Wow must be a real unusual sight
Queen Victoria, Britannia, Oceana and Queen mary are all anchored in Weymouth bay. Aurora is on its way back from Dover to back to Portland bay
Three Marella liners are anchored off The Isle of Wight
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>> Three Marella liners are anchored off The Isle of Wight
>>
...they're providing the "test data" for the NHS app......
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3 cruise ships asking to lie up in the Firth of Clyde off Greenock- local council is not impressed.
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Why not? surely a cruise ship with no passengers doesn't generate much in the way of waste or pollution?
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Cruise ships with passengers don't either.
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Are you sure? I thought the cruise industry was a major source of pollution.
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Yes, They have self contained foul waste tanks, dry waste compactors for on shore recovery, dump little oil in bilge, and operators are now heavily in recycling, and minimal packaging.
Last edited by: Zero on Tue 19 May 20 at 23:11
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>> Yes, They have self contained foul waste tanks, dry waste compactors for on shore recovery,
>> dump little oil in bilge, and operators are now heavily in recycling, and minimal packaging.
>>
>>
>>
>>
But you have missed out the most important item - the passengers!
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More atmospheric pollution coming from the air corridor in and out of Glasgow Airport.
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If true does not that simply show how hugely polluting is the aviation industry? It does nothing to lessen the impact of cruise ship pollution which is becoming a major concern
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No it shows that cruising is better for the environment than air travel.
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I suppose there is a trade off somewhere but you spend 2 weeks on a cruise ship but only a few hours on a plane. So in terms of your personal polluting it must be much worse.
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Yeah but a cruise ship holds 2-6000 people, so personal polluting is lower.
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Ah yes, I thought there'd be a trade off!! :-)
I used to enjoy cruises when they were still not on everyone's agenda but on the last couple it was evident that they are now attracting a "different class of people". Admittedly I am only taking about cheap ones so I suppose I am one of those. The shame of it was that some of the more unusual bits of cruising were dropped (formal dinner, set meal times with the same bunch of people you don't know for 2 weeks etc).
I doubt I'll cruise again, I've done about 8 or 9 and that's enough. The absolute best one was being away over Christmas - took the whole family (well the missus and adult daughters) and although it was pricey they did a wonderful job of Christmas on the boat.
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>> I suppose there is a trade off somewhere but you spend 2 weeks on a
>> cruise ship but only a few hours on a plane. So in terms of your
>> personal polluting it must be much worse.
>>
What about people who fly to meet their cruise ship? Even worse i suppose?
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Guess so.
However don't get me wrong - I am not suddenly becoming a tree hugger, and will be flying off later this year on hols hopefully. However I do quite like that the cities and their inhabitants are getting a bit of a rest from the pollution, and that the scientists can use this period with many less ICE engines running to evaluate better their impact and maybe come up with some science based improvements.
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i guess if you deem it so it must be right.
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I'm sorry the reality didn't match your agenda
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Weird responses, have I touched a nerve?
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I wss responding to Zero. As is often the case he seems to believe that you should not query anything he says or expect it to be supported by anything by way of proof.
I'm not sure what agenda he thinks I have. Some sort of spokesman for the airline industry perhaps or a member of Greenpeace? I was simply making the point that there is considerable evidence that the cruise industry is a major source of air pollution Whether greater or lesser than the airline industry who knows
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Ah OK, thanks for clarification. Thought I was talking out of turn!!
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>> Ah OK, thanks for clarification. Thought I was talking out of turn!!
It's all the fault of the way this forum is laid out.
If posts were in strict chronological sequence and we quoted an extract of the post to which we were referring, then there wouldn't be this confusion.
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No, its the failure of people to look at the little arrow to see to whom one is replying. :-)
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>> I wss responding to Zero. As is often the case he seems to believe that
>> you should not query anything he says or expect it to be supported by anything
>> by way of proof.
Other than a web site that as an agenda, you didn't have any proof. As for the original post that you have warped out of all reality about EMPTY cruise ships ON STANDBY, polluting the waters of Scotland during the corona virus I am dumbfounded.
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As Monty Python sues to say this sketch is getting too silly.
I can see you don't want a sensible discussion on what is actually a major problem so I will leave it there.
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>> If true does not that simply show how hugely polluting is the aviation industry? It
>> does nothing to lessen the impact of cruise ship pollution which is becoming a major
>> concern
>>
Are people bothered by that though, are significantly large numbers likely to cut back on flying or cruises due to pollution concerns?
Do you know anyone that has?
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>> Are people bothered by that though, are significantly large numbers likely to cut back on
>> flying or cruises due to pollution concerns?
>> Do you know anyone that has?
Greta Moanburg?
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>> >> Are people bothered by that though, are significantly large numbers likely to cut back
>> on
>> >> flying or cruises due to pollution concerns?
>> >> Do you know anyone that has?
>>
>> Greta Moanburg?
>>
Perhaps I should have said personally known anyone :)
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I know it's been a topic of discussion amongst some of my friends, which it never used to be. Whether it impacts plans is hard to tell.
I'm pretty sure that in younger generations it may be seen as more of an issue.
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Inverclyde where the ships want to moor have the worst stats for COVID in Scotland. Each ship has around 40-50 crew. Their argument is they don’t want to potentially add to the pressure on the health service in the area. I guess ultimately there could be a risk if one crew member got it then they would all get it. The opposing argument of course is if they don’t have it, and don’t leave the ship and no one joins the ship then they should be fine!
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I saw what looked like a giant one once in Fowey. I think it migth have been thos one
www.alamy.com/stock-photo-the-world-is-a-private-cruise-ship-travelling-around-the-globe-with-86605900.html
but whatever, it looked massive with all the little boats around it.
I've also seen Key West in Florida get rather overshadowed by some of the larger American cruise ships when they dock there. s3.amazonaws.com/floridatrend/10902/key-west-cruise-port.jpg
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Several years ago I stayed in the Molino Stucky on Giudecca for a long weekend. Chilling by the rooftop pool, it’s a huge old converted flour mill, we were still looking up at cruise boats as they went past on the Giudecca Canal. You felt you could almost reach out and touch them...not sure if the authorities have since banned such vessels from transiting the Venetian lagoon now.
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Two or three years ago. A massive yacht belonging to some Russian Oligarch moored next to the Science Museum on the Clyde in Glasgow. If ever something looked so out of place this was it!!
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There were some bigguns in Canary Wharf during the Olympics, including this German cruise liner which I believe was the "hotel" for the German officials.
www.alamy.com/stock-photo-ms-deutschland-moored-at-canary-wharf-used-by-the-german-olympic-committee-49836308.html.
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Perhaps I am missing something, but large cruise ships have never appealed.
I don't want to be crammed on an oversize tin can with several thousand others. I don't want to spend my time waiting for a few hours shore leave each day - rush off boat, find local attraction/bar, rush back to boat before it leaves.
I would possibly make an exception for a much smaller river cruise (Moselle, Danube, Rhine etc). Decent food, more leisurely pace, more to see, and perhaps a feeling that I am being treated as an individual, not live cargo.
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Never appealed to me either.
Every January we and a dozen or so friends have 4 nights at Warners. It's very enjoyable meeting up once a year especially in cold, wet January. I imagine it has a lot in common with a beached cruise ship. Average age probably 70, mass catering and assorted entertainments. Many of them seem happy to park their cars for the duration, but I find I want to go over the wire at least once every day.
I nearly booked a round Britain job a couple of years ago as a trial, but it was 8 nights and I lost my nerve before I pressed the button.
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I am a 10 year veteran of several cruises out of Southampton. Those who think they are crowded might be surprised at how well they are designed from that point of view. We never fail to find a quiet spot on deck or inside and queues (which I hate) are seldom too bad for anything. Having said that I am less attracted to the huge ships now becoming standard. Too impersonal and dominating the ports they visit.
I also see less of the cultural elements we used to enjoy (music recitals and talks) and the reduction in formal and semi-formal dining which used to add to the sense of occasion. But those are available on more expensive rival ships.
On the matter of pollution I was surprised at the smog generated at anchor in the fiords on our last cruise to Norway. When they are generating their own onboard power they do seem to puff out a fair amount of smoke. I was surprised that the Norwegians accept this but maybe it’s not as noxious as it looks as it hangs in the clear still air.
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If you've never done one (which you clearly haven't Terry) then I would recommend it. I have a mate who was of the same mind as you and, though I wouldn't say he will take up cruising as a way of life, since doing one about 2 years ago he has a second booked for later this year (which he thinks may not go ahead).
It really isn't as bad as you are imagining, and even at the lower end of the market the food and entertainment has been amazingly good value.
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“It really isn’t as bad as you imagine” isn’t exactly selling the idea I think.
It strikes me that the big drawback to the Cruise market reopening is going the the insurance. It always was dear, the cost I suspect will Now be prohibitive in the age of Covid 19. I don’t think many would be prepared to sail without medical cover even if the cruise company were to allow it. The prospect of being on a cruise liner with an outbreak of a deadly disease and nowhere to go is fairly off putting to say the least.
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I'm not really trying to sell it but I realise it's not for everyone, though it is still worth correcting misconceptions when they arise.
I don't remember taking special insurance in the past but not, for sure (even pre-Covid) it is treated similar to a dangerous sport (i.e. it has to be separately declared if you are planning a cruise).
Our first cruise was, I suppose, when it started becoming less of an old peoples thing, but I remember feeling that we (probably in our late 40s) were the youngest on the boat. I also remember a conversation with a staff person then about how they had some older people who stayed on the vessel all the time, and how they dealt with someone dying on board, which happened during that cruise.
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I suspect there are those who enjoy cruises, resort hotels and the like and those who hate the idea and prefer something a little more active Two different tribes who enjoy different things.
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>>It strikes me that the big drawback to the Cruise market reopening is going the the insurance.
For reasons that are not relevant I was party to an international presentation and discussion between underwriters and executives on underwriting in pensions, life assurance and health insurance a couple of days ago. US, UK and other European.
Going just by that call I would say that you are overestimating the likely impact of COVID-19 on the insurance market.
And that is aside from the contractual difficulty of excluding a particular virus.
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>> Perhaps I am missing something, but large cruise ships have never appealed.
>>
>> I don't want to be crammed on an oversize tin can with several thousand others.
>> I don't want to spend my time waiting for a few hours shore leave each
>> day - rush off boat, find local attraction/bar, rush back to boat before it leaves.
>>
>> I would possibly make an exception for a much smaller river cruise (Moselle, Danube, Rhine
>> etc). Decent food, more leisurely pace, more to see, and perhaps a feeling that I
>> am being treated as an individual, not live cargo.
>>
I'm of a similar mind, never known anyone go on a cruise. But the only bits I do see are on tele, they come across pretty poorly.
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>> I'm of a similar mind, never known anyone go on a cruise. But the only
>> bits I do see are on tele, they come across pretty poorly.
I have done 4. The first was a trial, to see if it was any good - Canary islands, Excellent value. small friendly ship. The rest have been for a specific reason.
2 was designed to sail into Venice at sun up on the day of our Wedding anniversary and sail out on the sunset. Delivered in spades, Again same small friendly ship
3 was chosen for winter sun, and it offered a chance to go to Mustique for the day.
4 was chosen for winter sun, and the chance to travel through the panama canal, BIgger, flashier ship.
and that will be it. Our cruises have been chosen for very specific reasons, but its our last.
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I've always thought of them being like inside Butlins (never done them) with the doors locked. Fortunately, SWMBO's of a similar opinion.
Met a couple in Madeira on a local bus. They said they were off a cruise ship, but learnt to do their own thing rather than the herded, pricy, arranged tours.
I see Easycruise didn't last.
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>> I've always thought of them being like inside Butlins (never done them) with the doors locked.
My thoughts exactly, although Mrs CS did a two week cruise with several of her relatives a while back and thoroughly enjoyed the experience.
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I've never done a cruise, though I've always vaguely fancied one.
For: The idea of wandering around the world in a floating pub/restaurant appeals to me.
Against: Being in close quarters with a small group of people and inevitably keep encountering whichever one has become my nemesis is a dreadful thought.
Sometimes cruise ships are used for meetings over a few days when not carrying the normal holidaying passengers. There's little doubt, they have superb facilities.
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No FM2R, please be sure to tell me if you ever book a cruise. But which of us would then avoid their nemesis? ;-)
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In the previous century the ex Mrs LL and I had a 7 day cruise with Royal Caribbean aboard the Song of Norway, gross tonnage 23k so small by modern standards. A different Caribbean island every day where we did our own thing. Travel around on local buses, drink Red Stripe, smoke a little weed. Very enjoyable. As past of the cruise package you could buy 4 day slots at the St James Club on Antigua, so we spent 8 days there where I tried to become proficient at Cat sailing. Failed.
My only cruising since has been bareboat charters with qualified friends. Flamingo yacht charters out of Largs one October with a bunch of extrovert retired firemen springs to mind. I now prefer small gulet cruising with SCIC which suits me down to the ground. Very informal. No footwear. Access to snorkelling kit, kayaks, all meals on deck and lots of swimming. Multi national clientele for interesting conversation...preferably a max of 10 passengers so not proper cruising. And sleeping out on deck under the stars rather than in my cabin, diving overboard as the sun rose. B marvellous.
Must go again but not this year, unless they are operating by early September.
Last edited by: legacylad on Thu 21 May 20 at 08:56
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>> Sometimes cruise ships are used for meetings over a few days when not carrying the
>> normal holidaying passengers. There's little doubt, they have superb facilities.
>>
I’ve been on the Aurora for a couple of conferences, each involving 2 nights on-board and the glamorous route of Southampton>>Channel Islands>>Southampton. Their ability to constantly marshal, entertain and feed a large number of guests reminded me of conferences in Las Vegas - albeit on a smaller scale. But impressive. The quality of the food and entertainment was excellent. The experience of being on a boat is not however one I’d pay for. I had a room with a balcony, but it was really rather small. On one of the trips we were unable to park in the Channel Islands as it was too windy, so we just sailed round and round in a figure of 8, though I have to say it didn’t seem that bad to me...certainly not enough to make me feel ill. The constant PA announcements, all preceded by a ‘bing-bong’, reminded me of Hi-de-Hi! The ship itself isn’t one of the larger ones I don’t think, and after 2 days I’d had more than enough...and while a conference isn’t the same as a holiday, so a different kind of clientele, I’d had enough of the other guests as well :p
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We have done a few cruises.
Couple with CMV based at Tilbury. One cruise round the Baltic, one round the British Isles. On the Marco Polo, IIRC. Very pleasant, cheaper, older ships, no balconies.
A few with P & O based at Southampton. Round the Med - a couple of times? - The Canaries - a couple of times. We do enjoy it. Don't book the set dining thing, have Freedom Dining, different companions every evening. Better for us, better for them. We did feel that they were going a little bit down-market. Not quite our thing, don'cha know!
One short cruise in Vietnam - Ha Long Bay - was it? Quite remarkable sights. Casts(?) is that the word - sticking up out of the sea.
Whether we will do another one, I don't know. I like the freedom they give you. Someone else does all the work. Go ashore when you want, eat when you want. What's not to like?
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Would any one want to venture onto a cruise ship while there is still a risk of Corvid19. Considering that the majority of passengers are over 60 and many are in the vulnerable category and would be exposing themselves to the risk of death I would think the answer to my question would be “very few”. I think it will take a long long before the industry fully recovers. Many of the older vessels will be bound for the scrapyard.
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I would consider it. I'm not really taken with the round the Med/Caribbean concept but a round UK cruise, perhaps with an emphasis on wildlife would appeal. Friends did Queen Mary to NYC via Liverpool, Iceland and Canada last summer and that would do for me too.
The one I'd really enthuse for is a trip to Western Isles and St Kilda on Hebridean Princess.
www.hebridean.co.uk/
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Cruise ships - tyrednemotional
