It stopped working just before I went away. Ignited, stayed lit for a split second sometimes, or not at all. Plumber coming Monday, but today, whilst in the off position ( for both water heating and radiators) it ignited of its own accord. Stayed lit for several minutes then knocked off again.
Presumably a circuit board issue then if it ignites in those circumstances? Exactly four years ago I had fitted a new Sangamo 2 channel Heating Controller and Baxi Solo2 printed circuit board.
Any ideas on what the issue might be?.....it’s 20 years old but worked perfectly the past 4 years. Thanks.
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>> Any ideas on what the issue might be?.....it’s 20 years old but worked perfectly the
>> past 4 years. Thanks.
Flame protection Thermocouple.
Last edited by: Zero on Sat 19 Jan 19 at 09:03
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Thanks Zero
I still don’t understand why the boiler would ignite when both HW and CH were in the off position. Even if it only ignited for a few minutes.
Hopefully the ‘Gas Safe’ plumber will explain all tomorrow. Or not.
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I still don't understand why the boiler would ignite when both HW and CH were in the off position. Even if it only ignited for a few minutes.
Not sure that your aged boiler has it, but on modern boilers they are equipped with frost protection, and IIRC an auto run facilityto to try to prevent anything seizing up from non-operation.
My money is on the no flame sensor - it will either be thermocouple if old style, or an ionisation detector if 'modern.'
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Apologies
The plumber eventually turned up. No permanent pilot light on this boiler type and no thermo couple he said. Who was I to argue. It wouldn’t ignite, so on the programmer he advanced both the CH and HW settings by one hour and hey presto. It’s worked ever since, igniting for both CH and HW on two daily on/off periods, plus permanently on programme.
I’m not sure he knew what caused the inability to ignite. I certainly didn’t.
More recent pressing things have been raging toothache and rear molar extractions today so not firing on all cylinders recently ! Dentists terrify me.
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Update.
I’m going ahead with two new bathrooms prior to downsizing at some indeterminate point in future. Yes, there are for and against arguments for this work, but I enjoy a good project. Bashing off tiles, recycling the old suites, working with my plumber pal and it keeps me out of mischief.
He’s recommended a 35Kw multi point boiler ( the current 20yo Baxi isn’t working again) for my 4 bed house, and I expect that when I sell it will be to a family who will need to run hot water from multiple outlets at the same time.
Next stop is finding the most reliable boiler....a relative was recommended Viessmann but it’s been nothing but trouble!
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My next door neighbour is a plumber and has just installed a Vaillant for me, he reckons they are pretty good.
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If you are doing up to sell you need to make cost the priority. All boilers come with at least a two year warranty. A buyer will not give more for your house because you have the most expensive boiler fitted. Just being able to say “ New Boiler fitted” will do the trick. Don’t throw your money away. You might need it in ten years time.
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Which? says Worcester Bosch Greenstar are highest rated.
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What system have you got at present, and what size boiler? If not a combi, and not near 35kW then extensive pipework mods beckons, and 35kW may well need 28mm gas pipe from the meter, so a lot of work if the boiler is not near and the gas pipe is not up to spec.... You will also need a condensate drain you don't currently have. The differential cost of the boiler will be swallowed up in the installation cost several times over - when we did this a few months ago there were lots of Worcester Bosch recommendations - potential for 10yr guarantee which will be a selling point.
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Another vote for Worcester Bosch. When we replaced our old boiler and tank four years ago and fitted the WB combi our heating costs went down 25 percent. Found out the old boiler was fitted in 1987 so lasted 28 years .
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Life span of previous generation of gas boilers is not really an indication of lifespan of modern condensing type. We still have the original “Ideal” 1993 boiler in this house. I suspect cost or unavailability of parts will be the reason for replacement. Modern replacements by all accounts last ten to fifteen years tops.
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Ideal Classic filtted in mine when new 1998, I had replaced in 2014.
Igniting issues and fan bearing failure made it viable for replacement. Now have a Baxi of some sort.
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RW...it’s a Baxi Solo 2, with adjacent HW cylinder and two tanks in my loft area.
Originally it was mounted on a kitchen wall, but when I added an extension several years ago and knocked out the kitchen wall opening up a full length single storey sun room I moved the boiler 10’ directly upwards into a small storage room off a bedroom. That was lucky !
The 35KW multi point boiler will need a 28mm gas pipe. Fortunately not a major problem, and a condensate drain can be installed easily running under the bedroom floor, out through an external wall with a minimum of pipework visible straight into an outside drain.
Your good advice on what would be required matches exactly what I’ve already discussed with my friendly local plumber who’s on the ball and pointed this out to me.
He also recommended a Worcester Bosch with 10 year warranty
It may be years before I downsize, an unknown timescale due to factors not within my control, but I’ll be keeping a close eye on cost, working alongside my plumber pal, but not cutting corners on quality which would be a false economy.
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Allow for a power flush which is a day's work as this is often a pre-req to the warranty.
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Power flush is likely to find any self sealed leaks in an old system.
If you are keeping an old system with ch header tank - keep it. Do not be persuaded to rework a modern sealed system to prevent on going air ingress and pressure issues. Not worth the gain of 3 cuft of loft space!
Whilst combi systems may give you hot water at an increased pressure make sure that the flow rate at winter temperatures will be adequate for a good shower.
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Thanks smokie
My plumber mentioned that as well. I don’t need the extra loft space created by the removal of tanks.....I’m not one to collect clutter ( apart from 5 old pairs of skis) and current available loft space is fully boarded out and still plenty of room left for storage. Useful extra storage though for the new occupants, probably a family, when the time comes to sell
I think all bases are now covered and no major problems envisaged.
Last edited by: legacylad on Wed 5 Jun 19 at 13:02
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My non Gas Safe registered plumber friend recommended two fairly local plumbers who quickly provided quotes. He assures me that both these people are very good at following up and resolving any potential problems following completion. Unlike others he told me to stay clear of.
To take out the 20yo boiler, HW cylinder, 2 tanks in loft, install new flue system, fit Worcester 42cdi combi, fit condensate pipe under bedroom floor to discharge externally, power flush, add inhibitor, new remote programmer, test, commission etc etc and all new pipework.....
£3500 inc VAT. Other quote was £4200 inc VAT.
Bread and water for the next few months then should I accept
Last edited by: legacylad on Sun 28 Jul 19 at 12:19
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Whew...
Couple of months back my next door neighbour (a mate and Gas Safe plumber) replaced 25 yo boiler (in same place) with a new one, power flush, new flue and the little bit of necessary pipework.
I bought the recommended boiler (new, but there were some decent looking second hands ones on eBay at a fraction of the cost!) and flue which cost me just under £1k and I think the rest of the hardware and his time came to about another £1k. It was something between 3 and 4 man days work ( - he works alone), including a couple of other bits (the programmer failed, but I replaced with like-for-like not a remote one) and a visit to my daughter's to fix a a leak.
VAT was paid, all above board - and stuff is usually expensive in Berkshire!
Last edited by: smokie on Sun 28 Jul 19 at 13:12
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Actually sounds quite reasonable. I don’t think you would get it done for much less. Have been quoted similar here in Norfolk. My bolder is now 27 years old, not sure whether to replace it now or wait until it fails, no doubt in mid winter.
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>> My bolder is now 27 years old, not sure whether to replace it now or wait until it fails, no doubt in mid winter.
Between a rock and the other place with that one, CGN...
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Yep,
The question I have to ask myself is "do you feel lucky"
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£2000 to £3000 is pretty bang on the money for a boiler replacement, provided no substantial alterations are needed to meet current regs.
A boiler aged 27 years will be non-condensing, probably quite hungry on fuel but very durable and reliable. Provided you have a good service technician and spares availability is good, then I would keep it.
If you are planning on moving house then just factor in any survey/buyer will see an old boiler as a negative but it's still not worth changing now just for that factor.
We ran an old Harcol boiler for many years, the service technician said it's far more reliable than the modern versions but alas eventually lack of spares saw it scrapped.
Last edited by: The Melting Snowman on Sun 28 Jul 19 at 20:41
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When your 30 year old reliable cast iron boiler breaks down terminally, you will recoup the cost of the new one with lower bills over the next 10-15 years.
Its the one after that hurts..........
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That looks a fairly close call in my case.
I've only had mine about two months and, as per above, it seems I got it quite cheaply.
Its hard to properly compare because at the moment the CH isn't being used, and hot water is on for slightly less time per day. Very roughly the energy cost seems to be about 2/3rds the cost of the old one (plus the standing charge, which hasn't changed),
For simplicity let#s say my new boiler cost me £200 a year over 10 years. So I'd have to spend £600 on gas (excl standing charge) to break even, and for 2017 and 2018 my total cost (incl standing charge) was only £480 ish.
I get your point re the next replacement though.
btw my plumber reckons these newer type boilers will only have a life of about 10 years and will mostly be replace rather than repair.
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As I mentioned above we replaced our old boiler installed in 1987 four years ago with a Worcester Bosch condensing boiler .I cannot recall exact cost because it was included in other works and subbed out to a plumber by my nephew who is a builder.
Gas bill has dropped around 25% over the years since .
I reallybdo think thatvif you can afford to get a new boiler now is the time to get it rather than winter. £3 - 3.5k seems reasonable to me .
Last edited by: helicopter on Mon 29 Jul 19 at 09:42
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My Potterton Kingfisher 2 RS 80 cast iron boiler was installed in 1997 and is still going strong. My gas fitter agrees that a condensing boiler will only last about 7 years but spares for mine will probably start disappearing soon. It is perhaps time to lay in my own stock of those items most likely to fail.
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My total gas bill las year including a gas hob and occasional use of a gas fire was £560. Let’s say £400 for the hot water and heating,.
If a new boiler saves me 25% of the hot water/heating costs then that £100 a year.
If the nesw boiler cost £3,500 then I recover the cost in 35 years. I reckon I’ll keep the old one until it fails.
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August last year the boiler died............
Bought the same make - lo & he hold all the connections were in the same place.
Boiler out + new one connected in 2.5 hours - 2 men.
It then took them the same time to get the air out of the radiator system.
I still have a copper tank & cold water cistern as I hate waiting for the "not so hot" coming from a combi boiler + I have an immerser for hot water as a fall back in the event of the boiler going awol.
3 sons have combis & there is never what I call hot water.
I know it costs me more BUT the last boiler lasted 34 years. Boiler £2250 + Pump £50+ Fitting £500 - so £2800. I am sure it will outlast me.
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Also My vote for avoiding a a combi - particularly if you feeding 2 bathrooms.
I think I posted back in the thread about avoiding a pressurised system if you are using old existing rads and pipework.
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> btw my plumber reckons these newer type boilers will only have a life of about
>> 10 years and will mostly be replace rather than repair.
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Ours was replaced earlier this year with a potterton, apparently a reasonable make, because of a leak. There was a slight leak on the water inlet joint on the old one and apparently it's a difficult job so easier to change the whole thing, not quite sure I believed that story from the plumber but there we go.
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CH boiler issue - Zero
