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I've got to drive one of these things about 600 miles tomorrow, 80% "motorway". It's a 2003 1.9D "Forte", whatever that means. What's a good cruising speed? Economy at that speed? Real life hints, tips, and gotchas?
Last edited by: FotheringtonTomas on Tue 20 Apr 10 at 13:19
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Eggs, grandma, suck, I know FT, but if it's lent to you, have sight of MOT/Tax, insurance if relevant, and check tyres/lights/fog lights, the lot, cos it's you that's going to be responsible for it all, however well you get on with the owner.
But you knew that.
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Is that because it's a diesel? I have never driven a diesel before.
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you need to find a dog to put in it.
My rates are resonable, you can borrow fifi for £5 an hour and all the digestives she can eat.
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As a Citroen minded guy I'll have a punt at 70-75mph cruise.... max out at 90 on speedo. Fuel 45-50mpg.
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We have the same engine in an 05 in Desire trim. Under 70BHP so no ball of fire. Once it's cranked itself up there it will happily sit at 80 all day. It's much more relaxed though below 3000rpm which equates to a smidge under 70mph. At that speed you might just hit 40mpg; the 1.9 engine is much less economical than the HDi.
We've done 600 mile days (Calais to Chambery, Ullapool to Northampton) and the B is surprisingly good. Tons of space for kids, high seating position so good views; driving seat and position really comfortable. Just sit at 65 and stop every two hours or so to change drivers - Simples!!
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>> It's much more relaxed though below 3000rpm which equates to a smidge under
>> 70mph. At that speed you might just hit 40mpg; the 1.9 engine is much less
>> economical than the HDi.
Ugh. A concern by the lender was fuel costs. It won't save much money compared to driving my Honda, especially considering the extra Insurance cost.... maybe a save of £0.
>> We've done 600 mile days (..) Just sit at 65 and stop every two hours or so
>> to change drivers - Simples!!
Um. I will drive the distance in two "legs", about 3 hours apart.
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You obviously know Bromptonaut but only 40mpg kept to 65mph?? Our Xantia 1.9TDs would do a genuine 47mpg on holiday runs to Scotland at motorway speeds. Perhaps it's the Berlingo's upright shape?
As for the mask FT I'm guessing Humph was referring to the gorilla type.
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>> You obviously know Bromptonaut but only 40mpg kept to 65mph?? Our Xantia 1.9TDs would do [snip]
We were surprised at first and perhaps 40 is an underestimate. I also think breeze block aerodynamics are the reason. The front is not too bad but the 5foot vertical drop at the rear will rough up airflow no end.
French trips usually feature a roof box and, with a teenage family, four adults & baggage too.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Tue 20 Apr 10 at 14:56
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"You obviously know Bromptonaut but only 40mpg kept to 65mph??"
Not that impressive for a diesel. My petrol Berlingo (1.6) averages about 43 mpg.
At least it does if I drive it.
;-)
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>> At that speed you might just hit 40mpg; the 1.9 engine is much less economical than the HDi.
Only 40mpg? Is there something wrong (e.g. blocked air filter)? I get that from my BMW 530d Automatic without really trying.
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Observations:
Odd air vents.
Seat won't go back quite far enough.
Sliding doors quite "heavy" in operation.
The brakes are rather sharp.
There's a flippin' great pogo-stick spring under the accelerator.
There seems to be a slight delay (about 1/5 sec) between pressing the hooter "button" and a noise being produced.
There's nothing under 1,500 RPM.
There's no "extra" above about 3,000 RPM.
If you want to move off sharply, think carefully and floor it, first doesn't go up far.
4th is easy to get if you're looking for second in a hurry.
No "gate" on reverse.
If you want to overtake, forget about it (unless lots of space available, then floor it and wait).
If you want to go up a hill, before you get to the bottom, floor it.
The most power seems available by flooring it and rollong off the throttle very slightly.
Going downhill, roll the throttle off a bit to prevent "excitable elephant" syndrome, especialli if it's bumpy.
When you floor it, the engine note changes and that's all you notice for a moment or three.
The headlamp switch/dip mechanism is rather peculiar.
Applying the handbrake needs a left arm like a gibbon's to avoid having to lean over.
The above said, it does cruise quite happily at 70-80 indicated.
It would be possible to get used to it.
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So you liked it then, FT? :-)
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It's a car. It works. It's a bit "different", but it works. About 32MPG average on this trip, which was mildly disappointing.
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As the owner of a 2002 Berlingo Forte, I found your thoughts interesting, FT. Thanks.
"Odd air vents."
You're right. Unlike Ford ones, which will point air in any direction, Berlingo ones are rather limited.
"Seat won't go back quite far enough."
Again, fair comment. But it could be worse.
"Sliding doors quite "heavy" in operation."
They can be decidedly sticky, and do tend to deteriorate with age.
"The brakes are rather sharp".
Never noticed.
"There's a flippin' great pogo-stick spring under the accelerator".
Not on mine there isn't. But there was in the new one I drove as a hire car in France - if this is what you are talking about: tinyurl.com/yynhwd8
"There seems to be a slight delay (about 1/5 sec) between pressing the hooter "button" and a noise being produced."
Not on mine there isn't.
"There's nothing under 1,500 RPM.
There's no "extra" above about 3,000 RPM.
If you want to move off sharply, think carefully and floor it, first doesn't go up far."
I've never driven the 1.9 diesel - so cannot comment except to say that according the the power and torque curves Citroen provides, torque peaks at about 2500 revs and then declines. However, power should keep rising to 4500 revs
"4th is easy to get if you're looking for second in a hurry."
Not on mine.
"No "gate" on reverse".
What's a "gate"?
"If you want to overtake, forget about it (unless lots of space available, then floor it and wait).
If you want to go up a hill, before you get to the bottom, floor it.
When I bought, I was never tempted by the 1.9 diesel :-)
"The most power seems available by flooring it and rollong off the throttle very slightly.
Going downhill, roll the throttle off a bit to prevent "excitable elephant" syndrome, especialli if it's bumpy.
When you floor it, the engine note changes and that's all you notice for a moment or three."
I see.
"The headlamp switch/dip mechanism is rather peculiar".
Different from a Ford, but not that strange.
"Applying the handbrake needs a left arm like a gibbon's to avoid having to lean over."
Never noticed. (And by the way, I'm not a gibbon.)
The above said, it does cruise quite happily at 70-80 indicated.
And when I was younger, I probably did cruise at those sorts of speeds. :-)
"It would be possible to get used to it."
But you clearly don't want to?
"About 32MPG average on this trip, which was mildly disappointing."
I would say "utterly dreadful". My Berlingo has 90,000 miles on the clock and has always done a lot better than that.
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>> "Odd air vents."
>> You're right. Unlike Ford ones which will point air in any direction Berlingo ones are
>> rather limited.
You can twist the whole thing around it its' socket, so that the "slats" will indeed point in any direction.
>> "There's a flippin' great pogo-stick spring under the accelerator".
>> ... if this is what you are talking about: tinyurl.com/yynhwd8
No, I was talking about the effort needed to press the pedal down! I have no idea what sort of device there really is - however, it does need pressing hard.
>> "There seems to be a slight delay (about 1/5 sec) between pressing the hooter "button"
>> and a noise being produced."
>> Not on mine there isn't.
Yes, it's odd. If I tapped the "horn" area firmly, this is indeed what happened - it was the same each time I experimented.
>> "There's nothing under 1 500 RPM.
>> There's no "extra" above about 3 000 RPM.
>> If you want to move off sharply think carefully and floor it first doesn't go
>> up far."
>> I've never driven the 1.9 diesel
Aha. Perhaps we're not talking about the same car at all. What have you got?
>> "No "gate" on reverse".
>> What's a "gate"?
A mechanism to avoid reverse being selected when in forward motion.
>> "The headlamp switch/dip mechanism is rather peculiar".
>> Different from a Ford but not that strange.
Why only Ford? I have not come across this mechanism before.
>> "It would be possible to get used to it."
>> But you clearly don't want to?
It works, one could get used to it. I wouldn't dismiss it out of hand. As with any car, one must expect a few foibles.
>> "About 32MPG average on this trip which was mildly disappointing."
>> I would say "utterly dreadful". My Berlingo has 90 000 miles on the clock and
>> has always done a lot better than that.
Perhaps yours has a different engine. Perhaps you're not always in a hurry, which I was on this day trip. Perhaps you don't hold 75-85 on the motorway for 500 miles or so!
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Air vents:
OK - you were driving a 2003 post-facelift model - mine (tinyurl.com/37jx2dk ) is 2002, pre-facelift. Completely different dashboard.
effort needed to press the pedal down
Either mine is different, or I'm just used to it.
Aha. Perhaps we're not talking about the same car at all. What have you got?
1.6 petrol engine
headlamp switch/dip mechanism. "Why Ford?"
For years I've driven Fords, for Ford is the definition of normal for me!
Perhaps yours has a different engine. Perhaps you're not always in a hurry, which I was on this day trip. Perhaps you don't hold 75-85 on the motorway for 500 miles or so!
Yes, the engine is different, but it is, in theory, a less economical engine. Mine is supposed to average 38.2 mpg (combined) whereas the 1.9 diesel is supposed to average 40.9.
You're right. I'm not always in a hurry - I try to avoid hurrying. And I never, ever hold 75-85 on a motorway, these days. I usually mimse merrily away at under 70.
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 23 Apr 10 at 19:01
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>> There seems to be a slight delay (about 1/5 sec) between pressing the hooter "button"
>> and a noise being produced.
>>
Yes, I've notice this on some modern Citroens. I tought it was a legacy of the multiplex wiring, but I could be wrong.
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I bet the heavy accelerator action is caused by a sticky cable. A squirt of WD40 usually frees it. Basically the cable routing is rather long and prone to heat, which dries out the lining.
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Driving a Berlingo lent to me. - Runfer D'Hills
