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...certainly not from my experience......
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Early days on the 335 - but the old 320 covered 30000 faultless miles in two years. Nothing went wrong.
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>> Early days on the 335 - but the old 320 covered 30000 faultless miles in
>> two years. Nothing went wrong.
>>
I should hope not. That mileage is nothing.
My gauge of reliability is the number of faults up to 100,000 miles which is when I usually move them on. Or at least when I was working full-time.
In my experience only certain Japanese petrols and some Fords with manual gearboxes have met my expectations.
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My mechanic friend, who is chief MOT tester at a large auto engineering firm, always recommends Japanese petrol or Ford petrol manual also! His own car, for the past several years, is a Civic S. With trade insurance he gets to drive other friends more 'exotic' vehicles.
When I was looking to buy a 'performance estate' to replace my faultless '04 330 he positively recommended the Focus ST, and strongly advised that newer BMW petrols would have nowhere near the reliability of my 12yo one.
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>> In my experience only certain Japanese petrols and some Fords with manual gearboxes >>have met my expectations.
Indeed. That just about sums up the petrol, manual, Japanese barge that I have owned for the past 15 years.
It's a low mileage shopping trolley, too.
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Skoda 3rd and Audi 24th - when the majority, at least the 4-cylinder models, are mechanically identical? What these surveys never tell you is how they compile the figures.
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A lot of it is down to expectations, an Audi buyer will report every squeak or rattle whereas a Skoda buyer will have lower expectations of the brand and will be more tolerant of minor issues. Thats the theory anyway ...
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>> A lot of it is down to expectations, an Audi buyer will report every squeak
>> or rattle whereas a Skoda buyer will have lower expectations of the brand and will
>> be more tolerant of minor issues. Thats the theory anyway ...
>>
There could be something in that ...
www.dailymail.co.uk/money/cars/article-4809954/Millionaire-tech-boss-mission-sue-Tesla-39k.html
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It's a somewhat meaningless survey.... statistics don't lie, but liars use statistics and all that... Two (at least!) major flaws in it...
1. No correction for mileage; if the Kia shopping trollies are only doing 5k average whereas the BMW rep mobiles are doing 20k / year, then you would expect more attention required to the BMWs
2. It says 'reliability' - but it's not really that - presumably dealer visits,which could range from a minor trim rattle to a major component replacement. Suggestion is that the BMWs have been twice during the 3 years, whereas the KIAs have been a bit less than once on average. If all the KIAs needed a new gearbox, whereas the BMWs only required tightening a couple of screws then it's hardly a fair comparison.
Devil in the detail as ever!
Reliability to me is the failure to proceed requiring roadside assistance - in the best part of half a million miles motoring in old bangers, this has only happened 4 times: BX PAS return hose split and had to be recovered from Manchester to Reading (actually this could have been repaired as it was only a rubber hose); ZX broke its throttle cable (I would have limped home with the throttle lever tied up!); C4 Piacsso has had to be picked up twice following low oil pressure due to blocked pick up filter in the sump (now removed, so no more of that!).
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>> It's a somewhat meaningless survey.... >> Devil in the detail as ever!
>>
Agree totally!
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If a Kia fails, the manufacturer will lose money by fixing it under warranty period.
If a BMW fails after 3 years, manufacturer will make profit by repairing it.
So, Kia has a vested interest to make their cars more reliable where as BMW has not.
My logic is simple, if manufactures believe their cars would be reliable, they would offer longer warranty to prove it.
It takes guts to offer 7-yr warranty!
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>>>A lot of it is down to expectations, an Audi buyer will report every squeak or rattle whereas a Skoda buyer will have lower expectations of the brand and will be more tolerant of minor issues.
I've said this for decades... there are certain classes of owners with certain brands who don't tell of their issues and others who are happy to slate their cars... really skews these surveys. The "public" as a whole are rubbish judges of cars.
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>> I've said this for decades... there are certain classes of owners with certain brands who
>> don't tell of their issues and others who are happy to slate their cars... >>
I am not sure it is so much the type of owner though it's true, for instance that trip adviser reviews are not a perfect judge of holiday accommodation as only a certain type of people complete trip advisor reviews.
I think it's more about expectations, if I picked up, say, a Kia hire car and it only had the odd rattle or squeak and was OK to drive I would be pleasantly surprised, though if I picked up, say, an Audi hire car and it had the odd rattle or squeak and was a little dull to drive I would be very disappointed.
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JD Power is really a satisfaction survey so I agree - it's in large part a measure of how a car has lived up to its owner expectations.
Some people who buy what they perceive to be superior cars can however also be blind to their faults. Years ago, in the early 80s, I had a customer who loved Jaguars. He had a series 2 XJ6 that had, by his admission, been horribly unreliable and had spent many weeks at the dealers.
He put this down to bad luck, and it didn't dent his faith in the cars at all. He replaced it with a series 3. I next saw him a year or so later and asked if he had found the new car any better.
"Yes" he said "much better put together. A couple of teething problems, so they put a new back axle and gearbox in it, but generally it's been fantastic!"
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I've only had one truly unreliable car in 42 years of driving. The infamous Renault Espace. There were a couple of others which had niggling problems, but if the measure of it is failing to complete journeys, then that thing was the worst.
By and large, in my experience anyway, if modern cars are properly maintained they don't tend to give many problems. I've averaged +/- 40,000 miles a year for decades, often in very high mileage cars, but apart from that accursed French bathtub, none of them have been too much bother. Never had to replace a clutch or exhaust or anything. Light bulbs mainly, but arguably they are wear and tear items.
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>> A lot of it is down to expectations, an Audi buyer will report every squeak
>>
Not just Audi buyers but also Tesla buyers
A millionaire tech boss is suing Tesla for £39,000 over a squeaky seat.
www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-4809954/Millionaire-tech-boss-mission-sue-Tesla-39k.html
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I guessed correctly! Not just in the Uk either. www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2017/06/21/kia-genesis-porsche-top-jd-power-car-quality-study/103050990/ and www.jdpower.com/microsites/kia/home
Though as someone responsible for quality at my workplace, Kia is a brand I've been watching for a while.
They're going to have to sort out their UK dealers though - I've found an excellent one, but my supplying dealer was the worst main dealer I've ever bought from - failed promises, items missing from my new car, the bumper not replaced properly (they fitted a towbar), etc.
Last edited by: Tigger on Sun 20 Aug 17 at 06:52
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This has been a long-term journey for Hyundai and Kia ...
In 2006, Hyundai hired former BMW designer Thomas Bürkle to lead the company’s design department. Kia’s turnaround is thanks to its hiring of Peter Schreyer from Audi. Today, Schreyer is design chief at both brands, but will soon retire. His hand-picked replacement is Luc Donckerwolke, formerly of Bentley.
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The wife of a friend bought a new Kia Sportage 2 years ago. Had problem after problem with it. Off topic but I don't like the front grille design on them
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Clever from The Telegraph.
26 website clicks needed to find out the winner
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If you click on View All link, it is easier to see the brands in one page.
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UK's Most Reliable Cars - tyrednemotional
