We have an on-going problem of people cutting across our front garden.
We have lost about £20 worth of plants in the last year and the grass has worn away, even though we are bordered by a footpath, so its not that there isnt provision for pedestrians.
First question is, are people allowed to trample your plants because they are near a footpath and also, are they allowed to permit their dogs to do their business on peoples front lawns?
The problem is, before we moved in, the front lawn was just that, completely open aside from one shrub, but we have planted various plants and small trees that we had in pots previously and then on seeing that one had been snapped in half and others had damage, we planted 6 box hedging plants around the border - 4 of these were trampled on and died.
Ive now replaced them with bright yellow/green conifers which are the horticultural traffic cones - you cant miss them.
Second question, any suggestions for disuading people from cutting across which dont involve fencing as convenants prevent that?
You can create a border or a hedge, but not a fence. Im wary of making it look like a 'keep off my land' gesture although I find the disrespect irritating.
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Plant mature bushes (about 3 feet high)
Does posts connected by a chain count as a fence?
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Relace the hedging with pyrocanthus - once grown it will not be trampled!
How about a single wire 'electric fence ' to discourage the dogs?
A few well placed boulders with irregular shapes should deter casual walkers until the plants become established.
Last edited by: pmh on Mon 14 Mar 11 at 16:54
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>> Does posts connected by a chain count as a fence?
That's what I would recommend. That and/or something like Berberis vulgaris.
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Do it anyway. Ruddy Peasants.. get orf my land. I was about to list a Baseball bat on flea bay, but I'd rather donate it to someone who has a good use for it!!
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So you're on a corner?
What are the conditions of the restrictive covenant, and is there anyone to object?
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Yes, ill take a pic later.
People may object, the person with the offending dog ( we have caught them including finding the dog in our back garden ) is a jobsworth and a sour face old bag ( doesnt look dissimilar to her dog ).
Another element is that the local kids, some anyway, tend to ride their bikes across and Im rather concious that if we put something too obvious and they injure themselves, we could get in trouble.
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>> old bag ( doesnt look dissimilar to her dog ).
Owners always look like their dogs. Fifi is of course sleek and gorgeous.
>> Another element is that the local kids, some anyway, tend to ride their bikes across
>> and Im rather concious that if we put something too obvious and they injure themselves,
>> we could get in trouble.
No if you make it obvious you wont get into trouble. Its when its not obvious but there you get into trouble.
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Nice big berberis darwinii hedge that is trimmed on the boundary line. Or one of the meatier pyrocantha. Serious ouchies.
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Make sure, by constant watering that your front garden is always a muddy morass.
OR Dig up the garden and replace with a pond perpetually full of stinking water.
OR buy a Rottie and keep it (a) hungry and (b) on a chain just long enough to keep it within the boundaries of your front garden.
Here endeth today's silly suggestions.
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Junkyard dog on a chain is the best to date. :-)
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>>Junkyard dog on a chain<<
My wife is doing a pretty good impression already - she was poised to start yelling at the woman last time her dog was in our back garden and apparently they exchanged evil looks today :-)
i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee119/stunorthants/Garden/SDC10446.jpg
i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee119/stunorthants/Garden/SDC10445.jpg
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The best way is by planting an outer ring of robust and thorny shrubs of a reasonable size and planting your more delicate plants on the inside protected by these shrubs. This is what councils do. If you have a flat area of grass on a corner people will always cut the corner and use it as a dog's toilet. Posts and chain is no good as kids will stamp on it and break it.
Some good suggestions for tough plants already but would add.
Sea Buckthorn - v good in dry areas
Rosa Rugosa
Japanese Barberry - Bereris thunbergiii
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i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee119/stunorthants/Garden/SDC10445.jpg
That's one sorry looking Christmas tree in the middle of that lawn.
I see you've already made a start on growing a hedge though, with those two little light green trees - good effort!
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Thats a Monkey Puzzle - they grow slowly, that one was in a pot for about 3 years, in ground for one, plus the frost nipped it a little this year, but its tough plant, should wake up this year - now that thing hurts when it gets you - planting it was a bit ouchy but I adore it as one of natures flamboyant flourishes.
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MIL in similar situation although on a slight bend and not a corner. Several folk on her estate have erected fencing as opposed to walls and I believe there was/is some sort of covenant in place. No complaints so far. Oh! Lord how I hate peasants.
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Next time the offending mutt is in your garden take it to the dog rescue center as a stray.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Mon 14 Mar 11 at 17:36
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Id not thought of thistles, I like it.
I have a Berberis in a pot out the back, not sure the variety. Im going to end up with a spikey jungle out there at this rate. Gonna make mowing the lawn fun :-)
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If you are allowed to plant a hedge then it would have been better to plant a robust species hedge all the way round making you intention very clear... which it isn't at the moment. Double width staggered planting is best to get a good start.
As an aside in our very early stages house hunting I'm very wary of taking on an open plan front. I'm used to knowing folks have to cross a boggy dyke first to get to us.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Mon 14 Mar 11 at 17:58
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I know it sounds old-fashioned, but i was brought up to believe its darned rude to go tramping across peoples lawns - I dont even do it when I go to clean peoples cars, so maybe I was a bit naive to think people wouldnt do it to my lawn.
Off to garden centre tomorrow unless work is busy to see what we can pick up, then ill plant them under cover of darkness :-) Come morning, it will be a spikey Sherwood Forest.
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>> As an aside in our very early stages house hunting I'm very wary of taking
>> on an open plan front.
But you can park lots of cars and "projects" on the front.
I'm used to knowing folks have to cross a boggy
>> dyke first to get to us.
Wait long enough and the house will float over to meet them.
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>> As an aside in our very early stages house hunting I'm very wary of taking
>> on an open plan front. I'm used to knowing folks have to cross a boggy
>> dyke first to get to us.
What's her real name?
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>>>But you can park lots of cars and "projects" on the front.
Actually that's Stu's best bet... I reckon he could just about get an old Mondeo with no MOT and a small caravan on there.
And don't get me started on the fen dykes... they're a breed apart.
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>> with no MOT and a small caravan on there.
TBH I am surprised he hasn't woken up to find wrecked cars, a bonfire, a heap of old tarmac, 10 dogs, 5 scruffy ponies, three transits and caravans on there anyway.
Last edited by: Zero on Mon 14 Mar 11 at 21:24
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I would run a low post and chain fence along the side of the path, with a short stretch at right angles leading to the bush on the corner.
Leaves the area open, but turns it into a no through route, certainly for cyclists.
Add a bit more planting, as others have said.
Not worth worrying about the covenant.
Most unlikely anyone will attempt to enforce it, and even if they do, you'll not go to prison.
Worse way you will have to remove the fence.
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2 or 3 strategically placed IED's should get the message across.
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I agree with Iffy about the covenant. I've got one on my property and after a discussion with the council planning department, they agreed they have no power whatsoever to enforce it.
The only time it may cause a problem would appear to be if you're in breach of the covenant when you sell the property. Then the worst that may happen seems to be the buying solicitor may flag it.
I reckon you could build a brick wall if you wanted.
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Well my ultimate plan is barbed wire with a watchtower and machine gun, but apparently the council take a dim view...
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They're mostly dim. Dimmer than a TocH lamp to be sure.
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>> Well my ultimate plan is barbed wire with a watchtower and machine gun, but apparently
>> the council take a dim view...
You would have to change your handle again.
Say ObersturmbanngruppenführerIggypop
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Or maybe just Shootzeeinfidelschisse
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>> The only time it may cause a problem would appear to be if you're in
>> breach of the covenant when you sell the property. Then the worst that may happen
>> seems to be the buying solicitor may flag it.
>>
>> I reckon you could build a brick wall if you wanted.
>>
My home is on a corner like this and has lawns to the front. The Close of which it is part has covenants against fencing or walling the front lawns in. However, the previous owners did build low brick walls all around the front lawns. It was pointed out by solicitors at the time of purchase and they banged on about some kind of indemnity or other. I didn't buy any indemnity insurance.
But I couldn't give a monkey's and I'm certain nothing will ever happen. Ironically though my wife wants the walls removed. I don't as I don't want to be the one picking up other people's dog's doings from the lawn.
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What you need, to dissuade the humans at least, is a continuous boundary of something awkward to step over - either 18"-high boulders or similar height (and width) dense thorny shrubs. They're cutting through your garden to save time, even the mouth-breathers will manage a quick mental calculation on the fly and decide that the route around the perimeter will be less hassle.
A post-and-chain fence wouldn't last two minutes, you need something that couldn't be flattened with one kick.
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Plant a lavender border. Lavender Hidcote plants are cheap, grow quite bushy up to about 30 inches high, need very little care or watering and smell quite pleasant.
In summer it will be covered in bees as an additional deterrent.
tinyurl.com/6dgyqnn
Kevin...
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Im thinking I may just fill the entire area with shrubs and spikey things, its a sod to mow that slope anyway.
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>> Im thinking I may just fill the entire area with shrubs and spikey things, its
>> a sod to mow that slope anyway.
That what I would do - It will look a lot better too.
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Then you'll have cats using it instead of dogs :(
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The weather's changing...stick in a sprinkler, set to just not wet the pavement and turn on the tap when you see an offender....from a hidden vantage point !
Small Leylandii grow quickly. We have one in the front that had a ' max height 6ft ' on it. It got to about 8 feet then stopped. Easy to trim back at that height with secateurs and keep neat.
I can see why the dogs problem but why on earth do people want to walk across a grassed area that might be wet or uneven when it really has no time advantage over the pavement at that sort of distance ? Apart from being rude, it's a civil trespass.
Capability Ted
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>>>why on earth do people want to walk across a grassed area that might be wet or uneven when it really has no time advantage over the pavement at that sort of distance ? Apart from being rude, it's a civil trespass.
Agreed but at the root of this is open plan fronts... I hate a housing area designed like this. Some of the places we've looked at recently would need the plans out to say where one *garden* ended and the next started. They end up with the lawn bits having some arbitary line where one persons mowing stops and if next door don't care it looks terrible.
I have a similar phobia of shared drives.
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The house search is going well then. Do we need to call Phil or Kirstie yet?
Last edited by: Zero on Tue 15 Mar 11 at 08:54
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>>I have a similar phobia of shared drives.
And wheelie bins.
:-)
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>>>I have a similar phobia of shared drives. And wheelie bins.
At least I'd be able to give Kirstie and Phil a good list of negatives.
Shared drives, open plan fronts, wheelie bins, sat dishes, caravans, vans, trucks, pampas grass... sight of any of these nearby and it's a drive straight past.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Tue 15 Mar 11 at 09:16
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>>I have a similar phobia of shared drives<<
How about wives :-D
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Stu, while a hedge of a spiny plant like Berberis or Pyracantha (or even Hawthorn) has its advantages in terms of discouraging trespass, it does have one slight disadvantage. You will have to trim it and deal with the spiny trimmings. I must confess that my experience of trimming holly and Berberis left me with the strong aversion to having spiny shrubs in my garden. I pulled out our Berberis thunbergii and our Berberis × ottawensis for that reason. (While I've never had a Berberis darwinii, I don't find them so bad.)
Plant a hedge, by all means, but consider whether you really want a spiny one. (If you do want a spiny one, Berberis × ottawensis would probably do the job very well.)
Last edited by: tyro on Tue 15 Mar 11 at 09:17
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Before you plant a hedge it might be worth checking whether there are any public services underneath. I planted a hedge at our last property and after a few years the electricity board dug up 6 of the plants to enable them to repair a connection to a property on the other side of the road. And don't plant a hedge right on the boundary ~ allow for the eventual width of the hedge.
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"And don't plant a hedge right on the boundary ~ allow for the eventual width of the hedge."
Very wise words- Why do people plant trees and shrubs that will grow up to six or eight feet wide 6 inches form their boundary. Sooner or later it will either mean the shrub being pruned into a misshapen mess or at worse a dispute with the neighbour
Last edited by: CGNorwich on Tue 15 Mar 11 at 10:11
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Holly is an alternative which is green all year and spikey and horrible. Or Pyracantha with lots of berries and thorns 2cms long capable of deterring men in armour...and the berries look lovely: yellow and red and...
If your winters are warm enough, try a large chain of cactus... No dogs will foul your lawn , nor will cats..You do, however, need thick gloves and great care when pruning or collecting needles...
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Of course, if you want a really professional fencing job done, I'll give you my next door neighbour's details.
He removed a sectional garage which formed part of the boundary and ' erected ' a fine 20ft of fencingin the gap that blends in very well with the expensive, top quality concrete post and base fence I had done a few years earlier.
Pity he just didn't quite manage to get it straight, level or vertical. Zoom to see how well it sits on the concrete and how beautifully that little infill panel is level with the rest !
tinyurl.com/6x4g25b
Still, mustn't grumble, he's down to his last half million and there's only 20 ft of it before my fence starts again !
Sarcastic, annoyed mode over !
Ted
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>> Of course, if you want a really professional fencing job done, I'll give you my
>> next door neighbour's details.
At least he put something there to fill the gap; many wouldn't have bothered.
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...At least he put something there to fill the gap; many wouldn't have bothered....
Perhaps it was living next door to Ted that did it. :)
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>>Pity he just didn't quite manage to get it straight, level or vertical
Perhaps he didn't want to disturb the 'rustic' quality of the level of the paving slabs? ;>)
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We've got a couple of Pyrocantha bushes here at Spamcan Towers, they do look nice with the berries on, and they are very effective as a barrier, but they don't half grow...and keep growing; so they're quite high maintenance in that respect, especially as the thorns are really really hard and really sharp!
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Pyrocantha is a favourite here. Seems to thrive on our soil and is resistant to wind. Does need a trim 3 times a year but that's no problem. Not many folks are going to hedge dive into it by choice.
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I've got something very, very spikey in my back garden. It has been grown in to a tree shape, rather than a bush, it is now about 8-9 feet high and has huge amounts of small orange berries, which appear in clumps in summer and are still in evidence now.
What is it? Is it a kind of pyrocantha? I know that when I trim it (twice a year) I need seriously heavy duty gloves.
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apps.rhs.org.uk/advicesearch/profile.aspx?pid=431
Does it look like this? Doesn't sound like pyracantha.
John
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Yes, the berries and branches look exactly like that, but my examples have been trained to grow in to a tree shape, which I can walk beneath.
I'll get some photos of it when I get home. I'm starting to think that a lot of maintenance went in to growing them (I've got two) into that form. They expand very quickly and it's a right pain in the posterior to trim the tops if I let them go too mad. Telescopic shears only just do the job. I think I'd better get at them this weekend, actually.
But they are hugely painful if handled carelessly, so for stu's border I'd think they're ideal.
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I've just been out and photographed my bush ;-)
This is what Pyrocantha looks like this time of year, complete with one of those oh so painful thorns:-
tinypic.com/r/2lmrjn7/7
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Could be a Mahonia.... We have one in our garden which is very spiky indeed , bit like a holly leaf .......
Anything like this Alanovic?
tinyurl.com/5wwvu37
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Nope. I've got some of that (with the blue berries) in a big pot elsewhere.
My trees are defiantely the same as those in Tooslow's link. I'll post some piccies tomorrow if I can.
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nice stout 3 ft hedge all the way round, we are on a corner of a close with a foot path and suffered the same thing till the hedge went up.
As for the muck, we suffered with cats ! only because we dont have a cat or dog so our garden got used as a toilet. I fiited up CCTV one that only records with a sensor, infared as well so brilliant at night ! filmed which cats were fouling and just dumped the dumps on the door steps of the offending houses . After a few weeks the message has got through and pleased to say no more. Sadly I kept a screen print of each cat that left its calling card so if a neighbour was offended by a dump on their door step I had the proof. The strangest thing of all is that 2 neighbours have got rid of their cats !!!!! funny that. Obvioulsy didnt like their cat dumping on their own door step !
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>> Nope. I've got some of that (with the blue berries) in a big pot elsewhere.
>>
>> My trees are defiantely the same as those in Tooslow's link. I'll post some piccies
>> tomorrow if I can.
Sounds like it could be Pyrocantha. You can grow this stuff into any shape - tree, hedge, arch e.t.c. We have an inexhaustable supply of it at the depot, a favourite choice of the council to deter the oiks from trespassing. It can have red, orange or yellow berries. If it's maintained properly, it can be rather attractive, especially in the winter. And it's very hard to kill it - a real stalwart.
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...And it's very hard to kill it - a real stalwart...
It must be, I have one at the front of Iffy Towers which I've hacked at over the years in a clumsy attempt to keep it under control.
The branches are near to collapse under the weight of the berries.
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Yer tiz:
s1192.photobucket.com/albums/aa332/alanovich/Plants/
Apologies for the dreadful photos, I haven't a clue around cameras and this was done with my camera phone. Which is allegedly the best camera phone on the market (Nokia N8). even so, I still manage to take rotten pictures.
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>> Yer tiz:
>> s1192.photobucket.com/albums/aa332/alanovich/Plants/
That's Pyrocantha, or I'll eat my hat...
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Looks like the the yellow berried form of Pyrocantha, probably P. Atlantiodes "Aurea'
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...Looks like the the yellow berried form of Pyrocantha, probably P. Atlantiodes "Aurea'...
Same as mine, although this one has been trained into an odd shape.
Nor does it look very healthy, it would have clumps and clumps of berries if it were fit and well.
My first thought would be to give it the kindest cut of all - at the trunk.
I'm sure the gardeners on here could recommend a replacement.
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>> Nor does it look very healthy, it would have clumps and clumps of berries if
>> it were fit and well.
It did have in in the early and mid winter. Absolutely gazillions. Then they all fell off and I swept them up. The plants are in a very shady spot between two houses and never get any direct sunlight.
I think they're healthy enough, going by the speed and amount of growth I have to trim several times a year.
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...Absolutely gazillions...
That does sound like a pyracanthus, although as others have said, it should have thorns, which are not apparent from the pics.
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Blame the photographer. I took the photos in poor light this morning, and the trees are in a dark passage in any case.
Believe me, the thorns are there. I bear the scars.
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>>
>> Believe me, the thorns are there. I bear the scars.
>>
Do they look roughly like the ones I posted about half an hour ago in my second picture?
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Oh yes. Those are the devils.
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I thought from your pictures it was a Rowan or Mountain Ash at first, Alanovic, but the leaves are not right for that.
Having looked more closely I think it's a Malus Golden Hornet.
Pat
Last edited by: pda on Wed 16 Mar 11 at 09:47
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I'm no gardening guru, but that looks rather different to my Pyrocantha at least, the leaf shape is different and there are no thorns I can see, so I reckon Pat's right.
My second attempt (sharp this time!) at showing Pyrocantha leaf & thorn shape:-
tinypic.com/r/2gtzz20/7
I'll ask SWMBO what flavour our Pyrocantha is when she's back home.
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Spam, it's absolutely covered in massive thorns. Believe me. It's just that I can't take a photo for toffee. I've stabbed myself many times when trying to prune it without really thick gloves on.
Last edited by: Alanović on Wed 16 Mar 11 at 10:29
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Pat,
I thought trees of the Malus family are crab apples - if so, they won't have leaves at this time of the year, let alone fruit.
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You're right of course Biggles and I had missed the fact that it has thorns too.
However, the leaves haven't got the same formation as a Pyracantha.
I trawled through all my old gardening books yesterday and can't solve this one....yet:)
Back to the detective work today but it's an enjoyable way to spend an hour or two and is producing some ideas for me next trip to the garden centre.
Pat
Last edited by: pda on Thu 17 Mar 11 at 05:06
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Hi Pat,
I'm pretty convinced that it's a pyrocantha now, I've seen quite a few online images and they match my plants exactly. Like I said, my photos are otrocious so I can see why you'd still doubt it.
I'd offer to post you a sprig for analysis, but I fear it'd be classed as a dangerous weapon!
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No no no, don't bother:)
I think we'll have to agree to differ on this one since I can't seem to come up with another answer but I will keep looking.
If it is a Pyracantha then someone has been very brave in pruning the side shoots some years ago to get it to grow as a tree!
Pat
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How about a couple of nice rose bushes to stop the people cutting the corner (preferably with a suitable amount of 'fertilizer' to give them a good start) and one of these for the dogs:
tinyurl.com/6bnferc
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MIL had a Pyrocantha by the boundary fence about 8ft from the house.
I had to cut a lot of it away to get my ladders in position to paint the gutters prior to selling the place.
It was absolutely vicious, it was all entangled with itself and the awkward shape of the branches meant it wouldn't go through the chipper. I wore industrial gloves and still got ripped to shreds. I ended up cutting it all up with secateurs to get it in the green bin.
I don't think I'd like it anywhere where kids or toddlers are active. One of those spikes could really damage an eye.
Ted
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Back to the orginal Post. I am afraid stu has missed his chance here, he should have dumped his old Ebay broken car pool on the front, blocking access.
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"he should have dumped his old Ebay broken car pool on the front"
or simply just dumped on the front garden
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I was thinking more along the lines of horses myself BBD but whatever makes them grow I guess. I've heard tiger poo is particularly effective in the urban environment.
Last edited by: Biggles on Wed 16 Mar 11 at 19:36
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Went with Berberis as the attack plant, two different varieties, just £3.99 each but I managed to get stabbed by them several times and I can testify to their teeth.
Also invested in a 5ft cedar which nobody is going to miss.
Several patches appearing where dogs are taking a leak on the front lawn so ive also gone with one of those water on animal deterrents. No idea if the stuff works but ive watered the perimeter and most of the lawn.
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>> >> Several patches appearing where dogs are taking a leak on the front lawn so ive
>> also gone with one of those water on animal deterrents. No idea if the stuff
>> works but ive watered the perimeter and most of the lawn.
>>
Let us know how effective that is, would you?
SWM is getting agitated about cats defecating in the flower beds.
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>> Went with Berberis as the attack plant, two different varieties, just £3.99 each but I
>> managed to get stabbed by them several times and I can testify to their teeth.
Excellent choice. They are evil. Keep them watered in dry weather for the first year to get them established, and they will then grow fast. Should do well in most types of soil.
>> Several patches appearing where dogs are taking a leak on the front lawn so ive
>> also gone with one of those water on animal deterrents. No idea if the stuff
>> works but ive watered the perimeter and most of the lawn.
You could try a sonic deterrent (dog can hear the irritating noise but humans can't) that works on movement, but if the owners there as well they might suspect something - also it could get nicked. I've got one for cats in the back garden and it works a treat. You could try pepper.
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We were having a bit of a cat problem, specifically a certain tomcat deciding to mark his territory round our gaff, the stink is awful.
Not for this particular reason but we got ourselves a Hungarian Vizsla (medium size pointer/hunter) yesterday and haven't seen a cat since...word soon gets round.
Hope the culprits get some sore bits when your plants become established Stu.
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>>we got ourselves a Hungarian Vizsla (medium size pointer/hunter) yesterday<<
Nice dogs gordon - not un-like the lighter coloured RR's ... he/she will be able to sniff out a bacon sarnie at 500 paces!
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Is this a pup or a grown dog Gordon?
Vizsla's can get a bit loopy and actually rather nasty if they are not well socialised, trained, taught their position in the pack, and most of all worked hard to calm them down.
Fabulous Fabulous tracking dogs, I had the pleasure of working one over a day old track, simply superb. Get a harness on it, a tracking trace, and the thing will be away naturally.
Your right about the cat, very high prey drive. Dont have any smaller pets around the house, it will mangle them. And small kids. They look like cats to a Vizsla.
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Wandering past a neighbour's garden I spotted this, which looks more like Alanovic's plant:-
tinypic.com/r/293ja0k/7
I'm fairly sure it's a Pyrocantha, will see if SWMBO knows what flavour.
Ted, one thing we've found with Pyrocantha + small kids is that because it grows so thick and entangled it's actually quite difficult to get stabbed by it unless you physically shove your hand into it quite hard. Whilst it's not inconceivable a child could do this it's a risk we took.
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We trimmed our pyrocantha at the weekend. The thorns are LETHAL, came though the heavy duty re-useable garden bags and all but the strongest gauntlets. Could be a problem to car tyres never mind my fleet of bikes.
As some clippings fell onthe neighbours side of the fence his drive got, gratis, the sweeping of it's life!!
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Nice pic, Spam. I'm planning on trimming mine this coming weekend (gulp). Perhaps I'll get some better piccies of the thorns and stick 'em online.
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Please do, I'm still not convinced:)
Pat
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Haven't read all this thread.
I'd think that if you put in a framework of canes to support your young pyracantha then you will achieve everything you want.
Fences may be verboten (nobody could ever enforce that anyway), but not canes to support your plants.
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I have it in my mind that our local council is quite relaxed, but I dont want to test their power to 'crush zee little people' with red tape over a fence, the world we live in today has no grey areas when the zelots get their notebook out.
Going with Berberis over Pyracantha, they seem to be cheaper and suited to the positioning once established. Im going to build up layers of plants across the front over time. Ill stick a few more in the summer.
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It wouldn't be your council enforcing it. A covenant in the deeds is generally only truly enforceable against the person who bought it from the person who put the covenant in.
And it would require somebody to want to enforce it. A few canes supporting your bushes do not constitute a fence.
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While your Berberis is growing and maturing, why not put a post and wire fence along one side of the problem area.
It won't stop the dogs, but at least, humans will opt for the pavement if they can't make the whole trip over your lawn.
Sharpened rustic posts and a couple of strands of fence wire stapled on...like wot farmers use.
Got to be cheapy, cheapy, cheap cheap and if anyone kicks off over the covenant, it's easy to rip out at short notice.
Ted
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What Im planning is to grow enough shrubbery and such to get myself one of those nifty 'look what this guy grew infront of his house' articles in the Mail :-)
Nothing says stay out like a jungle with a letterbox :-)
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>> Nothing says stay out like a jungle with a letterbox :-)
I thought that was what dobermans were invented for? :-P
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Well, its all good fun. The two conifers I planted are struggling - we have now witnessed that dogs are using them as a pee-post, so one is half-dead, the other nearly all the way, but Im watering and feeding them every 3 days and the half dead one is showing signs of new growth so it may pull through, the other, we shall see, its cheap to replace.
There is also a 4ft cypress on the corner now, cant miss that.
What ive also decided is that Im going to grow the grass in a 2 ft ring around the edge of the lawn and sprinkle it with wild flower seeds, see if anything takes. It will look like a natural physical barrier without actually being one.
Finally, was asked if the animal repellent works - it does not, so Im working on the neighbour repellent instead.
My wife and I witnessed the sheer cheek of the lady with the roaming dog stand and watch her mutt wander straight through our flower bed taking out several Primulas on the way. My wife did consider a short walk round to her well-tended front garden while she has her evening ciggy and going for a walk through this womans hyacinths, but I restrained her, tempting tho the notion is...
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I've got an old 5:1 step-down transformer. I used that to power a low-mounted wire around my veg patch. My cat and dog only had to experience it once with the power on for the wire to act as a permanent deterrent!
Want to borrow it?
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>>>I've got an old 5:1 step-down transformer<<
An old ignition coil ( 2000+:1 step up!) would be a lot more effective! The dog would really learn a lesson then - and you could always hope the owner had it on a lead.
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>> Well, its all good fun. The two conifers I planted are struggling
By the sound of it your conifers are on their way out. They will not have taken kindly to being peed upon before they're reasonably established. The problem is, they can look half-dead for a long time before they finally keel over.
Last edited by: Clk Sec on Thu 7 Apr 11 at 20:19
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I would have had a shout at that woman...outrageous behaviour !
I was up the ladder painting the front of the hovel when I saw a woman stop and let her dog do a big dump on the pavement outside......I shouted at her as she walked away and shamed her into coming back and picking it up...sadly for her, It looked as though she only had a small pack of tissues on her......hahaha, tough !
Ted
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Trees are not the answer to a problem with dogs.
Where do you think the expression 'like a dog in a forest' came from?
If you want conifers you need the horizontalis variety which will spread and provide dense ground cover which is attractive for the whole of the front garden.
Pat
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>>>Trees are not the answer to a problem with dogs.
No... neither is random planting. You need the continous hedge of pyracantha (or similar) to make it clear you are saying *keep orf my land*.... or move house.
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>> You need the continous hedge of pyracantha (or similar) to make it clear you are >>saying *keep orf my land*....
Agreed. That is your best option.
Last edited by: Clk Sec on Fri 8 Apr 11 at 07:18
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Looking at the pics for a 2nd time, you really are flogging a dead orse there,
I'd cover the area with a membrane, and put light Limestone chippings down.
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Would it cost much to hammer (maybe concrete the odd one in) a border of pointed angle irons into the ground, Hammerite painted unless you can find galvanised, then linked by a length of sturdy chain over knee height, then plant lots of the very good suggestions of nasty surprises behind.
Got to make the whole excercise of crossing your ground as unpleasant as possible.
Thread some barbed wire through the chain links and round the posts till the thorny anti yob stuff gets established, barbed might just upset a clumsy dog cocking it's leg.
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What Im trying to do is make it look like Im developing the front garden area rather than throwing up a barrier, so that one day, it just so happens its now blocked off.
We also have a path that runs round the front of the house, round the side to the back gate, but this also has a connecting path to the pavement, which Im sure is a visual encouragement to use it as an extention of the footpath. My intention is to slowly block that off by way of an archway which will become increasingly overgrown, bit of Russian Vine will see to that, grows like its going outta fashion.
Heres how its developed since the last photos. 3rd one is my lovely brown trees. Theres atleast 3 dogs up my close and having witnessed the neighbours lad letting their dog pee up someone elses bushes, I suspect that dog also has a part in this. Grr.
i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee119/stunorthants/Garden/SDC10469.jpg
i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee119/stunorthants/Garden/SDC10470.jpg
i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee119/stunorthants/Garden/SDC10471.jpg
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>>>Heres how its developed since the last photos.
It hasn't developed though has it Stu. You want to stop the dogs so you say then you ignore all good advice to plant a hedge that defines your boundary... then you plant exactly the type of thing a dog will be drawn to for a pee.... dog pee a few times a week will so likely defeat those midgets.
I'm a constructional gardener but my Mum is a superb shrub/veg/flower/gardener and garden planner. She'd have outed everything in that front except the big shrub by the drive, put in a very short post/chain or wire type fence then establish the prickly hedge on the same line.
Job done and objectives met.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Fri 8 Apr 11 at 11:26
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>>i234.photobucket.com/albums/ee119/stunorthants/Garden/SDC10471.jpg
Pull 'em out, Stu. They're past the point of no return.
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OK - I'm with Fenderlander, he knows his stuff!
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Here is broadly speaking what you might end up with Stu after loads of work going the way you've discussed... but it still doesn't stop people or dogs nosing about.....
tinyurl.com/3gky6z2 (streetview)
Whereas this short hedge does what you're asking...
tinyurl.com/3kj4zyy (streetview)
(NB: Random houses pictured)
Last edited by: Fenlander on Fri 8 Apr 11 at 12:21
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>> Whereas this short hedge does what you're asking...
>>
>> tinyurl.com/3kj4zyy (streetview)
>>
>> (NB: Random houses pictured)
Thats the ticket.
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The trees I planted werent to stop dogs. If you read up the thread you will see the other issue was people cutting across the lawn, which seems to have ceased, so thats phase one completed, which is what the trees were for - they do seem to work as the grass on the corner is recovering now.
The dog issue is another one for sure, but I havent yet got around to finding the spare cash to buy that many plants, could need quite a few to create an effective hedge, the three box plants in there are just visual markers.
Your confusing the two things although admittedly a hedge would also stop the ramblers, but as I said before, I dont want it to be too obvious Im putting a barrier up, they already think Im a recluse :-)
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We just found out a VERY interesting piece of info. The woman who has been letting her dog run riot through our garden and fouling our front lawn, the one we have witnessed first hand doing this, is none other than one of our local borough councillors!
The funny thing is, we didnt know till we got her parties blurb thro the door tonight and I looked at the picture and thought, could it be? Showed the wife, she thought the same and so I looked her up on local gov website and sure enough, the address matched.
Id rather like to 'stick it to her' politically somehow, but Im not sure how one would go about it. The irony and ammo if you will, is that part of their manifesto is tackling dog fouling and anti-social behaviour, of which I think letting your dog run off into peoples back gardens and leave mess is certainly that. She doesnt appear to be the main candidate on the leaflets, but Im not entirely sure how it all works.
I have the email addy of one of the main candidates and Im tempted to use that method, but what could I say to have any effect? Would anything?
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>> We just found out a VERY interesting piece of info. The woman who has been
>> letting her dog run riot through our garden and fouling our front lawn, the one
>> we have witnessed first hand doing this, is none other than one of our local
>> borough councillors!
>>
>> Id rather like to 'stick it to her' politically somehow, but Im not sure how
>> one would go about it. The irony and ammo if you will, is that part
>> of their manifesto is tackling dog fouling and anti-social behaviour, of which I think letting
>> your dog run off into peoples back gardens and leave mess is certainly that.
I think taking a photo of the fouling would be useful....
...not sure whether Id email it to her, or the local paper....
Actually.... do you have a lamp-post nearby? maybe worth producing a poster and sticking it on the lamp-post...
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Video, photograph, and the local paper.
Or you could email it to her first, and ask her for £1000 in exchange for the originals.
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Then you may not be around for a week or two to worry about your lawn...
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The opportunity arose today to talk to our local councillor ( there are two wards in our town, she perhaps wisely represents the other side of town ) who was canvassing.
I told him that I had considered voting for them until this issue arose and I then explained exactly what had been happening. He did seem genuinely outraged that supposedly someone on the same 'team' as him had been undermining their campaign and he did say he totally understood the impression it creates, what with dog fouling and anti-social behaviour being on their manifesto ( I think its pretty anti-social letting your dog run into peoples back gardens when they should be on a lead anyway ).
Anyway, he seemed like a genuine local man, didnt push any party politics on me, he even ofered up what other candidates were standing for which parties. He even called over the other chap standing for their party and explained what had been going on. They assured me they would have a quiet word with her, so we shall see, he thought she at the very least owed an apology and a change of behaviour.
I managed to catch their conversation as they walked away down the side of our garden and they seemed genuinely angry that she had been doing this ( doesnt help them locally at all ) so I had a chuckle to myself and the wife was most amused. The Lord works in mysterious ways, great timing.
Last edited by: KosaiIggypop on Sat 23 Apr 11 at 11:28
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Until after the election....
Pat
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>> Until after the election....
>>
Many a true word, some might say cynical, hammer and nail first hit i say....kerching.
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>>Until after the election....
You seem to be suggesting that our local representatives may be a tad less accommodating after the election?
Shame on you!
:)
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This might be too confrontational for you but...
In the mid 70s, when nobody picked up after dogs, there was a woman who emptied her dog almost daily, on the pavement, right by the gatepost at the end of my father's driveway. He'd already asked her not to do it but she made some silly comment about the dog having to go where and when it got the urge.
He told my mother he was going to collect it and post it through her letter box. Mum dissuaded him, thankfully.
Eventually he put the pile in a small box, and took it round to her house. He rang the bell, and when she answered he presented her with the box saying "this is yours. Please don't leave me any more". After that she walked her dog in the other direction.
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...he was going to collect it and post it through her letter box. Mum dissuaded him, thankfully...
Very wise - posting a noxious substance is an offence.
Presenting the poo in a box is probably not, and could be seen as a reasonable protest.
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As in doing a Sharon Osborne... mind you legend has it that it wasn't her dog's!
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A neighbour of ours had a similar problem back in the 80's. The dog from the house opposite had taken to using his front garden as a toilet, and despite numerous polite complaints this continued for several months until the offending items were shovelled up and placed on the dog owner's doorstep.
End of problem.
Edits to say; it must be breakfast time, again.
Last edited by: Clk Sec on Sun 24 Apr 11 at 09:27
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To prove my point that there are no bad dogs, just badly behaved owners there is a man in his 20's training with a whistle and exercising a large black and white young dog in the field behind us this morning.
The field is full of winter wheat....
Why do townies come and live in the country?
Pat
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So they can complain about the noise of cows, the smell of pigs, and farmers cutting hedges.
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"To prove my point that there are no bad dogs, just badly behaved owners "
Not really true is it? Certainly owners create bad dogs with a lack of responsibility for the animal and no training. Once an animal has been brought up badly and is out of control there is nothing to be done with it. If it is prone to attack people it is a bad dog and the only solution sadly is to put it down. I speak as someone who was badly bitten by an untrained guard dog that had escaped from its yard.
Last edited by: CGNorwich on Sun 24 Apr 11 at 10:05
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Thats very true.
Its all about the vital times from birth to 9 months. Socialisation of the correct kind is vital in those formative months.
You can take a badly behaved biting dog, and you can train it not to bite and behave in your presence, BUT once out of your control who knows.
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I think it is primarily down to the owners. The lady we have trouble with walks her dog without a lead in a residential area which is frankly irresponsible - she calls it but it pays only vague attention to her, so she doesnt even have the skills to call it to heal anyway.
Another of our neighbours has what appears to be a staffy cross, which on a weekly basis shoots out their front door and goes for a wander round the close. The owner, nice though they are, seem to have little understanding of how to call a dog which I find very irritating.
It went to pee on one of my trees and I called him away and he obeyed, she then called him which he ignored ( actually he wandered off in the opposite direction ), so I then called him to me and walked him back to her.
Now I was brought up around dog breeding so you learn alot about how to interact with them, but one thing anyone can learn is voice command, which the owners around here seem to lack, but it so basic, it begs belief that people cant manage it. Id be rather embarrised if my neighbour could control my dog and I couldnt.
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>>Not really true is it? <<
I thought that was what I said.
I'll try very hard to make myself clearer next time.
Pat
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OK.....you win, the patio and a glass of wine calls.
Much better than arguing the toss on here on a pleasant summer evening.
The wildlife doesn't have an argumentative nature!
Pat
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>> The wildlife doesn't have an argumentative nature!
>>
>> Pat
You what? its a killing ground out there.
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Stopping people ruining your garden - Zero
