen details, but they sound really good.>>
Just done a check:
www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-32100071
tinyurl.com/p7dr7w7
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We are still selling lots of the old style bayonet cap bulbs. Twin packs of 100w @ £1.95, and 150W & 200W @ £1.75 each. On the latter two, the packaging says 'rough service lamp' which insinuates they shouod only be used in a commercial application and possibly circumvents EU legislation? What a load of cobblers.
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>> We are still selling lots of the old style bayonet cap bulbs.
>> On the packaging says 'rough service lamp' which insinuates they should only be used in a commercial application and possibly circumvents EU legislation?
>>
>> What a load of cobblers.
>>
Even bigger cobblers is " rough service lamp" on 40W and 60W candle bulbs.
Where would such bulbs be used in rough service ????
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>> >
>> Where would such bulbs be used in rough service ????
>>
Don't ask! :-)
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>> Where would such bulbs be used in rough service ????
50 shades of Edison screw?
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I get you points, so to speak
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A little nostalgia from the 1960s. For some reason this has always stuck in my mind.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKDH-cuH3nE
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>>On the latter two, the packaging says 'rough service lamp' which insinuates they shouod only be used in a commercial application and possibly circumvents EU legislation? >>
It doesn't circumvent EU legislation, just allows the trade to sell it (supposedly) to trade customers and not the public.
You can buy them without question at the electrical wholesalers near where I live.
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>>You can buy them without question at the electrical wholesalers near where I live.
>>
I can buy them in my local little general DIY shop or even in the main street of Surbiton.
The 99p chain in the old Woolworth store in Surbiton also sells 60W so it really is a farce.
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I have just replaced the four 30w halogen GU11s in the kitchen spot with 5.3w Integral branded LEDs. At a fiver each they werent cheap but came with a 3yr warranty and are superb. Lovely crisp, natural feeling white light, considerably brighter than the halogens and they run very cool. You could feel the heat from the halogen bulbs as you walked under the light. The LEDs can be touched comfortably even after an hour's use.
Also the halogen bulb life was a joke. I was replacing one of the four every month or so. Very impressed with the LEDs so far and a nice thought that the entire light unit is using almost 100w less for more Light output.
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>>Also the halogen bulb life was a joke. I was replacing one of the four every month or so
Bulbs don't seem to last as long as they used to - I've just replaced the 2 60w BC Fireglow bulbs in my fire.
One of them has blown already!
Made in Hungary :)
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>> and they run very cool. You could feel the heat from the halogen bulbs as
>> you walked under the light. The LEDs can be touched comfortably even after an hour's
>> use.
You are not allowed to spout such heresy in front of the dinosaurs here who worship at the altar of Watt.
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>> You are not allowed to spout such heresy in front of the dinosaurs here who
>> worship at the altar of Watt.
>>
Maybe it is the only heating they can afford. :-)
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>>I can buy them in my local little general DIY shop or even in the main street of Surbiton.
The 99p chain in the old Woolworth store in Surbiton also sells 60W so it really is a farce.>>
I live rather a long way from Surbiton...:-)
The lower wattage bulbs are still readily available everywhere - it was the 150w bulbs to which I was referring.
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LED CFL or incandescent - Bromptonaut
