www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-27116881
This interests me....because a lot of what I listen to I can't hear.
I have had a local company in to adjust my surround sound system.. and that helped noticeably..but I still have problems and have to keep playing things back.
Is it a common problem?..i.e. do people on here have the same problem?
I'm convinced my hearing is o.k...well it was the last time I had it checked.
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Certainly found it was a problem with that programme last night - turned on subtitles a few minutes after it started, and left them on.
Don't usually though - last time was for another BBC period drama IIRC. I think they go for 'moody', which seems to require mumbling.
Last edited by: Focusless on Tue 22 Apr 14 at 18:26
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No idea if it's helpful , but we have the same issue if we don't use the surround sound. Switch it though the TV or drop it down to stereo and it's awful. Switch back to 5.1 so you have
a dedicated centre speaker for dialogue and all is well again.
The more techy might be able to draw a conclusion from that. I should add this is all programmes, not the one mentioned.
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Not a new issue....
www.car4play.com/forum/post/index.htm?v=t&t=10544&m=239942
You'd think they'd be aware of it before transmission
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Yep - the guy playing Joss was the worst. First line was shouted at the top of his voice and the rest was indistinct mumbling. I guess my hearing is not what is was but I doubt whether anybody's is post 60.
Very moody production as you say with lots of purposeful galumphing across the moors and everyone competing to look the most sinister and filmed by the light of a 5 watt bulb.
Will try it again tonight with subtitles - it's a three parter I believe. It's not going to end well for the girl is it?
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We have no problem with news programmes, but dramas invariably need sub titles. Music in dramas and factual programmes is also a four star nuisance.
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As I went deaf, a decent surround sound installation did help. But you need a minimum of 5 speakers (4 doesn't work) and the quality, and match of the centre speaker is very important. So are the settings on all the sound channels - the individual levels need setting with a proper meter.
Regrettably, this programme was probably sound mixed by bright young things with super hearing, listening through super loud speakers, and taking no account of BBC internal guidelines about checking the sound mix is ok through cheap and cheerful speakers too.
There has been a huge amount of flak over the years for such things as well.
But, what doesn't help is the fact that hearing loss is not admitted, or even known about by the viewer. Something like 1 in 7 have a hearing problem according to the RNID and the older you get, the more likely it is.
You do lose high frequency hearing, in ones teens, a girl may hear 20kHz, and a boy 18kHz and from there, it's a steady slope downhill.
Last edited by: Slidingpillar on Tue 22 Apr 14 at 19:58
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SP - slight thread drift. I have an interest in hearing loss...I was wondering whether your hearing loss was sudden. You've alluded to it in Computers....understand if you don't want to discuss it ? I have a problem with hearing in one ear. Doesn't seem to be getting worse but....
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>I have a problem with hearing in one ear.
Is it the side where Mrs R.P. usually sits?
I have that gift too ;-)
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SP - slight thread drift. I have an interest in hearing loss...I was wondering whether your hearing loss was sudden. You've alluded to it in Computers....understand if you don't want to discuss it ? I have a problem with hearing in one ear. Doesn't seem to be getting worse but....
Hearing loss was gradual, due to nerve condition. Probably first wore hearing aids circa 1995 and last wore different ones in early 2010. Totally deaf really from then on.
I'll not elaborate further. I do however have a good understanding of the problems faced.
Last edited by: Slidingpillar on Tue 22 Apr 14 at 21:04
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I'm pretty happy that my hearing is good having had regular tests over the years through working in noisy environments but I have to agree I too suffer from not being able to hear the dialogue clearly through some programmes. It's not a volume issue as that doesn't make much difference.
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We watched the ( recorded ) Tommy Cooper tonight and we both had some trouble with him......but it was probably the way he spoke. The others were OK.
Then SWM watched Jamaica Inn while I dozed. She, too , complained about the sound and she can hear the clink of a bottle and glass from 500 yards ! We use a soundbar, which is a lot better, especially for me. I think the trouble with the telly is that the sound is projected into the corner of the room. This is noticeable on the kitchen/diner telly which is mounted on a wall bracket and can be swung either way........... Normal watching volume can be very loud when you go ' behind ' the thing.
I've had a hearing aid in my left ear for a couple of months now and it really makes a difference. I got referred by my GP...firstly to Specsavers. I wasn't not having none of that so I got another referral to the NHS and got superb free service. It's only one road away as well, which is a big help.
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SWMBO moaned about this and turned on the subtitles. She then gave up around halfway though.
She subsequently told me not to bother about recording the rest, as it wasn't anything like the book!
Perhaps some one should tell the beeb there's numerous other channels out there.
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>>
>> Perhaps some one should tell the beeb there's numerous other channels out there.
>>
She can't hear you, there's a problem with the volume adjustment of her hearing aid.
I SAID " WE'RE GOING TO SCRAP THE LICENCE FEE, AUNTIE !"
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With the exception of BBC Parliament, all BBC proper channels subtitle 100% of their programmes. Not sure what the figures are for ITV, C4 and 5 but they are pretty good.
The new arrivals though, appear to subtitle no output and rely on the fact the subtitling obligation imposed by Ofcom for digital channels starts at zero and slowly increases per year of broadcast. What is galling though is the repeats of old US shows which are available with subtitles if one buys the DVDs (eg MASH) but not on their broadcast.
Last edited by: Slidingpillar on Wed 23 Apr 14 at 13:39
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>>old US shows which
>> are available with subtitles if one buys the DVDs (eg MASH) but not on their
>> broadcast.
>>
That's for translating from the American of course.
English broadcasts in England shouldn't need subtitles.
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>>English broadcasts in England shouldn't need subtitles
They do, as few actors can articulate clearly nowadays. I am hard of hearing and if there are no subtitles, dramas are seldom worth my watching. Pre-about 1950 material is fine from this point of view, British or American.
Not all DVDs have subtitles. Those that do usually make them hard to activate.
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That's for translating from the American of course.
English broadcasts in England shouldn't need subtitles.
So on Planet Cliff Pope us deaf can lump it? Charming!
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>> So on Planet Cliff Pope us deaf can lump it? Charming!
>>
I'm sorry SP, I hadn't meant to cause offence, just being thoughtless.
I'm thinking of subtitles as purely devices for watching films in foreign languages.
I do apologise.
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I though they' followed the book fairly closely although I seem to remember that the vicar was an albino in the book. I suppose albino actors are few and far between.
A lot better than the Hitchcock film version which even Hitchcock didn't like much.
Sound was much better in last night's episode so the BBC have listened and acted on the criticism
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Anybuddy had any dealings with powerdirect.co.uk ? I'm thinking of buying a Panasonic SC-HTB65EB-K 90W Soundbar from them so I can hear Jamaica Inn :)
£140 from Amazon but powerdirect hazzit for 100 sovs.
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Sometimes they seem to deliver but this story is all to familiar for them, perhaps as they seem to order the item from a 3rd party only after they have taken your money...
>>>Ordered and received an email stating delivery would take 10-15 business days and yet >>>after 18 business days I chased to find that they could not get hold of the item. Worst >>>aspect is having to wait 2 weeks on top of that for a refund.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Wed 23 Apr 14 at 15:45
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Cheers Fl, how's about this one then: tinyurl.com/lay9quy (the Bay)
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Cheers Fl, how's about this one then: tinyurl.com/lay9quy (the Bay)
Well good feedback... why not ask a random question to test their attitude?
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Given 100 sovereigns are worth about £19000 today, I'd go with Amazon.
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Frowny 4 you Dipstick.
;-)
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Ta. There's a first time for everything.
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I bet you say that to all the girls.
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>> Well good feedback... why not ask a random question to test their attitude?
Good point, thanks Fl ... I received a reply from powerdirect:
Thank you for your enquire we have very limited stock
This is a brand new product with a 12 months guarantee
If you place your order today delivery would be Thursday/Friday
>>£99.95 at Argos.
I cee'd that CG, but they are silver, and the black ones sound better ;)
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Apparently they knew something was wrong early in the broadcast, but "it is not possible to make adjustments during transmission".
Then why didn't they stop, flash up a brief apology, and start again? Like in cinemas when the film broke.
The delay wouldn't have been important. They never care about disrupting everybody's viewing schedules because a sacred sports event is over-running.
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"Like cinemas when the film broke"
No film anymore and no projectionists. It's all digital now.
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>> "Like cinemas when the film broke"
>>
>> No film anymore and no projectionists. It's all digital now.
>>
I know that. I was recalling the old days, when despite breakdowns, man was the master of his technology.
Anyway, the BBC has now apparently changed its tune, and blames the actors for poor diction.
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>> Anyway, the BBC has now apparently changed its tune, and blames the actors for poor
>> diction.
Well, yes, but isn't it the producer/director's(?) job to make sure they use good diction?
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>> >> Anyway, the BBC has now apparently changed its tune, and blames the actors for
>> poor
>> >> diction.
>>
>> Well, yes, but isn't it the producer/director's(?) job to make sure they use good diction?
Although even then I guess it can all be messed up post-production when the sound is mixed.
As I understand it most of the sound you hear in he finished product, including the dialogue, does not come from the same time/place as the visuals, at least for outdoor locations. Is that correct?
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>>Is that correct?
Sometimes, but it varies.
Typically each scene is shot a number of times with only one person's voice being recorded each time. And usually different camera positions being used.
So, for example, if A&B are talking then A's audio will be recorded and with a camera peering over B's shoulder. Then the scene will be repeated recording B's audio with the camera peering over A's shoulder.
The video & audio will then be mixed and matched back at base by the editor, together with any audio re-recording and other video shots, to achieve the result required by the director.
Last edited by: No FM2R on Thu 24 Apr 14 at 14:36
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This rather reminds me of the "Green Woman" story from Star Trek. I'm on dangerous ground here, not being a trekker, and I expect some wannabe pointy ear will berate me soundly for getting it all wrong, but to the best of my recollection;
The story required a green woman, dancing. The scene was shot (it may have been the pilot episode actually).
The rushes are shown, for all was on film in those days. Woman is not green. Director groans - they have to shoot it all again. Call goes to makeup department. More green!
It all gets shot again, the film comes back, she's still not green. Memos, mouth frothery, demands for imports of special green makeup to be slathered liberally over the poor actress.
After an iteration or two further, it's discovered a young guy in the film processing lab is looking at the film, saying "well, I dunno, there must be something wrong with their lighting cos this poor old biddy is coming out all green. But I can correct that..."
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Article was doing well until it said:
Executives claimed that once the broadcast had started there was no way to rectify the fault. That’s nonsense: they could have halted the programme, made an apology, fixed the sound levels and restarted.
Which is utter codswallop. The whole sound mix has to be redone, and a new one produced. I don't know how many sound sources are used, but it will be quite a lot. Consequently, the process will take longer than the programme duration.
Article then degenerates further. Perhaps to fit the Daily Hate reader, something can't just be bad, it has to be super bad!
Last edited by: Slidingpillar on Thu 24 Apr 14 at 09:29
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Startling insight from BBC director General Lord Hall last July - "you have to remember that you have an audience".
www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-27142035
:)
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The first review on imdb includes most of what I said to the boss while watching it (I got no thanks for my real time review)
www.imdb.com/title/tt3098842/reviews?ref_=tt_ov_rt
The town scenes were shot in Kirkby Lonsdale - I wonder if legacylad can spot himself lurking.
www.wildcardwalks.co.uk/photo-galleries-film-jamaica-inn.html
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No doubt they will or will have flogged this around the world. They will surely remaster the sound fully or even re-record some of it.
It can't really the the fault of the actors - they have a director and sound recordists on these things, if they mumble it's either because somebody wanted mumbling or they weren't told to do it differently.
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Even with the sound issues, I did enjoy it - there are certainly worse things to watch on TV. Made a change from Downton Abbey anyway :)
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T.V. sound issues - Focusless
