Just seen the top 10 sellers in the UK for the month of April. No Mondeo? Maybe it hasn't been in the top 10 for ages and I only just noticed? The Passat gets 10th place. Must be an on-going disappointment for Ford?
VW have 3 in the top 10 - they seem to be on the rise?
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It's got too big and expensive, and this segment (I think it's known as the D segnent) is generally feeling the pinch.
A Focus, Golf or Octavia will do almost as much for less. And at the top end of the Mondeo range you can get an entry-level BMW for similar cost if you don't need the space. The 3-series features regularly in the UK top 10.
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Sales of the Mondeo have gradually fallen over the years, perhaps due to the economic climate, the increase in smaller 4x4 models and the rise in MPVs' popularity, but it's still a truly great car.
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>>It's got too big and expensive
It's a good car and one that I'll consider next year when I'm due to replace my current limousine. Price-wise, it seems that buyers are able to negotiate more off a new Mondeo than most other cars, but why on earth do manufacturers insist on making each new model so much bigger that the one it replaced?
Last edited by: Clk Sec on Sun 8 May 11 at 07:53
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It is a good car, a big car but a damn fine car. Its one ugly SoB tho and looking uglier by the day. It has presence for sure, but only the presence of a fat lady with two much jewellery and a short skirt.
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"a fat lady with two much jewellery and a short skirt"
Where? Get her number for me.
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>>It is a good car, a big car but a damn fine car. Its one ugly SoB tho and looking uglier by the day. It has presence for sure, but only the presence of a fat lady with two much jewellery and a short skirt.<<
Couldn't have put it better myself. It gives me the impression they started out with a Transit this time and tried to prettify it.
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It's now bigger than the Granada. My brother just changed jobs and was given a Mondeo - he said it's a very tight fit in your average parking space so is a bit of a pain when out and about. He also remembers Mondeos used to handle well, but said the current one is horrible.
More generally; considering the lead-time on most new cars, it's amazing new car sales numbers haven't fallen more.
Last edited by: Bill Payer on Sun 8 May 11 at 10:01
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It's bigger than a 5 Series in most dimensions....5 Series bis a big car..Saw a new Focus, I guess that's the new Mondeo..!
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>> It's bigger than a 5 Series in most dimensions....5 Series bis a big car..Saw a new Focus, I guess that's the new Mondeo..!>>
On the same lines as the current Polo is the original Golf...:-)
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The size is mainly why i bought my Titanium X.I paid £17,500 for a pre reg car with delivery miles on it.Considering the amount of toys on it i think it was a bargain.
I am 6 foot 4inches tall and i can push my drivers seat back to where i am comfortable and then get in the back and there is still a few inches in front of my legs.
I have cornering lights(excellent),auto wipers,auto lights,dab radio,heated seats,voice control,bluetooth phone with hands free and the list goes on and on.
In fact its easier to state just what the car hasn't got which is sat nav(an option) and memory seats.Other than that it is fully loaded.
The car is extremely refined,fairly economical (37mpg round town and 51 on the motorway) and a blast to drive round the twisty roads.
I cannot think of any other car to buy that fills all of my needs so completely for the price i paid.
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I found this interesting "streamgraph" charting the ups and downs of the UK's best-selling cars over the last 30-odd years in a friend's magazine: twitpic.com/3ze045/full (Not my hosting, just a copy I found online)
The Mondeo, it seems, has been in the Top 10 every year since its launch in 1993, except for 2007 and 2010. The largest area in the chart is covered by the humble Escort...
Last edited by: Dave_TDCi on Sun 8 May 11 at 18:41
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>> The Mondeo, it seems, has been in the Top 10 every year since its launch
>> in 1993, except for 2007 and 2010.
>>
Yet it has been outsold year on year by the 3 series which BMW dealers have to park around the block.
That graph certainly shows what can be achieved with statistics...
BMW 1, Volvo 1
Only Volvo I can see in the chart is a blip with the 300 in the early 80's.
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I'm wondering where the potential Vectra buyers went with the introduction of the Vectra C; the Cavalier mk2, 3 and Vectra B have a fairly consistent 'stream' from '82 to 2002, then it disappears. Doesn't look like they bought Mondeos instead either.
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>> I'm wondering where the potential Vectra buyers went with the introduction of the Vectra C; the Cavalier mk2, 3 and Vectra B have a fairly consistent 'stream' from '82 to
>> 2002, then it disappears. Doesn't look like they bought Mondeos instead either.
The Vauxhall Insignia is consistently in the top 10 sellers. No 6 or 7 in the last Top 10 list I saw. tinyurl.com/68f2xk7
Last edited by: Victorbox on Mon 9 May 11 at 13:36
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>>
>> The Vauxhall Insignia is consistently in the top 10 sellers. No 6 or 7 in
>> the last Top 10 list I saw. tinyurl.com/68f2xk7
>>
The Insignia does just about make it onto the the right hand end of the 'stream' , it's just there's a big gap in the Vauxhall 'streams' where you'd expect the Vectra C to be. The Astra and Nova/Corsa chug along at much the same level for years and years.
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>> That graph certainly shows what can be achieved with statistics
The pie chart shows 2 for Mini as well - one entry at each end of the timescale.
The top ten best-sellers collectively shifted more units in 1989 than in any other year, suggesting a few models dominated the market; In 2010 total sales of the top ten cars were roughly the same as in 1973 - were there more different manufacturers and models on the market in 2010 though?
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>>I cannot think of any other car to buy that fills all of my needs so completely for the price i paid.>>
My best mate, who has had Mondeos for the past 12 years or more, also recently got a new Titanium X (same model run as his outgoing 2008 car); for the first time, apart from all the features you point out, he got an automatic due to a knee replacement op.
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>> He also remembers Mondeos used
>> to handle well, but said the current one is horrible.
>>
What complete rubbish. I've driven one and was very impressed by the handling and comfort, as have most other people/road tests.
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The Mondeo does handle well for sure, for a big car.
The earlier mondeo handled well, and was smaller.
A good handling small car is always better than a large good handling car.
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>> >> He also remembers Mondeos used
>> >> to handle well, but said the current one is horrible.
>> >>
>>
>> What complete rubbish. I've driven one and was very impressed by the handling and comfort, as have most other people/road tests. >>
Agreed 100%.
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>>Agreed 100%.>>
Spot on. A great driver's car from the launch in 1993 and has remained so. Ford learned a lot from the 1990 Escort debacle and studied the Nissan Primera very closely on its ride and handling qualities whilst designing the Mondeo.
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While the '90s Primera was a fine handing, as was the 405 at the time, the Mondeo was miles ahead of the opposition when launched in '93 and has not been surpassed for it's ride / handling combo since.
The '93 Mondeo set a trend that was taken forward with the '98 Focus the DNA of which is evident in most all Fords today, even the Fiat 500 based Ka has a Ford developed chassis since adopted by Fiat.
My only issue with the current Mondeo is the belt cam diesels. Also it is a little large, a car between the Focus III and Mondeo IV would be ideal, rather like the Mondeo III.
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>>a car between the Focus III and Mondeo IV would be ideal, rather like the Mondeo III.
Spot on, Cheddar.
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>> >>a car between the Focus III and Mondeo IV would be ideal, rather like the
>> Mondeo III.
>>
>> Spot on, Cheddar.
>>
Just what I wanted.
I have bought and run S/H Ford saloons ( with just a two year gap ) all my driving life.
I have been enjoying my MK II but am starting to look for a replacement.
Unless I get a rare last of the MK 3 saloons or perhaps a late MKII Focus saloon I will be looking to another brand. It appears the latest Focus saloon is not sold in the UK.
I am not interested in a hatchback so Ford have failed me :-(
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Henry, fear not here is the 4 door mondeo saloon of your dreams
www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201119386654394/
Last edited by: Zero on Mon 9 May 11 at 15:32
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>> the 4 door mondeo saloon of your dreams
That's the Jaguar for girls.
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>> I am not interested in a hatchback so Ford have failed me :-(
>>
Are you not interested in the Mondeo IV saloon, Henry? Such as....
tinyurl.com/3q3l3cm
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>>Henry, fear not here is the 4 door mondeo saloon of your dreams
>>
>>Are you not interested in the Mondeo IV saloon, Henry? Such as....
I forgot to add petrol, auto and not black. So the best I can hope for is a silver one.
Just four such saloons, country wide on Autotrader.
Something very like this
tinyurl.com/62rrh47
I also have to offload my beautifully running existing Mondeo that has a few " blemishes " etc so I would expect problems getting rid of it.
It cannot be worth much now :-(
It has done !30K, cam belt done, autobox rebuilt but rust starting!!!
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>>>the Mondeo was miles ahead of the opposition when launched in '93 and has not been surpassed for it's ride / handling combo since.
In 1993 the Xantia had a better ride/handling combination than a Mondeo. The current C5 probably is the equal of the current Mondeo but with a slight bias towards ride... it would be a close thing and entirely down to personal preference.
Anyone who doesn't think the current Mondeo handles well is probably only comfortable pushing a smaller car... not uncommon.
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>> In 1993 the Xantia had a better ride/handling combination than a Mondeo. >>
No way, the Xantia rode well though the chassis was no match for the Mondeo, communicative steering, sharp turn in. In handling terms the 405 and Primera were closest.
>> The current C5 probably is the equal of the current Mondeo but with a slight bias towards ride...>>
Again no way, again the C5 rides well though in handling terms is no match.
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>> Anyone who doesn't think the current Mondeo handles well is probably only comfortable pushing a
>> smaller car... not uncommon.
No not true, A bigger, and therefore heavier car, will never handle as well as a lighter car. Too much physics at work.
And the 93 Xantia was no way near being as good a handler as the Mondeo. Now if you skip to the Activa however, there was an astonishingly good handling car, almost race car like. Funny ride tho.
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There are many testers of the day who realised the Xantia had very good handling within its class. So did the Mondeo. Chalk and cheese... no way.
Same as the current C5 vs Mondeo... there are differences but they are down to preference... and unless you want to constantly scare passengers or opposing traffic the *extra* handling ability of the Mondeo is of questionable benefit.
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Its more to do with feel. A C5 felt sloppier than a Mondeo. Tho I have to admit I havent driven the newer C5
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I'll not argue the C5 steering isn't as sharp as the Mondeo (again talking current models) but it doesn't stop you driving the C5 at continental motorway speeds on twisty B-roads in great safety and with a huge amount of pleasure.... so I've heard :-)
I'm sorry to say I didn't like the post Xantia C5... a bloated wallowing beast.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Mon 9 May 11 at 09:50
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And the same with the lancer, but I cant place the front wheels within an inch of the kerb at great speed through the twisties as I can with a Mondeo, or my best all round handler, the Mk1 focus.
However, and I think this maybe where you are coming from, there is a quite smirk of satisfaction to be had from making a car thats maybe not quite so good as a recognised speed chariot, go round bends as fast as, if not faster than, the guy who though he had you beat or thought he could stick with your tail because you had a "crap" car.
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>>>I think this maybe where you are coming from...
Quite... cutting edge turn-in is great for the track (and pub discussions) but in reality on public roads not quite so important as the motoring press would like us to think.
The situation has become daft when in pursuit of over-developed grip levels many so called luxury cars have a rubbish ride unless on a smooth motorway.
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>> Quite... cutting edge turn-in is great for the track (and pub discussions) but in reality on public roads not quite so important as the motoring press would like us to think.>>
It makes it more fun.
>> The situation has become daft when in pursuit of over-developed grip levels many so called luxury cars have a rubbish ride unless on a smooth motorway.>>
I have concluded that sharp turn in and responsive steering are more important to me than a plush ride, hence our 120i with sport suspension has grown on me, it kind of jiggles along on rougher surfaces though you can feel exactly what it is doing, and hence I am looking forward to getting another one, er another 1 ...
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It jiggles on rougher surfaces? Thats most of the UK then.
You like it? You are mad.
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>> It jiggles on rougher surfaces? Thats most of the UK then.
>>
Jiggles is too strong a term, rather you can feel what it is doing instaed of being isolated from the road.
>> You like it? You are mad. >>
No doubt ...
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Fair enough Cheddar... I was always a CX rather than Alfasud type of guy.
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"One man's meat is another man's poison."
I have to say, though, I agree with Zero. I think that the SE version of a BMW is a better compromise between handling and comfort than the Sport set-up ( but that's only my opinion.)
And to return to topic, I like the balance in the Mondeo better still - though admittedly I only had a short test drive when I tried it.
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>>Now if you skip to the Activa however, there was an astonishingly good handling car, almost race car like. Funny ride tho. >>
The Activa's handling (and ride) was quite remarkable.
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>> The Activa's handling (and ride) was quite remarkable
+1
A friend's father was a motor trader when we were in our early 20s, and my friend used to borrow whatever looked nice from the forecourt if he was between cars himself. I remember getting a lift with him in a nearly-new early Xantia along a recently-planed road replete with raised manhole covers. Magic carpet ride really was the only description you could give it, you saw the 6" high bumps go under the car but absolutely didn't feel them.
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>>Magic carpet ride really was the only description you could give it, you saw the 6" high bumps go under the car but absolutely didn't feel them. >>
The Peugeot 405 had similar suspension qualities, as did the Citroen XM. The latter's ability to ensure the car's bodyshell was level on a slope was fascinating.
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>> Now if you skip to the Activa however
Need to get a shot of one of these, they're like a quiet legend.
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The Activa engine was not great however, it was a 150bhp turbo 8v, not a sweet as the 135bhp 16v and no where near as sweet as the Vauxhall 2.0 16v that was the class leader in terms of refinement at the time.
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I used to have an Activa (actually I owned the same car twice, but that's another story ...).
No, the 8v engine was not the best but when up to speed the handling was superb. I remember a drive down the twisties near us where I was on the tail of a Delta Integrale, the kind of road where he couldn't show his quicker speed, but I could show my superb handling.
The Activa was a real Q-car, and I think the Delta driver must have been thinking "He's a complete nutter" or "How is he keeping up with me?".
To those who haven't driven one, it is highly recommended.
As far as standard Xantias are concerned they have too much understeer to be compared with contemporary Mondeos when it comes to handling.
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I think you lot are remembering the early 90s Mondeo with some fondness way beyond its actual abilities. It was OK... but only OK.
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certainly remembering it with more fondness than the C5!
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As I said above I never rated the 2000s C5... the Mondeo III was a far better car in most respects.
But that 90s Mondeo... I looked after and drove them for others on a weekly basis and they fell short of the Xantia in so many respects.
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>> remembering the early 90s Mondeo with some fondness way beyond its actual abilities. It was OK... but only OK.
I had a 95 Mondeo estate, the handling of which was a revelation after the 89 Nissan Bluebird before it. But... on a twisty road the Mondeo wouldn't have seen which way my subsequent Octavia estate went. I never, ever got the back end of the Skoda out, even when *really* trying. The same couldn't be said of the Ford.
Last edited by: Dave_TDCi on Mon 9 May 11 at 16:02
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You're a Girl, that's why.
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>> You're a Girl, that's why.
I prefer the excuse that it only had 68bhp, and decent Michelins all round :)
Seriously, take it on an empty dusty car park and chuck it sideways and it *would not* spin.
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>> >> remembering the early 90s Mondeo with some fondness way beyond its actual abilities. It
I had one of the first Mk2's - '96 Mondeo 2.0 GLX - as a company car and I particularly remember that that had very good body control - not bouncing or lurching.
At the time, some of our guys were getting BMW318iSE as the lease costs were similar. Autocar did a comparison road test of those exact 2 cars and said that by any objective measure the Mondeo was the better car.
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I'd have a well specced new Mondeo estate in a heartbeat. Might do actually one day.
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>> I'd have a well specced new Mondeo estate in a heartbeat. Might do actually one
>> day.
Funnily enough for the first time in 20 years I'm considering spending my own money on a Ford. Through a relative that works for them a 3 month old Mondeo Estate 2.2TDCI Titanium X Sport (?!? - what happened to LX, GLX, Ghia?) auto with all the options is stupidly cheap.
We 'need' an estate car again, and the usual German suspects all have price tags that begin with a 3, or even a 4 without too much trying; a Ford with a price starting with a 1 suddenly looks quite attractive proposition! But I do like the new 5 series touring...and the C5 estate looks pretty good in estate guise as well...
Peter
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Don't think you'd regret it Peter, and you know what they all look pretty much the same when you're looking through the windscreen from the inside...
:-)
P.S. Have you bought a dog or taken up surfing or something?
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I'm sure I wouldn't Humph - all slightly tongue in cheek :-) But what does one wear when driving a Ford ;-)
Infrequent mountain biking is the extent of my physical activity though, and you'd be surprised how easy it is to stuff a bike in an A4 convertible once the wheels are removed! No, unfortunately my partner is back on dialysis. The quantity of 'stuff' involved means that european motoring holidays become far easier than longer haul flying (which is still possible, but needs much more planning), hence the move back to an estate car for one of our cars.
We'd been through a few estates when dialysis first started - 3 and 5 series touring, E class estate and an A4 Avant, but a transplant meant a reprieve for a while. Now the need is back again they were where I looked first - habit I guess. But haven't cars have got expensive in the last few years!! And bigger too; the Mondeo is vast...looks kind of moody in dark colours with big alloys though; I quite like that about it
Peter
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>> what does one wear when driving a Ford...
A smug smile mostly
:-)
Never flip-flops though. They're for oiks...
Last edited by: Humph D'Bout on Tue 10 May 11 at 20:38
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It'd be a struggle, but I think I could manage smug ;-)
And I think I can find a spare suit jacket to hang in the back too...
Genuinely impressed by the spec on the Mondeo though; seems to want for nothing at all, and some of the features are unusal on A4/3/C class cars, never mind A6/5/Es; full powered heated ventilated seats and radar cruise control spring to mind
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Most of the stuff that comes as standard you can chuck down the crapper. Voice control? useless idea that dont work. The Bluetooth is very iffy working as and when it likes. Its loaded with crap to make it desirable, and the shame is it doesn't need it.
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Interesting stuff Z; I guess that succinctly articulates my concerns really. Is it style over substance; quantity (of stuff) vs quality? For example my Audi has voice control that works really well, even down to complete operation of the Sat Nav, and it works well even with the roof down (up to 'sensible' speeds), so if the execution of things in the Ford is not as good that'd be disappointing. But is is a hefty 5 figure sum less than the alternatives...
Peter
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I expect the voice control works well enough if you drop your "h"s...
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:-)
I had heard that the sat nav in VAG group cars was 'tuned' such that when you searched for restaurants you got different results depending on whether you were in a Skoda/VW/Audi or Bentley, but I have no idea if there's any truth in it...though mine's never suggested McDonalds!!
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I so hope that's true! That's brilliant! A Bentley engineer lives across the road, I'm going to ask him...
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>> Most of the stuff that comes as standard you can chuck down the crapper. Voice
>> control? useless idea that dont work. The Bluetooth is very iffy working as and when
>> it likes. Its loaded with crap to make it desirable, and the shame is it
>> doesn't need it.
>>
You obviously don't own a Mondeo Zero because on mine the technology works fine.The bluetooth works brilliantly and people who i ring in the car don't even know i'm driving due to the noise cancelling tech and the refinement keeping the cabin quiet.
The voice control is also a godsend.I burn cd's with over 100 mp3 tracks on it and if i'm on track 6 and want track 102 then i just press the voice control and tell it the track number.It then changes to the correct track within seconds instead of pressing the up button 96 times.
I smile when i read about Audi's and Bmw's etc that are asking hundreds of pounds for things like power folding mirrors,cornering lights,split folding rear seats,dab radio etc when its all standard on my Titanium X.
A top spec Mondeo knocks spots off anything the prestige badges can offer and for a lot less money.
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>> You obviously don't own a Mondeo Zero because on mine the technology works fine.The bluetooth
>> works brilliantly and people who i ring in the car don't even know i'm driving
>> due to the noise cancelling tech
I had a colleague who did, and it paired to his Nokia for 3 days after delivery and refused to pair to it again He borrowed y phone, which it paired to for 15 minutes then refused to pair to again. Fords answer was "we don't support blue tooth - it works or it doesn't"
As for voice control, we had great fun on journeys with him, it was constant amusement seeing how it would interpret his voice.
>> The voice control is also a godsend.I burn cd's with over 100 mp3 tracks on
>> it and if i'm on track 6 and want track 102 then i just press
>> the voice control and tell it the track number.It then changes to the correct track
>> within seconds instead of pressing the up button 96 times.
And who the hell put 100 straight tracks on a cd, have you not heard of folders? No wonder you can never find anything.
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I would be a tad worried if all that someone could say about the car was "because its got features" Refinement, noise, ride, handling, economy, room, looks, feel, build quality, all come way before "noise cancelling bluetooth"
I happen to know, because I have driven one, that it does have all those things in abundance (except looks) so I would never tell someone not to buy one or criticise their choice if they did.
But I would never buy a car for the toys over its abilities to do the basics well.
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>>(except looks)
As I've said above, I would consider buying a Mondeo because it's a good car. But in terms of looks, it's less pretty than the equivalent sized Vauxhall, Mazda and Peugeot in my opinion.
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I've always been a fan of the Mondeo. I remember taking a run of the mill 1.8 GLX mk1 across a few of my favourite roads around Oxfordshire back in 1993, and marvelling in particular at the body control. One of these roads was particularly undulating, with a very iffy surface in places. Even when really pressing on, the car felt glued to the road, with no unwanted body movement, and absolutely refused to wallow or float at speeds which would have had almost anything else I'd ever driven feeling like an accident waiting to happen. It cornered flat, yet rode well, something until then I'd only ever experienced in a hot Peugeot. It still amazes me to this day how such a forgettable looking car was so dynamically polished, and was so driver focused.
It's an often forgotten fact that Jackie Stewart had been a consultant to the chassis team, and personally spent a lot of time on the development of the car, which probably goes some way to explaining its ability. The mk1 was a big old lump too for its time, but felt lighter on its feet than pretty much anything comparable from anyone else. A heck of an achievement.
I haven't driven a mk4, but I have driven a couple of S-Maxes which are based on the same chassis. They too have that lovely damping quality and body control which I remember from the mk1. Very good drivers cars, all of them, and even the base models have the same poise and sheer unflappability.
The Mondeo is a great car, IMHO.
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>> Funnily enough for the first time in 20 years I'm considering spending my own money
>> on a Ford. >>
I bought my first Ford (S-Max) in 30 years of driving at the start of the year. Never even had one as a company car. And I'm very pleased with it. Oh, and the bluetooth works fine.
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Ford Mondeo IV - Not a top 10 seller? - Avant
