Motoring Discussion > Chips in car keys used to log useage	Miscellaneous
Thread Author: Meldrew	Replies: 30

Sun 5 Feb 12 09:58   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Meldrew

Precis of report in ST. Insurance investigators and police have revealed that they are using data stored on car keys in criminal investigations. Smart ignition keys record the distance traveled on the last journey and the cumulative mileage. Renault and BMW have been installing this technology for the last 10 years. A man reported his car stolen; he handed the keys to his insurance company who were able to determine that it had been driven 1500 miles, after the reported theft, using the spare key = One year suspended prison sentence and 200 hours community service Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 10:03   Chips in car keys used to log useage - R.P.

www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e63-bmw-m6-forum-bmw-m6-convertible-m6board-com/146680-data-key-2.html That link tells you what BMW store on their keys. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 10:03   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Zero

Now let us get to the truth of that story In Renaults, the data is NOT stored in the key. The data can be stored in the Engine management chip and record what serial number of the key was used to start it., And its not been used for 10 years,. Last edited by: Zero on Sun 5 Feb 12 at 10:04 Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 10:15   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Meldrew

"Dealers can verify a car's mileage by putting the key in a reader to check whether the odometer has been altered" according to the report. As I don't own a BMW or a Renault I am not bothered one way or the other. Anybody who is bothered can check with their dealer. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 10:19   Chips in car keys used to log useage - ....

I believe BMW with MINI have the VIN and mileage in the key which is used when checking the car in for a service via what looks like the ignition slot in the car so the service desk know exactly which vehicle and what service they are dealing with. Not sure about all the big brother stuff in the key, onboard is a possibility though. Last edited by: gmac on Sun 5 Feb 12 at 10:20 Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 10:24   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Iffy

I covered a court case of a police officer accused of causing death by careless driving. It emerged the police vehicle - a standard Vauxhall Vivaro van - stored some details of its recent use. The crash investigator didn't want to say how or where the info was stored for fear of letting the cat out of the bag. But he did say many vehicles have this feature. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 10:28   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Lygonos

The case a couple of years ago where a drunk passenger was jailed for allowing his drunk wife to drive their jaguar leading to a fatal crash has evidence from the OBD system of the Jag showing it had been travellling well ove 100mph prior to the crash. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 10:29   Chips in car keys used to log useage - R.P.

Is there a link to the story ? Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 10:32   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Lygonos

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1244730/Businesswoman-killed-young-couple-drink-driving-113mph-jailed.html Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 10:39   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Lygonos

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/lincolnshire/8470541.stm Same story, in case reading the Mail makes your eyes bleed. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 10:42   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Meldrew

It was local headline news here when it happened; just South of Grantham on the A1. I had no idea that the data logging facility played a part in the case/outcome. Anything like this on your BMW bike Rob? Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 12:22   Chips in car keys used to log useage - R.P.

Don't know, I was told not to leave the key in the ignition when the bike was standing in the garage as it causes battery usage. It's going for a service in March I'll ask. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 10:41   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Iffy

This is the verdict: www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/local/stockton/4804252.Officer_cleared_of_girl___s_death/ Preceding reports of the same case under this search: www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/search/?search=death+by+careless+police+officer The recorded info was not hugely relevant to the case, although it did prove the officer had driven the van at 100mph about an hour before the crash. The prosecution used the evidence to seek to suggest the officer's driving that shift was generally reckless. There was also some other stuff about him being annoyed at being crewed with someone he didn't like, again in a bid to suggest he was not behaving calmly that night. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 10:45   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Lygonos

Many corporate vehicles can use GPS tracking to watch the activity of their employees - surely the Police are no different. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 12:07   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Roger.

The thin edge of the erosion of civil liberties wedge. Big Brother really IS here. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 19:03   Chips in car keys used to log useage - colino

BMWs have been storing the info for years dotted about the car and in the keys. Next time you see an ultra cheap BMW, have a look at the display below the speedo. The little asterisk in front of all the other info wont be a faulty pixel as the seller will claim, it tells you the mileage has been (badly) changed or the LCM/LKM, again badly, replaced. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 19:37   Chips in car keys used to log useage - movilogo

Can you ask to see what information is stored in your key under freedom of information act? Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 19:38   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Zero

you can pay your garage 35 quid for a diagnostic read, yes. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 19:50   Chips in car keys used to log useage - R.P.

Foreign private corporations have no FoI responsibilities. It's a public sector/government thing Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 20:19   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Old Navy

Do these data loggers record an ECU reflash in the case of a performance remap? Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 20:25   Chips in car keys used to log useage - sooty123

I don't think they would need a data logger, I think the ECU itself can tell the diagnostic computer at the main dealer if it's been messed about with. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Sun 5 Feb 12 20:51   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Bromptonaut

>> Foreign private corporations have no FoI responsibilities. It's a public sector/government thing Subject access request under Data Protection?. Might be complicated by definitions of personal data and who exactly is the data subject. www.ico.gov.uk/for_organisations/data_protection/the_guide/principle_6/access_to_personal_data.aspx Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 21:00   Chips in car keys used to log useage - R.P.

But not under FoI...! :-) Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 21:18   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Runfer D'Hills

What? Y'mean some geek with a laptop can now tell how you've been driving? Not right that, not right at all. Time was it was a proper sport, you just had to be more alert than Constable Plod and what's more they gave you a head start by painting fluorescent stripes on their cars and only requiring two O levels and an ability to finish a cross country run to get the job. If you got caught it was because either you were a rubbish driver or you weren't concentrating. Both of those examples might well be considered fair play, but this? Not right at all. Last edited by: Humph D'Bout on Sun 5 Feb 12 at 21:20 Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 21:25   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Old Navy

>> What? Y'mean some geek with a laptop can now tell how you've been driving? Not >> right that, not right at all. >> Especially if it is a police or insurance geek. :-( Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Feb 12 21:29   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Zero

Naf all to be found from the brains of my Lancer, it hasn't got one. The Merc on the other hand, that's a real grass. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 6 Feb 12 03:52   Chips in car keys used to log useage - idle_chatterer

I was kinda impressed when the BMW dealer put my key fob into a reader and told me what needed servicing from the condition based servicing. As someone who works in the 'technology industry' it perhaps should not have been a surprise..... I'm sure I read that the usage of launch control in BMW M models is also recorded and might be used in evidence against you. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 6 Feb 12 07:42   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Old Navy

>> I'm sure I read that the usage of launch control in BMW M models is >> also recorded and might be used in evidence against you. >> I read that too, It could be used to determine if severe condition servicing schedules should have been used if it comes to a warranty claim. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 6 Feb 12 08:26   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Zero

>> It could be used to determine if severe condition servicing schedules >> should have been used if it comes to a warranty claim. Its not relevant really, the BMW is useage based servicing and will take it into account, as long as you obey the servicing indicator they cant use that excuse. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 6 Feb 12 08:30   Chips in car keys used to log useage - Iffy

...they cant use that excuse... They will use any excuse to avoid paying a claim, particularly a large one. For 'car warranty' read 'insurance company'. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Mon 6 Feb 12 08:19   Chips in car keys used to log useage - IJWS14

FOI not relevant because YOU are holding it, it's your key. Edit Reply to the request about FOI act. Meant to press quote . . . Last edited by: IJWS14 on Mon 6 Feb 12 at 08:19 Reply to this message | Report message